Author Topic: Have 2 PCN's for the exact same location/contravention within ~10 minutes  (Read 1636 times)

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So this is the only letter I found that isn't the same as the others. I cannot find anymore at all.

Is not page 4 of 8 on the back of this (page 3 of 8)?
« Last Edit: June 10, 2024, 08:08:19 pm by cp8759 »

For what you have uploaded so far, it says page 1 of 8 and page 2 of 8.  So there are 6 more pages.  cp8759 has said not to include the tribunal pages which I think will probably be the last 4 pages.  So what's inbetween?  It may look like just standard wording to you, but the devil is in the detail and the guys on this website win so many cases on behalf of people based upon what is or is not included on those pages.  The more you share, the better.

Hi,

Is my most recent picture uploaded yesterday good enough?

Quote
So this is the only letter I found that isn't the same as the others. I cannot find anymore at all.

Is not page 4 of 8 on the back of this (page 3 of 8)?

Page 4 of that pic just has their signature
« Last Edit: June 16, 2024, 05:37:07 pm by cp8759 »

@nonPCNenjoyer well the penalty has now gone up to £130 so you should obviously appeal, as the penalty won't go up if you lose. I will drop you a PM if you would like to be represented. The only arguable point would seem to be an unlawful fettering of discretion, it's not much to go on but as you have nothing to lose it wouldn't make sense to give up and pay now.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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@nonPCNenjoyer well the penalty has now gone up to £130 so you should obviously appeal, as the penalty won't go up if you lose. I will drop you a PM if you would like to be represented. The only arguable point would seem to be an unlawful fettering of discretion, it's not much to go on but as you have nothing to lose it wouldn't make sense to give up and pay now.

"The only arguable point would seem to be an unlawful fettering of discretion"

What's this mean?

"The only arguable point would seem to be an unlawful fettering of discretion"

What's this mean?
@nonPCNenjoyer the notice of rejection says they're unable to cancel, but that's not ture: they are able to cancel and they're require to decide whether to do so or not. A detailed explanation is given in Susan Cook v Trafford Borough Council (TR 05993K, 25 January 2013) but at London Tribunals it's a bit of a mixed bag:

Nirakar Vaidya v London Borough of Newham (2130316200, 1 August 2013), won
Madeline Grace Dyett v Royal Borough of Kingston Upon Thames (2130497615, 5 December 2013), won
Krzysztof Burger v Royal Borough of Kingston Upon Thames (2190467973, 5 September 2019), lost
Simone Strauss v London Borough of Barnet (2130521902, 4 July 2013), won
Shaun Elliott v Royal Borough of Richmond upon Thames (2200264240, 24 August 2020), lost
Kuldip Gahir v London Borough of Redbridge (2230274618, 3 August 2023), lost

As you now have nothing to lose the argument should be made, you just need to decide whether you want to argue the appeal yourself or whether you'd like me to do this for you (in which case you need to act on the PM I sent you).
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

"The only arguable point would seem to be an unlawful fettering of discretion"

What's this mean?
@nonPCNenjoyer the notice of rejection says they're unable to cancel, but that's not ture: they are able to cancel and they're require to decide whether to do so or not. A detailed explanation is given in Susan Cook v Trafford Borough Council (TR 05993K, 25 January 2013) but at London Tribunals it's a bit of a mixed bag:

Nirakar Vaidya v London Borough of Newham (2130316200, 1 August 2013), won
Madeline Grace Dyett v Royal Borough of Kingston Upon Thames (2130497615, 5 December 2013), won
Krzysztof Burger v Royal Borough of Kingston Upon Thames (2190467973, 5 September 2019), lost
Simone Strauss v London Borough of Barnet (2130521902, 4 July 2013), won
Shaun Elliott v Royal Borough of Richmond upon Thames (2200264240, 24 August 2020), lost
Kuldip Gahir v London Borough of Redbridge (2230274618, 3 August 2023), lost

As you now have nothing to lose the argument should be made, you just need to decide whether you want to argue the appeal yourself or whether you'd like me to do this for you (in which case you need to act on the PM I sent you).

I'm kind of sus that you guys basically encouraged me to take this to court so you can take £30 from me to appeal :( Desperate people, seems predatory to me man idk

I'm kind of sus that you guys basically encouraged me to take this to court so you can take £30 from me to appeal :( Desperate people, seems predatory to me man idk
@nonPCNenjoyer firstly, I don't appreciate being told I'm predatory when I'm up till 1 am most nights helping strangers with their appeals.

Secondly, if I represent you and I don't win I get £0, so I don't see how that can be predatory. On the contrary I have every incentive to win and what I offer is cheaper than paying the penalty at the 50% discounted rate (and you'd already lost the 50% discount before you even came here).

Thirdly, you don't have to be represented, you can represent yourself though of course you'd have to do all the work yourself.

Lastly, running an appeal properly takes me hours and I don't think you can reasonably demand that I do the work for free (unless I lose of course but that's a risk I'm willing to take).

You can appeal yourself for free at https://londontribunals.org.uk/ or you can just give up and pay £130 to the council. You came here for advice and you have been given free legal advice, what you want to do now is entirely up to you. Nobody here is forcing you to do anything.

What I will say is you want to keep an eye on the 28 day deadline, if you miss it you will lose the right to appeal and the council will put the charge up to £195. So whatever you do, make sure to do it before midnight on 19 June 2024, which is the 28 day deadline.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order