Author Topic: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.  (Read 206 times)

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Jayd30

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I just returned home from a trip away and opened a letter from the Met Police which turned out to be a notice of intended prosecution by doing 24 in a 20 zone.

I don't recall speeding but a camera has obviously picked me up on the way to or from a tip to the local recycling centre at that speed.

My question comes from what I have read online (and its something that even the Met Police says it follows) around the NPCC National Police Chiefs’ Council guidance on speeds which is 10% +2. This apparently was amended to this in 2019 from 10% + 3.

Now I do know that the max limit you should travel at is that dictated on the road sign so I am not looking to argue that but I find the guidance confusing in relation to notices of intended prosecution.

The below is a FOI request responded to by the MPS where they state the 10% + rule.

https://www.met.police.uk/foi-ai/metropolitan-police/d/march-2022/current-guidance-relating-to-speed-cameras/

If this is the case would I have grounds to contest this notice? The speed limit was 20, 10% + 2 in my mind would mean that at 24 mph it would not trigger a notice of intended prosecution?

I have yet to respond to the notice and thought I would ask the question on here before doing so. The reason I am asking the question is because it does seem contradictory for the Met to state that are following NPCC guidance but on the other hand TFL (who I believe manage the cameras) are  not operating to the same policy?

The road I was travelling on and in question is the A205 Academy Road in London.

Is it worth contesting or provide details?

Any help/thoughts appreciated.

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Southpaw82

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2024, 11:52:27 am »
10% + 2 is where enforcement starts - so 24 in a 20. Even if that wasn’t so, it presents no legal defence.

Jayd30

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2024, 11:58:10 am »
10% + 2 is where enforcement starts - so 24 in a 20. Even if that wasn’t so, it presents no legal defence.

Right OK understood, I have just done a bit more research and can see the guidance set out although still seems a bit misleading in my opinion.

Regardless I will provide them the info they require and go from there.

Jayd30

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2024, 12:03:39 pm »
10% + 2 is where enforcement starts - so 24 in a 20. Even if that wasn’t so, it presents no legal defence.


I mean looking at this table how do they make a judgement whether a driver should receive an awareness course over points and fine? If you look at section 9.6.

https://library.college.police.uk/docs/appref/ACPO-Speed-Enforcement-Guidance.pdf

There will be circumstances I feel where a driver may go over the 20mph speed limit maybe to 23/24 to pass a cyclist etc and face prosecution for doing so.


666

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2024, 12:12:09 pm »
10% + 2 is where enforcement starts - so 24 in a 20. Even if that wasn’t so, it presents no legal defence.


I mean looking at this table how do they make a judgement whether a driver should receive an awareness course over points and fine? If you look at section 9.6.

https://library.college.police.uk/docs/appref/ACPO-Speed-Enforcement-Guidance.pdf

There will be circumstances I feel where a driver may go over the 20mph speed limit maybe to 23/24 to pass a cyclist etc and face prosecution for doing so.
An awareness course is offered up to 31 mph (provided one hasn't been completed in the previous three years). It is not offered "over" an FP, but as an alternative to one.

The law is the law. What you may "feel" is irrelevant.

slapdash

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2024, 12:55:28 pm »
I mean looking at this table how do they make a judgement whether a driver should receive an awareness course over points and fine? If you look at section 9.6.

Mainly by "has the offender been given the opportunity to learn a lesson from a course".

Jayd30

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2024, 01:03:20 pm »
10% + 2 is where enforcement starts - so 24 in a 20. Even if that wasn’t so, it presents no legal defence.


I mean looking at this table how do they make a judgement whether a driver should receive an awareness course over points and fine? If you look at section 9.6.

https://library.college.police.uk/docs/appref/ACPO-Speed-Enforcement-Guidance.pdf

There will be circumstances I feel where a driver may go over the 20mph speed limit maybe to 23/24 to pass a cyclist etc and face prosecution for doing so.
An awareness course is offered up to 31 mph (provided one hasn't been completed in the previous three years). It is not offered "over" an FP, but as an alternative to one.

The law is the law. What you may "feel" is irrelevant.

Thanks @666 I do appreciate that the law is the law and thanks for the confirmation of what the 10% + 2 rule means. In relation to the last part about what I feel is irrelevant, I was simply stating the case that given the way roads work and that on that particular road their are cycle lanes a motorist could fall foul to going over the 10% + 2 and find themselves with a notice of prosecution.

If nothing anyone felt in the world was irrelevant, then it would be a worse world than what we live in now.

NewJudge

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Re: Notice of intended prosecution Met Police A205 Academy Road London.
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2024, 01:11:16 pm »
TfL has no policy on speeding enforcement thresholds and plays no part in decisions on speeding enforcement. he FOI response says only that they are responsible for the management of the cameras, so I don't understand where the confusion is. In any case, as sp has explained, enforcement begins at (Limit + 10% +2mph).

Whatever issues you have with the offence itself, you must respond to the request for the driver's details. Failure to do so will see you commit a separate, more serious offence which carries six points. The only place to contest the speeding allegation is in court and you cannot do that until you have named yourself as the driver at the relevant time,

Quote
I mean looking at this table how do they make a judgement whether a driver should receive an awareness course over points and fine? If you look at section 9.6.

That table has never struck me as the clearest explanation of the thresholds. In short, enforcement begins at (Limit + 10% +2mph) and courses are offered up to (Limit + 10% +9mph). That said, I shouldn't get too hung up on the guidance. Although it is usually complied with, the police can take whatever action they deem appropriate in all the circumstances, whatever excess is recorded. This is explained in para 9.7 of the guidance.