3. UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #15 on: »
Quote from: DWMB2 on October 16, 2024, 06:43:44 pm
I wonder if it's worth submitting the query to the council explicitly as a Freedom of Information Act request, to force a response.

And here is the response to my FOI

Information Request
Thank you for your email of 17 October 2024.
Within your email you made a request for information. This has been handled by
Hampshire County Council, under the provisions of the Environmental Information
Regulations 2004 (EIR). This legislation entitles a requester to recorded information
held by a public authority, unless an appropriate exemption applies.
In your email you requested the following information, to which we have responded
below:
I am writing to inquire about the status of the roads within the Berewood Estate,
Waterlooville, specifically focusing on Marellsmoore Avenue. I would like to
understand whether there are any statutory controls or Traffic Regulation Orders
(TROs) governing these roads.
I am particularly concerned about the activities of an unregulated private parking
company (UKPC), which is issuing Parking Charge Notices (PCNs) to motorists
within the estate. UKPC is presenting these PCNs under the guise of enforcing
traffic offences, such as stopping or parking on yellow lines, and they claim the
ability to hold vehicle keepers liable under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012
(PoFA).
To ensure a clear understanding of the legal framework governing these roads, I
would be grateful if you could confirm the following:
1. Are the roads in the Berewood Estate, specifically Marrelsmoore Avenue, subject
to any statutory controls or Traffic Regulation Orders (TROs) issued by Hampshire
County Council or any other statutory authority? If so, could you provide details of
any such orders or controls, including how they might affect parking enforcement on
these roads?
Hampshire County Council does not have any Traffic Regulation Orders, in place or
proposed, for Marrelsmoore Avenue.
2. Does Hampshire County Council have any role in regulating the parking
arrangements or enforcement practices on these unadopted roads within the
estate?
Your clarification would be helpful, as it will assist in understanding the legal position
regarding the private parking company’s enforcement practices and whether they
align with any statutory or contractual regulations in place.
Under Regulation 9 of EIR, advice and assist, we can advise that Hampshire County
Council does not have a role in parking arrangements or enforcement at
Marrelsmoore Avenue. To progress this part of your request, you may wish to
redirect it to the developer, who we believe is Redrow Homes Ltd., as they may be
able to advise if there are any existing parking restrictions that are enforced by a
private company on their behalf.
We hope you find the information useful.

Thanks for your assistance.
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #16 on: »
Once the council adopt those roads, that will be the end of UKPC's little profit machine in that area.

Not to worry though. No one pays a penny to UKPC if they're here getting advice. This is likely to of all the way to a claim in the county court issued by DCB Legal. If defended, as it will be if you're here. it will eventually be discontinued before they have to pay the rial fee. I am prepared to place money on that being the outcome.
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #17 on: »
Quote from: b789 on November 08, 2024, 10:33:29 am
Once the council adopt those roads, that will be the end of UKPC's little profit machine in that area.

Not to worry though. No one pays a penny to UKPC if they're here getting advice. This is likely to of all the way to a claim in the county court issued by DCB Legal. If defended, as it will be if you're here. it will eventually be discontinued before they have to pay the rial fee. I am prepared to place money on that being the outcome.

Hopefully that time comes rather sooner than later. Received the attached letter a couple of days ago asking to confirm the full name and address of the driver. How best do i proceed please?



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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #18 on: »
They're trying to trick you into revealing the identity of the driver - much as in this thread:  https://www.ftla.uk/private-parking-tickets/gemini-parking-solutions-gunnersbury-park/  - see post by b789 yesterday.  You could adapt his response, or just ignore it and wait for the inevitable rejection and POPLA code.
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #19 on: »
Bowen and others v Isle of Wight Council [2021]

Is summarised as(but this does not form part of the judgment):

The case therefore serves as a useful reminder that the failure to proactively prevent public use of a private route may result in the local Council having the authority to regulate and restrict vehicles and access over that route.

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Ch/2021/3254.html

I'm not certain that the council's position is correct, but perhaps the OP can shed more light on the site and its use.
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #20 on: »
Just ignore that letter and wait for them to issue their appeal rejection and a POPLA code. POPLA is unlikely to be much use in this instance either.

The most likely outcome to resolving this PCN is to let UKPC issue a county court claim through DCB Legal, defend it using a provided defence template and wait for their eventual discontinuation. They will discontinue a defended claim.
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #21 on: »
Quote from: b789 on November 21, 2024, 02:02:02 pm
Just ignore that letter and wait for them to issue their appeal rejection and a POPLA code. POPLA is unlikely to be much use in this instance either.

The most likely outcome to resolving this PCN is to let UKPC issue a county court claim through DCB Legal, defend it using a provided defence template and wait for their eventual discontinuation. They will discontinue a defended claim.

Happy New Year Moderators and thanks for all you do on here for everyone!

So after a long period of silence, the attached letter was received yesterday from a company called ZZPC acting on behalf of UKPC stating the the outstanding balance is now £170.

What is the next course of action please? Also, is it normal for no appeal rejection letter and a POPLA code to be sent?

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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #22 on: »
You ignore all debt collector letters from powerless scammers like ZZPS (and their sister company GCTT). We don't need to see any debt collector letters. Never, ever, communicate with a useless, powerless debt collector. They are not a party to the contract allegedly breached by the driver.

Come back when you receive an LoC which is more likely than not going to be issued by DCB Legal (not their debt collection arm, DCBL).
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #23 on: »
Quote from: b789 on January 12, 2025, 09:35:19 am
You ignore all debt collector letters from powerless scammers like ZZPS (and their sister company GCTT). We don't need to see any debt collector letters. Never, ever, communicate with a useless, powerless debt collector. They are not a party to the contract allegedly breached by the driver.

Come back when you receive an LoC which is more likely than not going to be issued by DCB Legal (not their debt collection arm, DCBL).

After almost a 4 month wait, a Letter of Claim (see attachment) has been sent by DCB Legal on behalf of their client UKPC.

What is(are) the next step(s) to follow in response to this LoC please? Thank you.

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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #24 on: »
I’ve posted a couple of LoC responses over the last few days. Have a search and you can use one of those. Just show us before you send it to info@dcblegal.co.uk and CC in yourself.
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Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #25 on: »
Quote from: b789 on May 07, 2025, 06:44:31 am
I’ve posted a couple of LoC responses over the last few days. Have a search and you can use one of those. Just show us before you send it to info@dcblegal.co.uk and CC in yourself.

Thanks for your reply.

I found and will use the LoC below. Do I need to include the reference in the LoC anywhere or it is not required?


Dear Sirs,

Re: Letter of Claim [insert date]

I refer to your Letter of Claim.

I confirm that my address for service at this time is as follows:

[insert address]

Please note that the alleged debt is disputed, and any court proceedings will be robustly defended.

I note that the sum claimed has been increased by an excessive and unjustifiable amount, which appears contrary to the principles established by the Government, who described such practices as “extorting money from motorists.”

Please refrain from sending boilerplate responses or justifications regarding this issue.

Under the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims, I require specific answers to the following questions:

1. Does the additional £70 represent what you describe as a “Debt Recovery” fee? If so, is this figure net of or inclusive of VAT? If inclusive, I trust you will explain why I, as the alleged debtor, am being asked to cover your client’s VAT liability.

2. Regarding the principal sum of the alleged Parking Charge Notice (PCN): Is this being claimed as damages for breach of contract, or will it be pleaded as consideration for a purported parking contract?

I would caution you against simply dismissing these questions with vague or boilerplate responses, as I am fully aware of the implications.

By claiming that PCNs are exempt from VAT while simultaneously inflating the debt recovery element, your client – with your assistance – appears to be evading VAT obligations due to HMRC.

Such mendacious conduct raises serious questions about the legality and ethics of your practices.

I strongly advise your client to cease and desist. Should this matter proceed to court, you can be assured that these issues will be brought to the court’s attention, alongside a robust defence and potentially a counterclaim for unreasonable conduct.


Yours faithfully,

[insert name]
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #26 on: »
Automated reply received from DCB Legal after sending email yesterday. I reckon this serves as a confirmation of receipt on their end and I need wait for them to contact me again.

"Please note that we will aim to respond to your correspondence where required as soon as possible. In the meantime, should you be contacting in relation to a Parking Charge, you can find some Frequently asked Questions (FAQs) on our website www.dcblegal.co.uk

Should you wish to make a payment, you can do this by calling 0330 1744 172, visiting https://dcblegal.co.uk/response/pay-online/ or by bank transfer to the below bank details. Please ensure your DCB legal reference number is quoted with any payments made.

Account number: 60964441
Sort Code: 20-24-09

Should you be in receipt of a letter of claim, please visit www.dcblegal.co.uk/response where you will find further information and be able to reply to the form accordingly"
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #27 on: »
Yesterday I received this reply from DCB Legal. How do i respond to this email please or just ignore and wait for the claim to be made.

"Dear XXXXXXXX

We write in response to your correspondence received in our office dated 08/05/2025.

We now respond to the same as follows.

In accordance with the British Parking Association (BPA) Code of Practice, where the Parking Charge (PC) becomes overdue and before Court proceedings have commenced, a reasonable sum may be added for the debt recovery fees. The correct recovery fees have been added and will not be removed. As such, the outstanding balance of £170.00 remains payable to prevent further action. The HMRC ‘VAT Supply and Consideration manual’ (VATSC06140), confirmed that parking charge falls out of the scope of VAT.


When parking on private land, the contractual terms of the site are set out on the signs. You are entering a contract and agreeing to the terms by parking and staying on the site. Parking in breach of the terms as stipulated on the signage means that you are then breaking the terms of the contract. The parking charge amount of £100.00 is for the breach in the terms and conditions as displayed on the signage.


You now have 30 days from the date of this email to make payment of £170.00. Failure to make payment will result in a Claim being issued against you without any further reference.
 

Payment can be made via bank transfer to our designated client account: -

Account Name: DCB Legal Ltd Client Account   
Sort Code: 20-xx-xx   
Account Number: 60******
You must quote the correct case reference when making payment. If you do not, we may be unable to correctly allocate the payment. If further action is taken by us as a result of an incorrect reference being quoted, you will be liable for any further fees or costs incurred.

Alternatively, you can contact DCB Legal Ltd on 0203 838 7038 to make payment over the telephone or online at https://dcblegal.co.uk/response/pay-online/.

 
Kind Regards" 
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #28 on: »
Email them back and CC in yourself with the following:

Quote
Dear Sirs,

Your Letter of Claim contained insufficient detail of the claim and failed to provide copies of evidence your client places reliance upon and thus is in complete contravention of the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims. Your subsequent response has not changed that fact and I now respond again, further advising you of your failures and that I now require further specific information.

Because your letters lack specificity and breach the requirements of the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (paragraphs 3.1(a)-(d), 5.1 and 5.2) as well as the Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct (paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c)), you must treat this letter as a further formal request for all of the documents/information that the protocol now requires your client to provide. Your client must not issue proceedings without complying with that protocol.

As solicitors you must surely be familiar with the requirements of both the Practice Direction and the Pre-Action Protocol for debt claims and your client, as a serial litigator of debt claims, should likewise be aware of them. As you (and your client) must know, the Practice Direction and Protocol bind all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time. It is embarrassing that a firm of Solicitors are sending a consumer a vague and un-evidenced 'Letter of Claim' in complete ignorance of the pre-existing Practice Direction and the Pre-Action Protocol.

I confirm that, once I am in receipt of a Letter Before Claim that fully complies with the requirements of para 3.1 (a) of the Pre-Action Protocol, I shall then seek advice and submit a formal response within 30 days, as required by the Protocol. Thus, I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

1. An explanation of the cause of action
2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are; for how long it is claimed the vehicle was parked, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. If the claim is for a contractual breach, photographs showing the vehicle was parked in contravention of said contract.
7. Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
8. Provide me a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim, as required by the BPA/IPC Private Parking Single Code of Practice (PPSCoP).
9. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
10. Photographs of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed) at the time of any alleged contravention.
11. Provide details of the original charge, and detail any interest and administrative or other charges added
12. Am I to understand that the additional £70 represents what is dressed up as a 'Debt Recovery' fee, and if so, is this nett or inclusive of VAT? If the latter, would you kindly explain why I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?
13. With regard to the principal alleged PCN sum: Is this damages, or will it be pleaded as consideration for parking?

I am clearly entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c) of the Practice Direction. I also need it in order to comply with my own obligations under paragraph 6(b).

If your client does not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13, 15(b) and (c) and 16 of the Practice Direction, as referred to in paragraph 7.2 of the Protocol.

Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.

Yours faithfully,

[Your name]
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Re: UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park
« Reply #29 on: »
Quote from: b789 on May 30, 2025, 05:46:34 pm
Email them back and CC in yourself with the following:

Quote
Dear Sirs,

Your Letter of Claim contained insufficient detail of the claim and failed to provide copies of evidence your client places reliance upon and thus is in complete contravention of the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims. Your subsequent response has not changed that fact and I now respond again, further advising you of your failures and that I now require further specific information.

Thanks for your response. Email sent  :)
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  3. UKPC - Notice To Keeper - Parked on double yellow line on road and not in car park