Author Topic: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit  (Read 1084 times)

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Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #15 on: »
I think you may be misremembering the old advice you read on PePiPoo, the legal situation as regards keeper liability has not changed.

A breach of contract can be pursued for up to 6 years - by default the parties to any such contract are the driver and the operator. If an operator wants to recover charges from the registered keeper rather than the driver, they must meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. This sets deadlines for the issuance of various notices. These deadlines are irrelevant if the operator knows the identity of the driver and can take action against them directly.

Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #16 on: »
Please spare me the whinge about only taking this as far as POPLA!!!! I can guarantee with greater than 99.9% certainty that if POPLA is unsuccessful, this would NEVER reach a hearing and the claim would eventually be discontinued.

Nothing pisses me off more than people who simply fund these scammers and therefore become part of the problem rather than the solution.

If you want the easy, very little effort solution to this, then do nothing. NO appeal. No POPLA. Ignore the useless debt recovery letters. Ignore the Letter before Claim (LoC) and simply defend the claim when it arrives. You are guided through the very simple process of acknowledging service and we provide the defence which you simply copy and paste.

The rest of the process involves one more emailed form (N180 DQ) to send and a less than 5 minute phone call with a mediator where all you do is say "I offer £0" and that is the extent of any work you must do. The claim will eventually be discontinued just before the claimant has to pay the £27 trial fee.

But hey, it's your money and if you want to throw the driver under the bus and waste good money, who am I to argue?

I don't know why I bother sometimes!
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #17 on: »
Play nicely kids.

The OP is talking about the keeper (someone else), throwing him under the bus, not t'other way round.

Ideally the keeper will deal with it until conclusion but if they're just going to pay and you're more up for a fight they could name you.

Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #18 on: »
Play nicely kids.

The OP is talking about the keeper (someone else), throwing him under the bus, not t'other way round.

Ideally the keeper will deal with it until conclusion but if they're just going to pay and you're more up for a fight they could name you.

The RK is someone else, its a big ask for them to receive letters in their name for the next 6 years with supposedly legal letters for a parking charge they have not incurred themselves. They are of a nervous disposition and will not accept the letters are fake and can be ignored. 

I(the driver) will be drafting the appeal. submitted as them, with their permission of course. I would rather get this dealt at POPLA stage and provide full delivery to POPLA and throw a big bank of evidence their way to get the charge cancelled. evidence including drivers name (my name) in the unredacted documents.

If you think even POPLA is going to be 50:50 and I'm relying on it never going to county court. I might as well have the letters come in my name and have a strong defence for court if they wish to take it there.

I'd rather go to court as the driver and defend myself, than have the RK to receive 3-4 letters a year and possibly go to court.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2025, 11:54:52 am by Plywood-Enthusiast »

Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #19 on: »
The ONLY lawful way to transfer liability for the charge if for the Keeper to provide the drivers details to the creditor and pass the NtK to the driver. PoFA 9(2)(e)(ii) applies.

Quote
The Notice MUST state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper to pay the unpaid parking charges; or if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver.

So, unless the Keeper does the above, even if you try to intervene and admit to being the driver, there is nothing to stop them going back to the Keeper and pestering them in future.

If they do what PoFA says they must do in order to transfer liability away from themselves as Keeper, then all they have to do is as stated. After that, there is NO legal recourse for them to even contact the Keeper about this ever again.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #20 on: »
I was going to write and submit an appeal on the last day on behalf of the keepr.

I tried to post on 2/12/2025, which would have been the the 28th day since the wrote the parking charge.

The infraction was 28/10/25, the first charge letter was dated 5/11/25 and a remind letter was 19/11/25 it was 2/12/25 when a appeal was attempted however the page says it is no longer eligble for appeal. Isn't there 28 days from the date the ticket was issued to appeal?

I wrote and sent a letter out to UKPC with the written appeal. 

I have kept screenshots of the appeals page and payment page with the date and time in the frame.

The appeals page says appeals are closed it is now been sent to debt collection with fees, the payment page still has the £100 payment option.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2025, 12:30:23 am by Plywood-Enthusiast »

Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #21 on: »
You are getting hung up on the wrong “28 days”. The Code does not give them 28 days from the date printed on the notice to shut the door on appeals. The PPSCoP talks about 28 days from when the keeper "receives" the notice, and then explains how “receipt” is worked out for something sent by post.

In your case the timeline is quite straightforward. The alleged contravention was on 28/10/2025. The Notice to Keeper (NtK) is dated 05/11/2025. The PPSCoP says that a notice sent by post is presumed delivered on the second working day after the date of posting, unless you can prove otherwise. If UKPC actually posted it on 05/11, the first working day is Thursday 06/11 and the second working day is Friday 07/11. So, for the purposes of the PPSCoP, the NtK is treated as received on 07/11/2025.

The 28-day appeal window in the PPSCoP then runs from that date of deemed receipt, not from the 5th. Count 28 days from 07/11/2025 and you land on 05/12/2025. That is the last day on which the Keeper must be allowed to lodge an appeal under the Code. You tried to use the online appeals portal on 02/12/2025, which is only day 25 from deemed receipt. In other words, your appeal attempt was comfortably within the 28-day period the PPSCoP requires.

Now put that alongside what the Code actually says. Section 8.1.2(e) requires that the notice itself tells the recipient they can appeal if they do so within 28 days of receiving the parking charge. The Note under that sub-paragraph is the bit that sets out the “second working day” presumption I have quoted. Section 8.4.1 then says that operators must provide a process which allows the parking charge to be appealed within 28 days, and at §8.4.1(c) it goes further and says they must consider late appeals where the motorist can show exceptional circumstances.

UKPC’s system blocking an appeal on 02/12/2025, and declaring that the case had been sent to debt recovery even though the 28 days from receipt had not yet expired, is flatly contrary to both 8.1.2(e) and 8.4.1(a). Even if they wanted to argue about when you actually got the NtK, your screenshots show that, taking their own issue date at face value and applying the Code’s deemed delivery rule, you were still well within time when you tried to appeal.

That deemed-delivery rule also contains the escape clause I pointed out: the presumption applies “unless the contrary is proved”. UKPC will be put to strict proof of the date the notice actually entered the postal system using a genuine first-class (1–2 day) service. They will not be able to do so. They invariably rely on hybrid-mail systems offering 2–3 day delivery with no individual proof of posting and no evidence of the exact day the NtK entered Royal Mail’s network. That is not proof of first-class posting, and it does not satisfy the evidential requirement of the Note in the PPSCoP. As soon as UKPC attempt to rely on the presumption, it is rebutted. In other words, your appeal window is not only intact on the deemed-delivery calculation, it is even stronger once the presumption is knocked out.

You captured screenshots of the online appeal page and payment page, showing the date and time when their system wrongly stated that appeals were closed and the matter was with a debt collector, while still happily offering you a £100 payment button. You have also sent a written appeal to UKPC in the keeper’s name, which does not identify the driver.

The narrative for the formal complaint and appeal is therefore simple: contravention on 28/10, NtK dated 05/11, deemed receipt on 07/11 under the PPSCoP, and an online appeal attempt on 02/12 which was within the 28-day period. The refusal to accept that appeal is a breach of 8.1.2(e) and 8.4.1(a). The previous written appeal must therefore be treated as an in-time appeal and processed accordingly, with either cancellation or a rejection including a POPLA code.

Section 11.2 of the PPSCoP then bites. That clause says that where a parking operator receives a complaint that it considers to be or include an appeal against the validity of a parking charge, it must treat it as an appeal for the purposes of the 8.4 timescales unless and until it is clear that the complaint is not relevant to an appeal. The complaint is plainly about the validity of the charge and the handling of the appeal window, so UKPC are required to treat it as an appeal under the Code.

The escalation narrative is then completed by noting that continuing to block an in-time appeal and pushing the consumer towards “debt collection” while misrepresenting their appeal rights is not only a PPSCoP breach but also an unfair commercial practice under the Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024. This behaviour involves misleading actions and omissions concerning the consumer’s rights of redress, and the use of aggressive commercial pressure. It is conduct that may fall within the CMA’s enforcement remit under the DMCC. If the person reading the complaint does not understand the implications of that, they should pass it immediately to a responsible adult within UKPC who has the intellectual capacity to do so.

Finally, the keeper makes clear that if UKPC refuse to recognise the appeal as in-time or fail to issue a proper rejection with a POPLA code, the matter will be escalated to the BPA, the DVLA, and the CMA for breaches of the PPSCoP, misuse of DVLA data, and unfair commercial practices under the DMCC.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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Re: UKPC: Parked in a permit area without displaying a permit
« Reply #22 on: »
thanks b789 Thats reassuring.

I did the appeal late on 2/12/25 and then only realised I should be screenshotting the pages just shortly after midnight and was dreading that I would be clutching at straws with that screenshot because the date on there clearly shows it just after "28 days". But the two extra days for postage comes in handy.

Here are the screenshots to put it on public record. I have sent an email to their complaints, with the aim of escalating to BPA and CMA. I will send this evidence to CMA anyway because other people are getting screwed. In the complaint email I have sent 90% of your post above^ (changed from 'you' to 'i' and proof read it so it makes sense, and removed advice directed to me)

I have uploaded the images below as matter of public record.


« Last Edit: December 03, 2025, 02:13:42 pm by Plywood-Enthusiast »
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