3. Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
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Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
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Council is Lambeth. Recently got a motorcyclist off 6 out of 7 PCNs; but, one slipped through the net as per usual with this council. Made copious complaints and followed the statutory process and got the OFR and C.C. cancelled.

They have issued yet another C.C.! I have contacted TEC - not helpful - and complained yet again to the council.

They have also maligned me personally to my client writing that  I hadn't made clear my criticisms of their Enforcement Notices when I had. All this is on file. And they did not provide me with a copy.

I have asked them to cancel the C.C. and refer the matter to the Tribunal and also for an apology.

Question One: how long do they have to respond to my complaint? I filed it on 31st July via their portal but had already written to their complaints address on 23rd July.

Question Two: do I have any right to pursue them regarding their offensive letter other than via the Tribunal?
« Last Edit: August 18, 2024, 03:39:47 pm by Hippocrates »
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IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r

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Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #1 on: »
I don't see you can do much aside from wait for the OfR and get another revoking order. Any complaints must wait until legal proceedings are concluded.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #2 on: »
Cancelled. But I am taking the personal issue further as it was not addressed.  8)
Logged
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #3 on: »
I have asked them to cancel the C.C. and refer the matter to the Tribunal and also for an apology.

Question One: how long do they have to respond to my complaint? I filed it on 31st July via their portal but had already written to their complaints address on 23rd July.

Who is 'them'?

If the enforcement authority then your complaint has been misdirected IMO.

Engage with the Corporate complaints process.

I understand cp's comment, but this isn't to do with the enforcement process, it's how a member of the public has been treated. Presumably you have written evidence.

Perhaps...

.....and irrespective of the outcome of the PCN enforcement process, my complaint stands on its own merits. On **, ** I wrote to the council, as Enforcement Authority for road traffic contraventions in Lambeth, and received the reply which is attached. The inappropriate language and tone are clear, unnecessary and, in my opinion, insulting. I hope you agree that this letter falls well below the standards expected by the council and ..(whatever reasonable remedy you're looking for)..
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Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #4 on: »
Assuming the language and tone doesn't cross the line into slander, which would be a whole other kettle of fish, I'd be inclined to start by issuing a data subject access request to find out if this is an isolated incident or not. Even if this reveals nothing, I imagine that if their parking department gets told by their compliance people to hand over copies of all internal or external correspondence that mentions you might hint to them that actions can have consequences.

You might also consider exercising your right to rectification under Articles 16 & 19 of the GDPR in respect of any inaccurate statements they have made about you. While correcting the record may be trivial in what is now a closed case, the parking department might, following a visit from compliance staff choose to moderates their behaviour in future.

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Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #5 on: »
1. LLA Act 1996, Schedule I @para. 10 (7): Where a declaration has been served under sub-paragraph (2) (b) or (c) above, the borough council shall refer the case to the traffic adjudicator who may give such direction as he considers appropriate.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/1996/9/schedule/1/enacted

The have not done so, probably, in part, because they knew they would be hammered at the Tribunal.

2. They wrote saying that I had not pinpointed what the error of their Enforcement Notices was and that they did not receive representations! In fact I made global submissions concerning the 7 cases. I am surprised that the adjudicator did not allow costs as they were trigger-happy with at least 3 charge certificates, even re one which was DNCed! Cases: 2240132030 and 2240130523. The offensive letter was written after the cases were won!

3. The response to my first complaint said their ENs had no errors! They have now fixed the problem.

I would appreciate any further advice because I have spent months, not just hours, writing to several appeal officers by name as well as the general addresses.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2024, 07:18:54 pm by Hippocrates »
Logged
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #6 on: »
Quote from: H C Andersen on August 22, 2024, 04:20:39 pm
I have asked them to cancel the C.C. and refer the matter to the Tribunal and also for an apology.

Question One: how long do they have to respond to my complaint? I filed it on 31st July via their portal but had already written to their complaints address on 23rd July.

Who is 'them'?

If the enforcement authority then your complaint has been misdirected IMO.

Engage with the Corporate complaints process.

I understand cp's comment, but this isn't to do with the enforcement process, it's how a member of the public has been treated. Presumably you have written evidence.

Perhaps...

.....and irrespective of the outcome of the PCN enforcement process, my complaint stands on its own merits. On **, ** I wrote to the council, as Enforcement Authority for road traffic contraventions in Lambeth, and received the reply which is attached. The inappropriate language and tone are clear, unnecessary and, in my opinion, insulting. I hope you agree that this letter falls well below the standards expected by the council and ..(whatever reasonable remedy you're looking for)..

I followed the process to the letter.
Logged
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #7 on: »
Logged
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #8 on: »
Logged
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
Re: Conundrum regarding fresh issue of a Charge Certificate
« Reply #9 on: »
I am hopeful this will reach the press.  ;)

Dear Sir / Madam

Freedom of Information Act 2000

This request is being handled under the Freedom of Information Act 2000.
Request and response

1. Please give me the exact number of Enforcement Notices issued with this wording in
the last 12 months.

0. The text on our enforcement notice is compliant. However please see the data for
the period 1/03/2023 to 29/02/2024 for enforcement notices issued in this period.
19,442

2. The income generated from the same.

£1284303.07

3. The number of representations accepted

926

4. The number of representations rejected.

3,473

5. The number of appeals both won and lost at the Tribunal.

Allowed 44 DNC 42 Refused 67

6. Who is responsible for this wording?

Parking Services

7. When was it changed?

NA
« Last Edit: August 26, 2024, 08:57:45 pm by Hippocrates »
Logged
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r
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