Author Topic: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment  (Read 132 times)

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pcnhelp123

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Hi asked about this from a friend who is RK.



Location:

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4910153,-0.1171361,3a,63.1y,12.39h,91.28t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s3AJXqDOxkBHaQxGMeru7sQ!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D-1.2773961623675092%26panoid%3D3AJXqDOxkBHaQxGMeru7sQ%26yaw%3D12.388096455522211!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDIxMi4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

Driver was dropping someone off to what seems like a permit holders parking only. Stayed in the car for a bit over 26 minutes. Reason given is failed to make payment for visitor parking.

Is there any case to appeal here? Thanks

« Last Edit: February 15, 2025, 03:42:37 am by pcnhelp123 »

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DWMB2

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2025, 08:22:51 am »
Welcome to FTLA.
To help us provide the best advice, please read the following thread carefully and provide as much of the information it asks for as you are able to: READ THIS FIRST - Private Parking Charges Forum guide

In addition to what you've shared it would be useful to see:
  • The Notice to Driver that was on the windscreen
  • Photos of the signage at the site, including ones showing their layout and prominence
  • If any appeal has thus far been submitted

It would be ideal if your friend could post here himself. Where people post on behalf of someone they know, it often has a tendency to turn into Chinese Whispers.

b789

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2025, 01:12:53 pm »
In addition to the Notice to Driver (NtD) that was affixed to the vehicle at the time of the alleged contravention, we need to see the actual postal Notice to Keeper (NtK) that was sent. What you have shown is the reminder to the NtK, which is not very useful for us to determine any liability.

On what date was the original NtK issued?
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

pcnhelp123

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - London - Parking without permit/payment
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2025, 11:09:47 pm »
Welcome to FTLA.
To help us provide the best advice, please read the following thread carefully and provide as much of the information it asks for as you are able to: READ THIS FIRST - Private Parking Charges Forum guide

In addition to what you've shared it would be useful to see:
  • The Notice to Driver that was on the windscreen
  • Photos of the signage at the site, including ones showing their layout and prominence
  • If any appeal has thus far been submitted

It would be ideal if your friend could post here himself. Where people post on behalf of someone they know, it often has a tendency to turn into Chinese Whispers.
No appeal has been submitted yet but he did call them up and identify himself as the registered keeper, asking them for the original notice which was later found.

Unfortunately google maps doesn't show the signage in detail nor does it go further into the estate. On google maps I can barely make out it says "PRIVATE LAND PERMIT HOLDERS" on the sign into the road.

There was no notice on the windscreen. The NTK was received in the post, the entry and exit times were caught on ANPR. The driver stayed in the car for around 26 minutes then left.

I will upload the first notice shortly, I was told it was received sometime in January. Let me know if this is not enough information to make an appeal, I will let him know as he has left it quite late.

b789

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2025, 08:28:50 am »
We definitely need to see the original Parking Charge Notice (PCN) because that NtK reminder clearly states that “A PARKING CHARGE WAS ISUED TO DRIVER”.

That could only mean that an NtD was issued.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

DWMB2

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2025, 10:45:05 am »
At risk of repeating myself:
Quote
It would be ideal if your friend could post here himself. Where people post on behalf of someone they know, it often has a tendency to turn into Chinese Whispers.
The original notice will hopefully bring some clarity.

pcnhelp123

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2025, 04:40:16 am »
We definitely need to see the original Parking Charge Notice (PCN) because that NtK reminder clearly states that “A PARKING CHARGE WAS ISUED TO DRIVER”.

That could only mean that an NtD was issued.


Here is the original PCN.

The person is not able to post here as he is not computer/forum literate.

Thanks

b789

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Re: Capital Car Park Control PCN - Lambeth, London - Parking without payment
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2025, 11:52:16 am »
Why have you removed the reminder notice that you originally posted? Also, why have you redacted the times on the NtK?

You only need to redact your personal details, the PCN number and the VRM. Everything else needs to be visible. In this instance, the PCN reminder needs to be seen because of the misleading wording on it.

Also show the back of the notices too.

The NtK says there are additional images available at https://capitalcarparkcontrol.co.uk so please check and tell/show us what they have.

This NtK is a complete shambles, failing both PoFA and the Private Parking Single Code of Practice (PPSCoP) in multiple ways.

The NtK clearly states: “Liability for the Parking Charge Notice lies with the vehicle displayed below” which is legally meaningless. A vehicle cannot be liable. Liability can only fall on an individual (driver or, under PoFA, the Keeper if compliant).

This wording , because of its prominence, fundamentally undermines any attempt to transfer liability to the Keeper.

PoFA 9(2)(f) requires the NtK to specify that "the charge must be paid within 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given" (which is presumed to be two working days after posting). Instead, very clearly and prominently, the NtK states: “PAYMENT MUST BE MADE WITHIN 28 DAYS OF THE ISSUE OF THIS NOTICE” which is incorrect. This wording shortens the statutory payment deadline and is therefore non-compliant.

At no point, as far as I can see, does it state who the creditor is? PoFA 9(2)(h) requires the "name of the creditor" to be clearly identified. While the NtK references Capital Car Park Control Ltd as part of the postal address for payments to be sent, it does not explicitly identify them as the creditor. This omission is another clear PoFA failure.

There are also multiple PPSCoP breaches/failures, not limited to but including:

1. Incorrect Payment Deadline – Breach of Section 10.1 (Note)

The NtK falsely states that “PAYMENT MUST BE MADE WITHIN 28 DAYS OF THE ISSUE OF THIS NOTICE”. However, the PPSCoP requires that the deadline be 28 days from the date of "receipt" of the NtK (which is presumed to be two working days after the issue date).

PPSCoP Section 10.1 states:

“A parking charge becomes overdue after the expiry of the 28 days where payment is required or, once the appeals process has been completed and the time to pay at the full rate has passed.”

This means no enforcement action (including debt recovery) can commence before the expiry of the appeal period. The operator’s incorrect deadline misleads recipients into believing they have less time to appeal and unfairly pressures payment.

2. Ludicrous Claim That the "Vehicle" is Liable – Breach of Section 9.1(a)

The NtK boldly states:

“Liability for the Parking Charge Notice lies with the vehicle displayed below”.

This is a complete legal absurdity. A vehicle cannot enter into a contract, nor can it be liable for anything.

Nowhere in the PPSCoP does it permit a vehicle to be the liable party. This error undermines the entire notice and raises questions about the operator's competence in issuing parking charges.

3. Failure to Identify the Driver as the Liable Party – Breach of Section 8.2

The NtK wording of the alleged contravention is legally and grammatically nonsensical:

"The notice is served to the Keeper for the alleged contravention of: Parking in an area contravening the displayed parking conditions namely: Failed to make payment for visitor parking to cover the full duration of your visit and/or within the time stated on signage or where a resident permit is required., therefore contractually agreeing to pay the displayed amount."

This rambling attempt at legal jargon is legally ambiguous and fails to identify the driver as the liable party or clarify how or when any contract was formed or adequately state what specific action allegedly caused a breach.

PPSCoP Section 8.2 states:

"Where a Notice to Keeper is issued it must be clear that liability for the Parking Charge lies with the driver of the vehicle unless the keeper has been successfully pursued using the provisions in Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012."

The NtK does not clarify this distinction, meaning it fails to comply with Section 8.2.

Additionally, the PPSCoP mandates transparency and clarity in all communications under Section 8.3, which states:
 
"Operators must take all reasonable steps to ensure that notices are properly served and that wording used is not misleading or confusing."

The NtK's wording is confusing and fails to meet this requirement.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain