3. Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #15 on: »
OK On Monday the 8th of July register your appeal with London tribunals in the box for evidence write only I rely on my formal representations and further details to be added

Ask for a personal appeal via teams and once you have a date and case number let us know and I will draft your appeal If i feel able i may represent you but do not want at this stage to make a promise i cannot keep due to health issues
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #16 on: »
Quote from: Pastmybest on June 26, 2025, 03:17:57 pm
OK On Monday the 8th of July register your appeal with London tribunals in the box for evidence write only I rely on my formal representations and further details to be added

Ask for a personal appeal via teams and once you have a date and case number let us know and I will draft your appeal If i feel able i may represent you but do not want at this stage to make a promise i cannot keep due to health issues

Much appreciated. I will proceed per your suggestion.
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #17 on: »
This case may be of some use to you.

Look up London Tribunals register of appeals for case    2130491073

The key bit of my successful appeal was the adjudicator's words:

Quote
Second, and more importantly the vehicle is still moving out of the box junction when the CCTV footage stops. The Adjudicator must see the entire driving of the vehicle in and out of the box junction. I find this to be a serious omission.

Now admittedly my "offence" was "stopping, if it be that, [which] is hardly perceptible."

OP stops for a reasonable period. But nonetheless the CCTV does not show him moving out of the YBJ and adjudicator Teper says this is "a serious omission".
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #18 on: »
Quote from: Pastmybest on June 26, 2025, 03:17:57 pm
OK On Monday the 8th of July register your appeal with London tribunals in the box for evidence write only I rely on my formal representations and further details to be added

Ask for a personal appeal via teams and once you have a date and case number let us know and I will draft your appeal If i feel able i may represent you but do not want at this stage to make a promise i cannot keep due to health issues

@Pastmybest I am looking to appeal this as per your suggestion. Sent you a private message for some personal details it needs
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #19 on: »
Quote from: Chaseman on June 26, 2025, 08:55:15 pm
This case may be of some use to you.

Look up London Tribunals register of appeals for case    2130491073

The key bit of my successful appeal was the adjudicator's words:

Quote
Second, and more importantly the vehicle is still moving out of the box junction when the CCTV footage stops. The Adjudicator must see the entire driving of the vehicle in and out of the box junction. I find this to be a serious omission.

Now admittedly my "offence" was "stopping, if it be that, [which] is hardly perceptible."

OP stops for a reasonable period. But nonetheless the CCTV does not show him moving out of the YBJ and adjudicator Teper says this is "a serious omission".

thank you @Chaseman. I will hopefully get an adjucator who looks at this aspect
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #20 on: »
I did not offer to represent you, I said i would write your appeal, This i will do, but you wil need to appear yourself.
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #21 on: »
Quote from: Pastmybest on July 09, 2025, 05:38:48 pm
I did not offer to represent you, I said i would write your appeal, This i will do, but you wil need to appear yourself.

Thanks, I have now submitted my appeal, awaiting acceptance.
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #22 on: »
Quote from: dad-taxi on July 10, 2025, 04:10:03 pm
Quote from: Pastmybest on July 09, 2025, 05:38:48 pm
I did not offer to represent you, I said i would write your appeal, This i will do, but you wil need to appear yourself.

Thanks, I have now submitted my appeal, awaiting acceptance.
let me know when you have it and a case number and i will write your skeleton
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #23 on: »
Quote from: Pastmybest on July 13, 2025, 04:32:01 pm
let me know when you have it and a case number and i will write your skeleton
[/quote]

Hello

I have a response from London Tribunals now. The hearing date has been set for 4th September at 1530 (via Teams).
The case reference number is 2250340861
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #24 on: »
Just seen this i will draft a skeleton in the next week or so
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #25 on: »
Quote from: Pastmybest on July 27, 2025, 04:03:18 pm
Just seen this i will draft a skeleton in the next week or so

Thank you . Much appreciated 👍
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #26 on: »
Please consider this too:

I make this collateral challenge against the validity of the PCN as it does not state mandatory information provided at 4.8.(v) of

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/section/4/enacted

which in turn refers to 4.8(iii). Therefore, the PCN is not clear in terms of when to pay - the word must state is expressed in the legislation, and must is different from should.  Furthermore, the statement under  What should you do? further exacerbates the issue and  conflates the two periods in any event.

Also, the YBJ is too large. And you stopped before the junction.

https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/kingston-opon-thames-31j-yellow-box-kingston-road/msg82995/#msg82995
« Last Edit: July 27, 2025, 10:39:35 pm by Hippocrates »
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IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #27 on: »
@Pastmybest I am available, too, if @dad-taxi wants representation. ;D The Tribunal now wants representatives to adduce their skeleton argument 14 days before the hearing.
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IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #28 on: »
Quote from: Hippocrates on July 28, 2025, 10:04:17 am
@Pastmybest I am available, too, if @dad-taxi wants representation. ;D The Tribunal now wants representatives to adduce their skeleton argument 14 days before the hearing.

My advice to dad-taxi would be have representation if possible ( I cannot commit at present) but if you take it on he would be well served (would you like my skeleton if so e mail me

Dad taxi if you wish to take up hippos offer send him a PM. He is an expert of long standing and is very good, adjudicators listen to him
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Re: Greenwich, Code 31 entering a box junction, Eltham High St SE9, Eltham Fire Station
« Reply #29 on: »
Thank you both. I'd obviously love to take up the offers for the write up and rep. I am deer in headlights here and any help is appreciated.

I'll login to tribunals and check if they allow adding a rep now (I said no when originally filling the form) but I'd 100% benefit from a write up. Again l really appreciate the pro bono community support here
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