3. TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
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TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
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Hi

Your (urgent) advice please.

I got this PCN from one of our workers. He received a fine for so called 'double parking'. However, the driver claims, and he tried to challenge this PCN, saying that he was waiting / allowing the car that was parked to pull out of the parking, so he can get into the parking. TFL rejected his appealing as you can see in the letter attached. Can you please advice me how should I go ahead with it. (time to repeal is quite short).

Google street view: https://maps.app.goo.gl/8hyGAsNrFnDfw6ik6

Your advice is highly appreciated.

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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #1 on: »
The formal Notice of Rejection dated 8th.September (deemed served Mon 11th)
implies this PCN was affixed to the vehicle.
If so there has been the opportunity for challenge (was one made?) a Notice to Owner (NtO) and reps in response to the NtO.
Please post up all sides of all other paperwork received (best to use an external hosting site like https://imgbb.com/ and post the BBCodes in your post here) and copy of the drivers (challenge and)reps, and any further photos from TfL's site..
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #2 on: »
Hi
Thanks for your reply.

Unfortunately, I do not have the original PCN. What happen was that the PCN was issued to the company but the driver tried to appeal it. So on the 6 of August they send a letter to the driver and to the company that in order to be able to challenge this PCN, he need the authorisation from the company to correspond with him regarding this PCN. We did send them this letter, that we authorised to driver to contact them on behalf of the company. In return we received this rejection letter attached above, what was named to the driver and to the company.

Regarding the images, there are no more images on the TFL website.

Kind regards
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #3 on: »
There's something missing in this account.
If a PCN is issued by a CEO on the ground, then it should be affixed to the vehicle.
If he has begun to prepare it, and the driver drives off before it can be affixed, a postal PCN may be issued to the registered keeper. But your photos in indicate the vehicle pulled into space and parked, giving the CEO the opportunity to affix it, in which case a postal PCN should not be issued.

If the offence is filmed by camera, then the ensuing PCN is posted.

Have you kept any of the paperwork?
Could you take a screenshot of the case history from TfL's website, please.
Sorry about all the questions, but without having a full account it is difficult to discern the next step.
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #4 on: »
Hi
I found all paperwork and will attach everything again with the entire story from the beginning.
This is a company vehicle.

So the original PCN (attached - File name:PCN-1) was issued on the 30/05/2023 by a CEO and was affixed to the vehicle.

Then the driver tried to appeal the PCN on the 05/06/2023.

They send us a letter dated 16/08/2023 requires authorisation from the company to correspond with the driver. (Attached - file name: PCN-2)
They also sent this letter to the driver. (Attached - file name: PCN-2)

We sent them back the authorisation letter by post. As it looks on the PCN history (see screenshot Attached - file name: PCN-3), seems that they didn't get it (or ignoring it).

Then they sent us the rejection letter (Attached - file name: PCN-4). Reading this letter seems that they reject it based of different reason.

Pic attached again:
https://ibb.co/JKtpXNJ
https://ibb.co/nCyjzNs

Google street view: https://maps.app.goo.gl/8hyGAsNrFnDfw6ik6 (PCN was issued on the left side of the road as shown on the pic).

How can I go with it?

Thank you very much in advance for your help and advice.

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« Last Edit: September 29, 2023, 12:47:19 pm by SMPL »
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #5 on: »
Quote
We issued the PCN because your vehicle was observed parked more than 50cm from the kerb and not within a designated parking place on the date and time of contravention at the above location

But it was issued because the vehicle was stopped on a red route (as per PCN).

Whether that would run at tribunal I have my doubts, but others will comment.
Similarly if thgere is any possibility of a de minimis defence - how long was it waiting?

Let the experts here peruse the docs and case history and see if there is anything lurking there.

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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #6 on: »
TFL ought to know better then to conflate the two, distinctly different contraventions.
Arguably the driver could have copped a PCN for either stopped or more then 50cm but they cannot issue a PCN for one and use the other to justify.

Where was the van when the CEO stuck the PCN on the windscreen?
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #7 on: »
I would be putting them to proof that at the time of issuing the PCN the PCSO was correctly uniformed to perform the duties of a CEO I would also state that the contravention stated on the PCN is not the one that they have responded too
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #8 on: »
@SMPL well as the discount is not on offer there's no point in paying now. I have a viable argument on the uniform issue but it's quite technical so realistically I'd have to run it for you. I'm happy to represent you at the tribunal if you want to appeal this.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #9 on: »
Thank you very much for your help? @cp8759 Can you guide me what should I do next? (28 days are nearly over).

Thank you very much in advice.
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Re: TFL / 46 - Stopped where prohibited (on a red route or clearway) / Contravention location Stamford Hill (Hackney)
« Reply #10 on: »
I'll drop you a PM.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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