Author Topic: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way  (Read 5866 times)

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Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #15 on: »
Thanks, that's what I'll use, but which option do I select to start representation

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #16 on: »
If you mean which ground of challenge, it would be that the alleged contravention did not occur.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #17 on: »
Unfortunately that's not an option. I've selected other and wrote the contravention didn't occur in the box
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Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #18 on: »
I've received the Notice of Rejection of Representation, I've attached the pages, but there is also a few pages with my Right to Appeal.

Their main point appears to be

Quote
The reasons for our decision are set out below, along with the options available to you at this stage.

You state that you do not believe your vehicle was parked causing an obstruction at the time the PCN was issued.
Although you may believe this to be true, our Civil Enforcement Officers (CEOs) act on behalf of the Council and as such are trained to issue PCNs only when they witness a violation of either, the Council's parking policy or the rules of the Highway Code. Your vehicle was observed on the footway in JOHN HARRISON WAY, obstructing access for authorised vehicles, as shown on the image, taken from Google, below, where the vehicle was parked in front of the removable bollards, which would prevent permitted vehicles from accessing the dropped kerb to get in or out.

Any help with my appeal would be appreciated.

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Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #19 on: »
This is complete tosh.
Quote
are trained to issue PCNs only when they witness a violation of either, the Council's parking policy or the rules of the Highway Code.
Policy is not law, neither is the Highway Code. What muppets !  Whether tosh like this would get the PCN cancelled at London Tribunals is another matter, of course.

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #20 on: »
"You state that you do not believe your vehicle was parked causing an obstruction at the time the PCN was issued."

What I stated was that I wasn't parked on the footpath. I wasn't issued the PCN for causing an obstruction!

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #21 on: »
Well as the discount has not been reoffered, it's a no-brainer to appeal to the tribunal. I recommend you log the appeal online at https://londontribunals.org.uk/ and ask for a personal hearing, when asked for a time and date, tick all the boxes.

The reason for this is that owing to staffing problems, the council is not presenting evidence in the majority of cases, and if there's no evidence then you win by default. By ticking every single hearing time this ensures the tribunal assigns the nearest possible time and date, so it gives the council less time to prepare its evidence pack.

If there is no evidence pack the hearing is cancelled as there's nothing for the adjudicator to consider.

If contrary to our expectations they do prepare an evidence pack, you can simply call up the tribunal and postpone the hearing to a convenient date (the tribunal staff can arrange up to two reschedules of up to 28 days each administratively), so you don't have to worry about not having time to prepare.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #22 on: »
Tribunals have got back to me with 2nd January as the date, but it says the authority probably won't attend.

Quote
We have sent a copy of your appeal to the Enforcement Authority. The authority is unlikely to
participate in the hearing. You should receive a copy of the Enforcement Authority’s evidence directly
from the authority at least three days before the hearing. If you have been issued a verification code
by the Enforcement Authority you may also view the evidence via the appellant portal on our website.

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #23 on: »
The authority seldom attend, but they don't have to. What they are required to do is supply their evidence, which they might or might not do.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #24 on: »
My hearing date is Wednesday 2nd.

I have received their evidence today. It has copies of PCN and all correspondence and this seems to be the relevant part.

Quote
At the time the PCN was issued the vehicle was not parked within the confines of a marked parking bay. The vehicle was parked on a vehicle crossover giving access to an area protected by lockable bollards to provide emergency access in the event of a fire. Prior to the PCN being issued further bollards had been erected in the area in an effort to prevent parking on the footway whilst maintaining the access to frontages for emergency vehicles.

The carriageway is actually set apart by the vented bricks to identify the kerb, in order to stop motorists blocking the access to emergency vehicles.

They have handwritten that the vented bricks are the kerb marking, but those vented bricks run along the whole road, which would mean all the parking bays were on the footpath.

Also there are no bollards behind where my car is parked stopping you from driving on the actual footpath, but it is clearly defined by the kerbstones.

Do I need to upload any more evidence, what do I say at the hearing?

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« Last Edit: December 31, 2023, 11:07:57 am by summer day »

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #25 on: »
Are you representing yourself?

1. There used to be a practice direction by the penultimate Chief Adjudicator, Martin Wood, which ruled that the case should be allowed if the council served their pack less than three days before the hearing.

2. If the adjudicator does not agree to allow on this basis - quote it verbatim - ask for an adjournment.

« Last Edit: December 31, 2023, 11:37:41 am by Hippocrates »
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #26 on: »
I would use something along the following lines:


Sir,
My constant argument in this case has been that I was not parked on the footway and that the edge of the carriageway lay behind my car and not, as asserted by the council, in front.

In their evidence the authority have captured this point and I refer you to their evidence(wherever it is e.g. page and paragraph) in which they state:

The carriageway is actually set apart by the vented bricks to identify the kerb, in order to stop motorists blocking the access to emergency vehicles.


I also refer you to the signed parking places along this road, each of which reserves an area beyond the 'vented bricks' for the parking of vehicles(utilising the alternative -to white lines- form of road markings permitted under para.2(3) to Part 5 of Schedule 7 to the Traffic Signs etc. Regs). In none of these cases does the traffic sign indicate that the area is situated on the footway, which would require the use of the sign specified for this purpose  at Item 4 in the Part  4 sign table in Schedule 4 to the Traffic Signs etc. Regs. I concluded and would still conclude that the traffic signs placed by the council indicate parking places placed on the carriageway and bounded by the 'vented bricks' on one side and kerbstones (laid flush with the footway and marking the edge of the carriageway to the rear. 

The configuration where I parked is exactly the same i.e. 'vented bricks' to the front and kerbstones to the rear. I therefore ask the adjudicator to accept that I was parked on an unrestricted length of carriageway and not footway.


2 (3) The bay may be varied to contrast, in pattern or colour, from the surrounding parts of the road and any adjoining bays, in which case the marking may be omitted.

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #27 on: »
Thanks, what about this in their statement "The vehicle was parked on a vehicle crossover" I think this admits its not footpath.

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #28 on: »
I will be representing myself. Do you have a link to this?

Are you representing yourself?

1. There used to be a practice direction by the penultimate Chief Adjudicator, Martin Wood, which ruled that the case should be allowed if the council served their pack less than three days before the hearing.

2. If the adjudicator does not agree to allow on this basis - quote it verbatim - ask for an adjournment.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2023, 12:11:59 pm by summer day »

Re: Greenwich - Code 624 one or more wheels over footpath - John Harrison Way
« Reply #29 on: »
http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=90145&pid=1267351&mode=threaded&start=100#entry1267351

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=87990

2160240979; 2170037563.

I am not aware that this direction has been superseded or not; but, I did represent a pepipoo member last year and asked the adjudicator to allow the appeal on this similar basis and was only offered an adjournment. In that case, I decided to carry on and won.  You must decide whether you are prepared enough to do this alone.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2023, 01:08:34 pm by Hippocrates »
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
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