Author Topic: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER  (Read 3533 times)

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SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
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I parked at Cheddington Station on July 10th. On leaving I attempted to pay via their app but was unable to log in, probably due to no phone signal. I'd visited previously a couple of years ago and parked outside their car park because I was unable to pay at the machine - due to lack of phone signal.

Once back home a few hours later I attempted to pay again, as they have the facility to 'pay late'. Another failure to login, but this time there was plenty of wifi. So, not my end.

After some time, maybe an hour or two, I actually managed to connect via their app. So, IMO, there must have been an issue at their end for a few hours.

However, when I attempted to pay on the app, I immediately received a message from my bank advising me my card was rejected due to the card expiry date being incorrect. I immediately corrected that on the app and tried again. I can't recall exactly what happened when I tried paying again, but there was no message from the bank and there was no money transferred.

Then I contacted saba via their webform. They claimed my card details were incorrect. It's impossible on the app to see what card details were entered by me, but much later I proved (at least to myself) that all details were correct.

They also suggested going to their website and paying as a 'guest' (i.e. not logged in) or phoning 'customer support'.

I have a phobia about 'customer support' - have you ever tried getting a doctor's appointment, or worse still, attempting to sort out Vodaphone? That one ended up after a very considerable to and fro with me telling them to take me to court. They didn't.

So, I logged in as a guest. No dice. see the screenshot of the error message which I would suggest is nothing at all to do with my bank and everything to do with their end (i.e. whoever provides their payment services).

They suggested contacting my bank, because that's who they're blaming, if it isn't me. I did so, and the bank couldn't come up with any suggestions.

When I was in the middle of replying to the bank (on the 14th) I just had the idea of trying to pay again. I created a 'new' payment method, which was the same card as I'd previously entered and corrected. And it worked. But I had to pay for a time period when I wasn't there as their Ts&Cs won't allow payment after midnight after the day of the parking event. I also paid with my 'old' card for yet another time period to see if it would work. It did. By now I thought I may be confused about which card I was actually using (as all you can see of the card details on the app is the last four digits) so I actually deleted the card I'd last used and paid with the remaining, almost certainly the original one, and that worked too. Surprised - not.

Then I claimed my overpayment back. 'Customer support' ended up telling me that 'it doesn't work like that - here's all your money back and you can expect a fine too'. Nice.

This seems rather long, but I didn't want to drip-feed details.

I can post up all the emails from saba (apart from my first message which was entered into their webform) and all the correspondance from the bank if it is useful.

I'm aware of the threads 'Saba Parking Services - Railway parking site - debt collector before initial notice?' which is still ongoing, and 'Byelaws offence - Taken to magistrates for private parking ticket' which sadly fizzled out.


Here's the invoice:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1A-XwBfwNLFJjTJDwWnAEbDCsTCa1s4fo/view?usp=drive_link


The rear of the invoice is just methods of payment, debt advice links, link to complaints website and GDPR statement.


Saba website error message:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eIk4pzr-MxvQXF9BLOryUfp_HI4TFxjm/view?usp=drive_link

(Couldn't get imgur working despite reading the instructions)


Google maps:


https://maps.app.goo.gl/oqk9kQYLqPusgA2x7[/url]


I'm the RK of the vehicle, and I've always referred to myself as 'I', as in 'I tried to pay' etc, though I have no proof of this in my original, webform, contact with saba.


So, appeal or wait for court?
« Last Edit: July 25, 2025, 10:26:59 pm by martin_t »

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Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #1 on: »
Links to files now accessible (sorry for being an idiot...)

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #2 on: »
What a wasted effort on your part! A SABA (or any other unregulated private parking firm such as APCOA) Penalty Notice is a fake instrument of fraud.

The wording in the SABA-issued Penalty Notice (PN) is deeply problematic, misleading, procedurally defective, and legally dubious in several respects.

1. Misrepresentation of Enforcement Options (Civil vs Criminal)

The PN states:

"An offence has been committed by breaching Byelaw 14... our Client has the option to pursue you through the Magistrates Court by way of a private criminal prosecution... Alternatively, legal action may be taken via the Civil Procedure in the County Court..."

This falsely implies that the operator can choose between criminal prosecution and civil litigation.

A breach of Byelaw 14 is a criminal matter only. There is no contractual or statutory basis for issuing a civil claim in the county court for a breach of a statutory byelaw. If the operator wishes to pursue a criminal penalty, it must lay information before a magistrates’ court within 6 months as per Magistrates' Courts Act 1980, s.127(1).

The hybrid “pay us or we might prosecute—or sue you in the County Court” message is legally incoherent and is a deliberate attempt to pressure payment by suggesting multiple enforcement routes that do not exist.

A breach of Railway Byelaw 14 is a summary-only criminal offence. No civil liability arises unless the alleged breach can be framed as a separate contractual matter, which this notice does not do.

2. False or Ambiguous Authority for Data Access

"...your data has been released by the DVLA as our client has reasonable cause... Their records indicate you were the registered keeper on the date the offence was committed."

This implies the DVLA released data on the basis of an established offence, not merely a suspected breach. The language is misleading because:

• The operator has not proven an offence has occurred.
• No conviction exists.
• The DVLA provides data under Regulation 27(1)(e) for reasonable cause, but not for enforcement of hypothetical or presumed criminal offences.

Using DVLA data for private enforcement of alleged criminal offences — especially in a case where no prosecution has been commenced — must be very carefully justified. The language used here is legally sloppy and arguably exceeds what is permitted under the KADOE contract with DVLA.

3. Misuse of the Term "Penalty"

"The above penalty is now due..."

This uses the term “penalty” as if it is a fixed fine backed by law, when in fact:

• No court has imposed a fine.
• No legal process has occurred.
• A Penalty Notice of this kind is a voluntary out-of-court disposal with no legal compulsion to pay unless or until the matter is prosecuted and proven.

Any notice demanding payment for an alleged breach must clearly state that payment is voluntary and does not constitute an admission of guilt or a statutory penalty, unless such a penalty has been lawfully imposed by a court. Failure to provide this information constitutes a misleading commercial practice under Sections 225 to 229 of the Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024, and may also involve an omission of material information prohibited under Section 227:

• Section 226 covers false or misleading information, deceptive presentation, and confusion with other traders
• Schedule 20 of the DMCC Act (Banned Practices) includes falsely claiming to have authority to impose fines or penalties

4. Reference to “Additional Costs” Lacks Legal Basis

Additional costs will be incurred should the case progress through either the Civil or Magistrates courts."

In a criminal case, prosecution costs may be awarded upon conviction — but:

• That’s a matter for the court to decide, not the private operator.
• In civil claims, no claim can be brought for a byelaw breach unless an entirely separate contractual cause of action exists (which this PN does not assert).

Suggesting additional costs may apply if payment is not made misleads the recipient into believing they must pay now to avoid a guaranteed penalty later — when in fact no legal process has even begun.

5. Lack of Clarity About Who “Our Client” Is

"...our Client has reasonable cause..."
"...our Client has the option to pursue you..."

Nowhere does the PN explicitly confirm who “our Client” is, or whether they are a Train Operating Company (TOC) or just a parking subcontractor.

For enforcement under Railway Byelaws to be valid:

• The prosecuting party must be the "relevant person" under Byelaw 24(1) — i.e. the TOC.
• A private parking contractor must clearly state it is acting on behalf of the TOC, and not purport to act in its own right.
• Failure to do so is unlawfully exercising a public function and renders the notice misleading and unenforceable.

So, in summary... The Penalty Notice issued by SABA contains a number of serious legal deficiencies. It misrepresents the available enforcement mechanisms by implying that both criminal prosecution and civil action are viable for a single statutory byelaw offence, when in fact only prosecution in a magistrates’ court is lawfully available. The reference to an “offence” having already been committed is misleading, as no such determination has been made by a court.

Furthermore, the notice fails to make clear whether the issuer is the relevant prosecuting authority under Byelaw 24(1), or acting with authority from a Train Operating Company (TOC). These ambiguities, along with the implied threat of additional costs and penalties absent a court process, breach the Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024 (DMCC), particularly under Section 226 and Schedule 20. Any such Penalty Notice must clearly and transparently distinguish between an actual court-imposed penalty and a voluntary offer to dispose of an alleged matter without formal prosecution.

You are a victim of fraud by false representation and it should be reported under the Fraud Act 2006 to the police. Do not use Action Fraud. You will need to contact your local police force Economic Crime unit although they my refer you to the British Transport Police. Mention The Fraud Act 2006, s.2 – Fraud by false representation.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #3 on: »
You should also make a formal complaint to the DVLA. Here’s how to make a DVLA complaint:

• Go to: https://contact.dvla.gov.uk/complaints
• Select: “Making a complaint or compliment about the Vehicles service you have received”
• Enter your personal details, contact details, and vehicle details
• Use the text box to summarise your complaint or insert a covering note
• You will then be able to upload a file (up to 19.5 MB) — this can be your full complaint or supporting evidence
That’s it.

The DVLA is required to record, investigate and respond to every complaint about a private parking company. If everyone who encounters a breach took the time to submit a complaint, we might finally see the DVLA take meaningful action—whether that means curtailing or removing KADOE access altogether.

For the text part of the complaint the webform could use the following:

Quote
I am submitting a formal complaint about the use of DVLA-supplied keeper data by SABA UK Ltd, BPA AOS member, in connection with a Penalty Notice issued for an alleged breach of Railway Byelaw 14.

The notice states: “An offence has been committed... our Client has the option to pursue you through the Magistrates Court by way of a private criminal prosecution. Alternatively, legal action may be taken via the Civil Procedure in the County Court...

This is legally false and deeply misleading. A breach of Railway Byelaw 14 is a summary-only criminal offence and can only be pursued via prosecution in the magistrates’ court. It is not a civil debt and cannot be recovered via the Civil Procedure Rules. No such debt exists unless a magistrates’ court convicts and imposes a fine.

SABA’s use of DVLA data to issue this hybrid criminal/civil threat is not only dishonest but arguably fraudulent within the meaning of the Fraud Act 2006, section 2 (fraud by false representation), as it misrepresents enforcement options with intent to secure payment.

Further, this conduct constitutes a misleading commercial practice under the Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024 (DMCC), which now governs unlawful and unfair trading. The threat of civil litigation for a criminal byelaw breach is simply a fiction invented to coerce payment.

I am not disputing the “reasonable cause” basis for the DVLA’s release of keeper data under Regulation 27(1)(e). I am asking whether the DVLA accepts that its data is being used to issue penalty demands that falsely suggest civil recovery is available, when only a criminal prosecution can apply.

This is a misuse of personal data obtained under KADOE and a manipulation of the statutory enforcement process. I ask that the DVLA refer this conduct to its compliance and enforcement team and confirm whether such notices are authorised and lawful use of DVLA data.

If not, I expect the DVLA to take appropriate enforcement steps against the company under the KADOE contract.

I have attached relevant supporting material with this statement. Please confirm receipt and provide a reference for this complaint. I am also happy to provide further information if required.

Name: [INSERT YOUR NAME]
Date: [INSERT DATE]

Make sure you upload a copy of the Penalty Notice, both sides.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #4 on: »
Hey, thanks for all that :-)

I was unaware of most/all of what you've covered until several days after the event, while I was just noodling aroung the forum not looking for anything specific, and discovered the other saba posts ('saba' not 'SABA', in deference to their naff graphics branding).

So, rather than just give them the finger, I thought I'd show a bit of willing, not knowing they, apparently, have no teeth.

Can I expect them to do nothing, or will they attempt to turn the screw? I'm pretty sure they will, but by how much, I have no idea. Or will the TOC prosecute me?? (Hahaha - I think...).

As you say, I've already expended considerable effort on this, but I'm pretty ****ed off, and I do fancy rattling some cages now. The DVLA business is easy, as you've given me the script. The fraud complaint will obviously take a fair amount of effort, but right now I feel like taking this on.

I totally promise to keep this updated, even if it means that I report back that I'm giving up because it's too difficult or time-consuming, or I've been too intimidated and succumbed to the pressure. I just hate threads where the OP diappears without trace.
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Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #5 on: »
Did you identify the driver when you made contact? You received the PN as the Keeper of the vehicle. There is no legal obligation on the Keeper to identify the driver. Even if you did identify the driver, inadvertently or otherwise, you won't be paying a penny to Saba.

They will try to scare you by sending debt recovery letters, usually from ZZPS. You can safely ignore ZZPS and any other debt collector. They are powerless to actually to anything except to try and persuade the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree to pay up out of ignorance and fear.

Of course, they cannot sue you in the county court because this is not a civil matter. I tis not a Parking Charge Notice (PCN issued under civil law. Also, they cannot and will mot take out a private criminal prosecution in the magistrates court because they are not a prosecuting authority and I will place however much anyone would care to bet that they have absolutely no authority from the Train Operating Company (TOC) to act on their behalf.

Even if they were to try, if they were successful, they would get no money from it as any fine is paid to the public purse, not their bank account. But of course they won't do that. Even if they did, they'd have no chance to be successful. In the magistrates court, the evidential burden is to beyond a reasonable doubt. Unlike the county court where it is on the balance of probabilities, they have to make their case that you are the "owner".

I suggest you try and find out who the owner of a vehicle is. They will say that it is the person in whose name the vehicle is registered. However, you only need to look at the front of your V5C document and read the very bold words which state "THIS DOCUMENT IS NOT PROOF OF OWNERSHIP". You could suggest they go check the register of 'vehicle owners', if there ever was such. thing, which there isn't. So, how do they prove 'ownership' beyond a reasonable doubt?

Nothing will come of this even if you ignore everything. The debt collector cannot sue you and Saba certainly won't as it would expose their fraudulent PN.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #6 on: »
No, I did not identify as the driver, nor the keeper. I referred to myself as 'I', as in 'I am the person trying to pay you' kind of thing. However, I have no idea if they have pics or vids of anyone entering or exiting the vehicle concerned.

Thanks for all the rest. It's somewhat amusing. I hope it stays that way! I know you are confident it will, but this is my first rodeo...

« Last Edit: July 26, 2025, 08:36:38 pm by martin_t »

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #7 on: »
You don't have to "identify" as the Keeper! They know you are the Keeper because they received your details from the DVLA. Of course you can identify as the Keeper. That is the whole point. The Keeper is known. The driver is unknown unless the Keeper blabs the drivers identity when there is no legal obligation to do so.

In future, should you ever find yourself in receipt of a PN to PCN from an unregulated private parking firm, you must always refer to the the driver in the third person. No "I did this or that", only "the driver did this or that".
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #8 on: »
Ah, yeah... I don't know how many times I read words to that effect - and yet  :-\

Stiil, I don't think anyone knows who the owner is!

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #9 on: »
I don't think anyone knows who the owner is!

How would anyone know who the owner is? unless the Keeper tells them, they have no idea. The Keeper is under no legal obligation to anyone who the owner is. Only the police could retire that for forensic investigation into a crime.

Minor parking contraventions were decriminalised over 20 years ago.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #10 on: »
Indeed.

Maybe saba would like to consult the freely available 'Register of Vehicle Owners'. Do you have contact details for such a thing  ;D

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #11 on: »
I received the standard response from DVLA a couple of days ago.

So, just for the record:


[/img]

[/img]

Or this (as the above doesn't seem to work - despite following the instructions)

https://imgur.com/a/zWkzp7T


DVLA level 2 response now?
« Last Edit: August 07, 2025, 09:13:01 pm by martin_t »

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #12 on: »
Usual DVLA fob-off. Send the following email to dvla.complaints@dvla.gov.uk and CC kadoeservice.support@dvla.gov.uk and yourself:

Quote
Subject: Step 2 Escalation – Misuse of DVLA Data by SABA UK Ltd – Reference 0413745

Dear Data Assurance Team,

DVLA Reference: 0413745
Date of DVLA Step 1 Response: 5 August 2025


I am writing to formally escalate my complaint to Step 2 of the DVLA complaints process, following the unsatisfactory response I received at Step 1.

My original complaint, dated 31 July 2025, concerned the misuse of DVLA-supplied vehicle keeper data by SABA Park Services UK Ltd, a British Parking Association (BPA) member operating under the Approved Operator Scheme (AOS). The penalty notice issued by SABA relates to an alleged breach of Railway Byelaw 14 and falsely asserts that, in addition to criminal prosecution, “legal action may be taken via the Civil Procedure in the County Court”.

This is factually and legally incorrect. A breach of Railway Byelaw 14 is a summary-only criminal offence, enforceable exclusively via prosecution in the Magistrates’ Court. There is no legal basis for recovery via civil litigation or the Civil Procedure Rules. The claim that a civil court route is available is not only misleading — it is a fiction invented to coerce payment.

The Step 1 response entirely failed to engage with the substance of this complaint. The following issues remain unresolved:

1. Failure to assess whether the use of DVLA data breaches the KADOE contract

The use of keeper data to send misleading notices falsely implying civil recovery is not authorised under Regulation 27(1)(e) of the Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) Regulations 2002 or under the KADOE contract. The data was supplied for a specific lawful purpose, not to facilitate misrepresentation of enforcement options.

2. Failure to respond to the question of lawfulness

I asked whether the DVLA accepts that keeper data is being used by SABA in connection with an enforcement route that is not legally available. The response merely reiterated standard policy on “reasonable cause,” ATA membership, and the BPA’s role, without addressing whether this particular usage is lawful, accurate, or contractually compliant.

3. Failure to confirm referral to compliance/enforcement team

I explicitly requested that the matter be referred to the DVLA’s compliance and enforcement team for investigation under the KADOE contract. The Step 1 response does not confirm whether any such referral was made.

4. Failure to consider data misuse under UK GDPR and section 171 of the Data Protection Act 2018

If keeper data is used for a purpose that was not lawful, fair or transparent, or used in a misleading and coercive manner, this may constitute a breach of data protection law. This aspect was entirely overlooked.

The DVLA's reliance on BPA membership as a safeguard is insufficient in this context. BPA membership cannot legitimise the misuse of personal data or override the statutory framework governing criminal offences. Moreover, the BPA is not a statutory regulator and does not have legal authority to determine the lawfulness of enforcement methods.

In summary, I am not seeking DVLA arbitration in a contractual dispute. I am raising concerns about the systematic misuse of DVLA-supplied data, which:

• misrepresents the legal status of a penalty notice,
• threatens enforcement methods not permitted under law, and
• thereby breaches the DVLA's own KADOE contract and possibly the UK GDPR.

I expect DVLA, as the data controller, to assess whether SABA's practices are compatible with the stated purposes for which the data was released, and to confirm whether the matter has been referred to its internal compliance or enforcement function.

Please treat this as a formal Step 2 complaint. I would appreciate confirmation of receipt and a timeline for your review.

Yours faithfully,

[Full name]

[Address or other identifying details, if needed to match the case]
[Optional: Attach the SABA notice again for reference]
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #13 on: »
An update...

DVLA Step 2 Escalation was emailed on 12/8/25. No response so far. Shocked! Shall I poke them?

First ZZPS money demand with menaces received on 22/8/25

Second ZZPS money demand with menaces seemingly posted on 8/9/25. Due to holidays from 8th to 23rd Sept, received on 23/9/25

« Last Edit: September 26, 2025, 04:31:55 pm by martin_t »
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Re: SABA, railway property, Penalty Notice to OWNER
« Reply #14 on: »
You should prompt the DVLA for a response to your step 2 complaint.

When you receive the letter from GCTT, their supposed "enforcement agents", have a look at the small print on the bottom of the letter if you want a laugh!

I think Deborah just hands the file to Tim (nice but dim) sitting next to her.

If it was me and I had the time, I'd be responding to these cretins and winding them up no end. Not because I have to but I enjoy the sport.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain