Free Traffic Legal Advice

Hi all,
 
Hoping I could get some advice on a situation which has just resulted in me having to pay �590 to a bailiff, who threatened to take my car away.
 
In October 2024 I received a Notice of Enforcement from Bristow & Sutor for an Unpaid TFL ULEZ PCN which was news to me, i'd received nothing to my home address that they were clearly writing to me to. I looked up the PCN details on the TFL website and related to a trip into the ULEZ zone on 16 March 2024 at Heathrow Airport for which I knew I paid for the next day (17 March 2024).
 
I contacted B&S to discuss the case and told them I had not ever received any PCN, turned out my V5 logbook was still registered to an old address, I did claim that 1. my car registration is registered to a TFL account that has my home address and 2. how did they get my address and it can suddenly be ok to harass me for money I had no clue about?? - the value of the NofE at this point was �355. B&S told me to email them with supporting evidence and they would go to TFL; I provided the receipt from my TFL account (again clearly with my current address on) explaining that the TFL website clearly says you have a period after the trip to pay. I assumed after this my case was on hold - the Notice of Enforcement clearly states that to contact us to discuss 'to avoid bailiff visit'.
 
B&S finally contacted me earlier this week via email to state that TFL have advised that the receipt provided was insufficient as this was paid after the contravention date (contravening what they say on their website) and TFL have instructed them to continue action - There was no update on costs nor have I received any other letter. I replied stating my disbelief and told them i'd seek legal advice but received no reply.
 
Cue yesterday and I get a call from my wife whilst I was out (I was driving home) saying a couple of bailiffs arrived at our home asking for me (by wrong name btw). They were vey forceful, even trying to get into the property and also completely lied to her saying that they have been round before and spoken to me before in person which was completely untrue, they left it by saying they'd ring me as they had my mobile number again saying that they'd spoken to me via that - I had never had anyone from B&S via phone!
 
They did ring so I pulled over and started to have a conversation, they explained they had been at my house, I'll be honest I was very abrupt and a little rude in the shock they'd rushed my wife but once I calmed I whole heartedly explained the situation but they were adamant I had to pay and sent me a link to pay and to my shock it was for �590 - and then they turned up behind my car saying they'd tracked me via ANPR. It was a calm situation but the guy said he'd take my car or possessions today if I didn't pay, so I felt I had no choice, there was no offer of reduced price or paying in instalments - I feel I was pressured into paying!
 
They said I could raise a Statutory Declaration??
 
So that's the history ... attached are copies of the Notice of enforcements letter/charge and my receipt to TFL for what I paid. As I say I never received any PCN details but the number is XJ22192203 and my Car Reg is R7OKB

Any advice on what stance I have and my next steps would be so so appreciated.

Thank you.

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

TFL ULEZ RECEIPT

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

Quote

I looked up the PCN details on the TFL website and related to a trip into the ULEZ zone on 16 March 2024 at Heathrow Airport for which I knew I paid for the next day (17 March 2024).

If your trip covered the 16th and 17th in the ULEZ, you should have paid for two days, but you only paid for one. So a PCN would have been sent to the address on the V5 Registration Certificate. Why ? Because under the civil process for PCNs served under various Acts of Parliament,  of which the ULEZ scheme is part, the owner of the vehicle has responsibility for payment or appeal of PCNs.

Unfortunately you did not update your V5 when you changed address, and would seem not to have put in any mail redirection either. So the process grinds its slow way forward ending up with bailiffs at your door.

So how out-of-date was your V5 ? Reason to ask is that the only avenue open to you to get the matter reverted to the PCN is to submit an Out-of-Time Statutory Declaration to the Traffic Enforcement Centre stating that you didn't receive the PCN. Unfortunately you have to give some explanation why you think you didn't receive the PCN and if it was months out, (we've seen years on here !), the SD will usually be rejected. This is because the SD will be passed to TfL who can, and will, object to it.

I'm afraid there is no easy answer to your predicament. We see far too many cases where the OP has failed to update his V5 and has to pay a large sum to bailiffs.  The bailiffs living depends on their finding debtors so are very proactive, using ANPR with the vehicle reg and other techniques.

So the only trip made was on 16th March but I didn't pay until the next day (17th) - which falls in line with TFL website guidance however it looks like the receipt stipulated travel on the 17th.

Fair enough in terms of the system generation of PCN to a degree but surely when there was clearly no other journey made by my vehicle I have a case to say that payment attempt was genuinely made.

Reference the V5 logbook: Unfortunately I left that address in September 2021, believe it or not i've had 2 previous new addresses since then to my current address. Do I still have a fair argument to say original PCNs were not received though as well as TFL having my current address registered for the vehicle in question (as on receipt) ?

Overall, there is understandable faults of my own ie logbook address and to a lesser TFL payment being registered for the day after but as above this is still evidence to show non-receipt of PCN and TFL have my address plus payment was genuinely and sincerely attempted - this isn't a case of trying to worm out of it by ignoring and meeting consequences 10 months later?

Re: Bailiffs - do I have a case (even to add mitigation) that I was forced to pay and not given options to even discuss further or have payment plans nor was I  even informed officially of the �590 fee (last correspondance was �355 on Oct 24) ??


Thank you so much for your reply thus far

OP

OP, there's no rush so assemble all relevant facts first pl. This will probably involve writing (nothing happens from now on other than in writing) to TfL, NOT B&S.

Preliminary facts as I understand them*:
You have TfL account registered to your Egham address;
The receipt for payment was addressed to you at Egham;
The PCN, CC, OfR were addressed to your old address;
Presumably the warrant which they sought to enforce at your Egham address carried your old address;
The NoE arrived by post having been issued on 3 Oct;
This gave you until an unspecified time on 11th to pay the debt which at that time comprised the surcharged penalty, court registration fee and B&S's Compliance Stage fee;

The following regulations apply:
Minimum period of notice
6.�(1) Subject to paragraph (3), notice of enforcement must be given to the debtor not less than 7 clear days before the enforcement agent takes control of the debtor's goods.

(2) Where the period referred to in paragraph (1) includes a Sunday, bank holiday, Good Friday or Christmas Day that day does not count in calculating the period.




7 clear days in respect of a NoE posted on 3rd October would end on Mon.14th October, not Fri. 11th.

Also, pl see a specimen NoE and note that a time is required, not just a date:

http://bailiffadviceonline.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/1-Notice-of-Enforcement-Copy.pdf

You are liable for the penalty incurred in respect of your journey on 16th.

This is not a problem with a single solution. For example, even if you managed to save the enforcement fee of �235 this would be significant.

Wait for other comments.

You might also contact bailiffadviceonline:

You might also contact bailiffadviceonline: https://bailiffadviceonline.co.uk/

Update:

On the initial advice from HCA and others (thank you all) I spoke with a lovely helpful lady called Sheila today at Bailiff Advice online.

After going through the whole saga she agreed that the Out of Time Statutory Declaration is pointless - in her professional opinion the vast majority of these are rejected and with the parameters of mine she said it would be 100%!!

She did however say I have a very strong case for an appeal via certain legislation surrounding my address being unknown - as we know V5 address was wrong however as part of the PCN history it�s clearly date stamped twice as address unknown (sounds like I might of been lucky and letters returned) so according to this legislation TFL should of made better attempts to find an existing address for me, had it confirmed and transferred PCN . . . And what more, which could be the smoking gun for this to be successful, is them clearly having an account registered to my vehicle.

So add to the matter of a genuine attempt to pay the ULEZ charge the next day - Sheila agreed yes the receipt does state 17th March start, another silly error by myself however there was still no journey on the 17th or near after and the TFL website clearly states you have 3 days to pay - it gives me a good case.

Now all this can only really be facilitated by Sheila but she has a specific contact for right dept/Personel at TFL and will plead my case on my behalf essentially requesting the PCN written off by TFL and if successful will have a legal right to a refund from B&S (bailiffs).

So watch this space - I will send a further update when I have significant news.

OP

Quote from: H C Andersen on January 29, 2025, 06:17:13 pm

You might also contact bailiffadviceonline: https://bailiffadviceonline.co.uk/

Update:

On the initial advice from HCA and others (thank you all) I spoke with a lovely helpful lady called Sheila today at Bailiff Advice online.

After going through the whole saga she agreed that the Out of Time Statutory Declaration is pointless - in her professional opinion the vast majority of these are rejected and with the parameters of mine she said it would be 100%!!

Just a quick correction, from the many OOT's that I provide advice for, the vast majority are accepted (in particular; for Dart Charge, Merseyflow, Clean Air Zones and most local authorities. It is sadly the case (and has been for many years) that TfL are more likely than not to REJECT OOT applications based on correspondence being sent to a previous address.

Well done to you and Sheila at baol !