Author Topic: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park  (Read 2269 times)

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One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
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Hi Samaritans,

NTK issued. Driver was previously given the false impression that parking wasn't enforced there!

Apologies for late posting - (was abroad).

They state "failure to pay this charge within 28 days of the date of sending....". Is this a breach?


Today is final day of reduced charge.


Any guidance on appeal/next-steps much appreciated. Thanks

Contravention date: 2/5/2025

Location: https://maps.app.goo.gl/BZWfkBU39iqB9mEd9

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« Last Edit: May 23, 2025, 03:14:36 pm by holycow »

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Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #1 on: »
NTK issued. Driver was previously given the false impression that parking wasn't enforced there!

What does "...false impression that parking wasn't enforced..." mean? Were there no signs that make it clear that the location is private land and subject to parking terms and conditions?

What has the landowner or their managing agent said about this when the Keeper complained about the speculative invoice they received? Plan A is always the easiest way to get these cancelled.

There are some issues with the Notice to Keeper (NtK) in that it is not 100% PoFA compliant. Because of that, the known Keeper cannot be liable for the actions of the unknown driver. You'd have a hard time convincing OPS or the IAS of that, but you'd have a good chance if they pursue this all the way to court.

You seem focused on the mugs discount. So before I provide any more advice, you need to decide whether you want to fight this all the way, as that is your only option with an IPC member.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #2 on: »
The club closed a few months ago so they can't cancel it.

An acquaintance previously suggested to the driver that parking was free.

I'm willing to fight this if there is a reasonable chance of winning. I've won several PCN appeals against councils and parking firms in the past but these were several years ago and I'm not sure where things stand these days.

Thanks for your input.

https://www.barkinganddagenhampost.co.uk/news/24916178.dagenham-may-baker-sports-social-club-closes-suddenly/

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #3 on: »
Is or was May & Baker Club the landowner?
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #4 on: »
Is or was May & Baker Club the landowner?

I believe they were the owners.

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #5 on: »
Are you sure? The key issue here is whether the parking operator still has valid authority to operate and issue Parking Charge Notices (PCNs) at the May & Baker Club car park following the dissolution of the landowner entity (May & Baker).

Core Legal Principles:

1. Authority to Operate Must Come from the Landowner or Authorised Agent

Under the Private Parking Code of Practice and relevant case law (e.g. ParkingEye v Beavis), a parking operator must demonstrate they have sufficient legal authority (usually in the form of a contract) from the landowner or a party with legal interest in the land.

2. Dissolution of the Landowner

If May & Baker were the legal owner of the land and they are now dissolved, then:

• Any contract they entered into with the parking operator may be void, expired, or unenforceable.
• Authority cannot be continued unless it has been explicitly transferred to another entity with control or ownership of the land.

3. Residual or Successor Interests

There are several possible outcomes:

• If the land has been sold or transferred, the new owner would need to grant fresh authority to the parking operator.
• If no such transfer has occurred and the land is now held by the Crown (bona vacantia), then no party has authority to authorise the operator unless explicitly licensed by the Crown (via the Treasury Solicitor).

4. Implications for the PCN

If the operator cannot prove current authority to manage the site, issue tickets, and pursue them, any PCN issued is likely unenforceable. This would constitute a lack of standing.

What to Do:

No appeal has a chance of success. This would've to be fought in court. However, in order to mark your territory you should at least appeal the PCN on the basis that the operator lacks authority:

• Request a copy of the contract or agreement authorising them to issue PCNs at the site.
• Ask for confirmation of the current landowner or controlling party.
• Note that if May & Baker were the principal and are now dissolved, authority must derive from someone else—if not, the operator is acting ultra vires (beyond their powers).

This is best challenged once litigation is initiated by citing lack of landowner authority and requesting strict proof of standing.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #6 on: »
I've done a bit of digging and have learned that the local council actually owns the land. Apologies

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #7 on: »
I've done a bit of digging and have learned that the local council actually owns the land. Apologies

In light of this new information, any pointers on the appeal much appreciated.

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #8 on: »
You should appeal to challenge standing, but now reflecting that the council may have always owned the land:

Quote
I dispute this Parking Charge on the basis that [OPERATOR NAME] lacks legal authority to operate on this site.

It is understood that the land at the former May & Baker Club is owned by the local council. If your authority to issue PCNs derives from a contract with May & Baker (who were merely a tenant and have since been dissolved), then such authority has lapsed.

I require:

• A copy of your current contract or agreement that authorises enforcement on this land.
• Confirmation of whether your agreement was granted directly by the council, as the landowner.
• If no such contract exists with the landowner or their managing agent, your enforcement activity is ultra vires and the PCN must be cancelled.

I do not consent to further contact unless in compliance with pre-action protocol. I reserve all rights.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #9 on: »
Founded around 80 years ago, the club was transferred by the pharmaceutical company which had owned the site to Barking and Dagenham Council in 2013.

The club was leased out to be run by the May and Baker Eastbrook Community Club, a charitable trust
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Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #10 on: »
So we then have the question "does the charitable trust still exist?"
Bus driving since 1973. My advice, if you have a PSV licence, destroy it when you get to 65 or you'll be forever in demand.

Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #11 on: »
I doubt it.
Should I wait until the 28th day to appeal?


Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #13 on: »
Doesn't really matter at this stage, OPS area a nasty, vexatious bunch of ex-clamper thugs that will reject ny appeal and as they are IPC members, an IAS appeal is about as useful as a poke n the arm with a sharp stick!

Only once this goes to litigation will anyone be able to force OPS to reveal what contractual rights they ay or may not hold. Knowing OPC, they will fail to conclude the process, so we'll never know.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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Re: One parking solution - May & Baker club car park
« Reply #14 on: »
They rejected the appeal but re-offered the discount,  even though I was well outside the discount period when I appealed! Lol

Any pointers for the IAS appeal much appreciated 🙏🏻

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« Last Edit: June 07, 2025, 05:34:41 am by holycow »