Author Topic: Islington Contravention Code 11 Parked without payment of the parking charge  (Read 2750 times)

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They have stated 10 minute observation is for after a payment session expires.

I accept that, but is there no observation period for before a payment is made?

Surely it's not right that the PCN states 9.41to 9.41 as an observation period. Which means the CEO printed as soon as he possibly could to try avoid the motorist paying or even returning back into the car after deciding not to pay?

And yes the photos show 9.43 etc, but with the PCN already printed, had I returned to the car, the would have simply said "sorry it's already printed". Like they've done on so many other occassions?

If the CEO had waited for a few minutes what would they have observed?

Hi guys,

I received the NTO for this PCN recently. I've left it a bit late to upload, I know. Sorry.

Is there any grounds I could appeal on and go to tribunal, since it's at the higher price now anyway?

Thank you as usual.

NTO Page 1

Page 2

Page 3

Page 4

Page 5

Page 6

Have you submitted any representations against the Notice to Owner ? Only when reps against an NtO are rejected is it possible to register an appeal at LT.

No reps made against NTO yet. Was wondering on what grounds to submit reps.

Should I just submit my original appeal again?

No reps made against NTO yet. Was wondering on what grounds to submit reps.

Should I just submit my original appeal again?
Date of your NtO is 9th June, so you need to get your skates on as you have 28 days from then to submit reps or pay-up !
Nothing wrong with submitting your informal reps again if you're in a hurry.

For accuracy, with an NTO dated 9th June the last day of the 28-day period is 8 July.

OP, would you confirm that the NTO is addressed to you because only the addressee may make reps. So even if this is your 'missus' reps would need to be made under her name.

Also, I'm confused by the layout in Brewery Road. GSV suggests that the payment bays become operational at 8.30 whereas the permit bays only come into effect at 9.30 which suggests that one can park for free in a permit bay when it's chargeable on the other side of the road. As you are a permit holder, I was wondering how to develop this but got stuck because you cannot just move from a payment bay to a permit at 8.30 because the latter might still be occupied by non permit holders. I'm sure there's something which could be used to strengthen 'your' reps, but exactly what I'm not certain.

Pl confirm whether the above layout is correct and who is the RK.

RK is my missus. If I remember correctly, this ones on her (for once).

The pay and display begins at 9.30AM according to the signboards.

Many of the the permit holder bays in IS-D are taken up by Islington's own vans (a lot of which are diesels, which I find hypocritical).

They take up the bays day and night. Many of the residents complain, but do nothing. Including myself.

I don't mind getting my wife to resubmit the old reps. Just looking to go tribunal in the hopes I can get something.

Thanks for the confirmation and clarification.

I would not simply resubmit your informal reps because I cannot see that they contain any statutory defence. The council's response at the informal stage counts for little in the evidential scales, let's see what we can get from them at this stage. I'm sorry that my draft is long, but I've done this so that perhaps there are parts you could take and raise with a local councillor NB. not the council because officers don't need your vote.

Pl amend any inaccuracies.

Perhaps:
Re PCN *********

I live at ****** and hold a Resident's Permit for zone ID-S, I therefore use the bays reserved for permit holders in Brewery Road whenever possible. Unfortunately, the council's policy makes this more difficult than it should be for permit holders because these bays do not operate 24/7, in fact they're active for only 5 days per week and 7 hours per day (Mon-Fri 0930-4.30pm) which means that they may be used more by motorists who don't pay than those who do, like me, at a rate of £*** per year. This situation is worsened because, even during their active hours, I believe the bays are sometimes used without issue by council staff for their personal vehicles i.e. not liveried or 'council' vehicles. This lack of provision means that permit holders jockey with all and sundry for permit bays during their non-operational hours. If we're successful, fine. But if not, as happened on the day in question and preceding evening, then permit holders have to look elsewhere.

On ***(insert the day before the PCN) I couldn't find a vacant permit bay but managed to locate a vacant pay bay during its (identical) non-operational hours. From that moment, the Sword of Damocles was hanging over my head: could I find a vacant permit bay in that instant when an all and sundry motorist vacated a permit bay, something my husband and I juggle with too often? You will see from our otherwise unblemished PCN record*, that we're normally successful, but on the day in question we weren't. He thought it was my turn to move the car and I thought it was his. By the time we realised our error, we had already fallen between two stools and had been caught in the arms of your CEO with their £110 penalty.

Damocles's fate was more fortunate.

I understand that the above does not fall within any of the statutory grounds listed on the NTO, but none the less I hope they give you compelling reasons to exercise your discretion on this occasion and I should be grateful if you would.

However, as regards substantive grounds, I would state the following:

Time allowed to pay
A motorist is allowed a reasonable period of time to comply with a parking place restriction, in this case to pay. This limits a CEO who may not determine that a contravention has occurred until all possible exemptions have been examined e.g. loading, collecting, motorist in the process of paying etc. Contrary to the comment in your letter rejecting my husband's informal representations, a driver is not obliged to remain by their vehicle. With this in mind, issuing the instant PCN in this case is procedurally improper. NB. I note the reference in your letter to an observation period beginning at 9.38, but this is not supported by the PCN which quite clearly states: 'Observed from: 9.41 to 9.41'. If you are saying that the PCN is at variance with the CEO's notes, then this is a serious matter in itself.

*- is it?
« Last Edit: Today at 04:58:03 pm by tincombe »

Thank you so much!

I will edit and submit this (or my wife will at least).

The council vehicles have Islington decals on them.

They have a "base" on Brewery Road. But despite having their own parking yard, they seem to use all the resident bays.

I've been told by a CEO they are to only use the IS-D business bays, but that doesn't happen. Well it does, but they overflow onto the permit bays.

This situation is worsened because, even during their active hours, I believe the bays are sometimes used without issue by council staff for their personal vehicles i.e. not liveried or 'council' vehicles.

Then I suggest you turn this round:
This situation is worsened because the bays are used by council liveried vehicles. I understand why this 'council vehicle' exemption(against a prevailing restriction) might be desirable when they are operational e.g. street cleaning, highway works, meals-on-wheels etc. but it is surely not the council's intention to create an overflow car park for the Brewery Road depot which effectively robs fee-paying permit holders of the opportunity to park legitimately.

This situation is worsened because, even during their active hours, I believe the bays are sometimes used without issue by council staff for their personal vehicles i.e. not liveried or 'council' vehicles.

Then I suggest you turn this round:
This situation is worsened because the bays are used by council liveried vehicles. I understand why this 'council vehicle' exemption(against a prevailing restriction) might be desirable when they are operational e.g. street cleaning, highway works, meals-on-wheels etc. but it is surely not the council's intention to create an overflow car park for the Brewery Road depot which effectively robs fee-paying permit holders of the opportunity to park legitimately.

Thank you, very, very much!  :D