3. Private (?) car sale gone wrong
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Private (?) car sale gone wrong
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Hi All,

I have started a thread with Legal Beagles forum however so far has been a very minimal engagement and hopefully something more or ideas, opinions will be possible to be found here please.

My friend's son has gotten into trouble with a private car sale even though he was advised by his parents not to buy the car.

The car purchase took on 4th May. The advert said the car was fully serviced just 4 months ago and MOT history shows car passed MOT on 23 April. Parents had serious questions about the car and took the car to independent garage for a detailed overview. The results came back shocking as amount of major and minor faults clearly indicate the car is not roadworthy and should not be on the road. The garage says there is no way the car would have passed MOT unless they were paid some money to close their eyes.

Friend's son has tried speaking to the seller but was told that it was sold as seen and to leave seller alone. The son sent a message to the seller yesterday pointing out issues with the sale stating that if no car return will take place then matter will be taken to court. The seller replied with a long message stating there innocence and willingness to fully defned this even if it goes to court.

We do understand that private car sales are can be dangerous but I don't think son expected such a fraudulent sale where the car is not roadworthy but was presented as a good car. The sale advert is cleverly written and the only way maybe to get this is to push on the full service / MOT issue where it is clear that car is not roadworthy and seller would have known this?

We know that normally private car sale is as good as seen but there are completely different matters when the car is not roadworthy and all minor/major faults would have been there when the car was purchased. Also MOT historic mileage looks raises some questions.

Any additional ideas please? I attach the pictures of two adverts (later one was slightly adjusted to remove the paintwork required bit), MOT history, independent car garage fault list, communication with the seller and their response.

https://imgur.com/a/c326HHi
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #1 on: »
Someone from Legal Beagles were quick to point out that it sounds that this probably was not a private car sale as things seemed to be quite out of place. So I have done a little bit more digging into seller Facebook market place.

Ok, so far I have managed to find that he had some cars and some car parts for sale on Facebook market over last few years . I personally think he buys cars on auction in his spare time and tries to re-sell them as a private trader. Especially the way some of them were described on his adverts. Also, he has and had few listings of spare car parts such as BMW 6 series F11 F12 steering wheel, BMW M6 rear diffuser carbon fibre, BMW 6 series tail rear lights, Nissan Juke bumper, Mercedes C class bonnet, 4x wheels from BMW X5. BMW M6 diffuser, steering wheel and rear lights are in simple packaging which means they were used and taken off the car rather than sold in an original packaging.

A little bit more about those car adverts.

Mercedes that my friends son purchased was listed 22 days ago and original advert was listed 4 months ago.

Listed 2 months ago- 2018 Peugeot expert van which he claims had it for over a year now as an electrician but is selling it as purchased a new one.

Listed 3 months ago - 2016 Ford C-Max (CAT N) Sold now

Listed 4 months ago - original advert for Mercedes that my friends son purchased.

Listed over a year ago - 2012 Toyota Aygo . Very interesting as he says the following on the advert: ''selling it because this is my first car and I have purchased another one''. Sold

Listed over a year ago - 2020Peugot 308. Mot until March 2025, 1 owner. Sold

Listed over a year ago - 2017 Fiat 500X. The description says: ''You are looking at my Fiat which I am selling as I have purchased a new car. 2 keys and 3 owners inc me''. Probably forgot in above Toyota listing where he said that 2012 Toyota was his first car.

Listed over a year ago - 2011 BMW 640i - sold, CAT C. The advert stated ''Time for me to move on to better things. A lot of passion and money went into building this car.'' Sold
I am not sure if moving from BMW 640 into Fiat 500X could be considered moving onto better things.

Listed 2 years ago - 2012 BMW 320d. Advert states the following: ''It's my personal car. I’ve had it for almost 4 years now. Never had a single mechanical problem as it's been looked after very well.'' Sold

Listed 2 years ago - 2008 Honda Civic, 1 owner. Sold

Listed 2 years ago - 2010 Toyota Avensis, Sold.

Listed 5 years ago - 2011 Ford Fiesta (only added this to the list as claimed Toyota Aygo was his first car)

This is only what I found on Facebook market. Who knows if he used any other website like autotrader or gumtree or ebay....

Here is the link for a quick overview of his listings on Facebook market - https://imgur.com/a/5mUGmTD

Now taking all this into consideration should my friends son contact him with relevant information and request a refund once again, or would it better to report all of this to relevant parties like police, trading standards, dvla (false mot), etc

Any opinion or input would be greatly appreciated.
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #2 on: »
Trading standards?
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I am not qualified to give legal advice in the UK. While I will do my best to help you, you should not rely on my advice as if it was given by a lawyer qualified in the UK.
Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #3 on: »
Definitely go to trading standards, he appears to be a dealer masquerading as a Private seller.  A call to HMRC would not go amiss.

If it was me, I'd be inclined to write to him, stating that as far as you can see, he is a dealer, that you are reporting this to both the trading Standards and HMRC and demanding your money back.  Also report the garage who carried out the MOT to VOSA.

If he doesn't give your son his money back then take him to the small claims court.
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #4 on: »
yep agree with all of the above. make sure you document all the evidence properly.
I would approach the seller with the ultimatum of a full refund or you will do the above. first consideration is to back the car and get the money.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2025, 01:00:15 pm by mickR »
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Quote from: andy_foster
Mick, you are a very, very bad man
Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #5 on: »
Quote from: mickR on May 25, 2025, 12:57:18 pm
... a full refund or you will do the above...
Whether the OP gets their money back or not, they should still actually do the above (reporting to the various bodies) anyway, so there's at least a faint chance the dodgy dealer might be stopped from this behaviour.
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #6 on: »
OP, how much are we talking about £££ wise?

How old was the buyer when the vehicle was purchased?

The sale advert is cleverly written and the only way maybe to get this is to push on the full service / MOT issue where it is clear that car is not roadworthy and seller would have known this?

Why? Bought as is with the seller affirming that the car had a valid MOT.

According to you, this is correct. IMO, you are not in a position to ascribe knowledge to the seller regarding the car's condition on the day of sale.

The rest is the buyer's risk IMO unless you can show that the MOT was obtained fraudulently or even not issued at all. VOSA should be contacted (as already advised  y another poster) with a copy of the subsequent inspection report. IMO, keep this simple: car bought *** with a valid MOT which VOSA's records show was issued by **** on ****. The vehicle was subsequently inspected by ****(their credentials??) and a copy of their report is included as is their opinion as to whether the evident damage which falls within the scope of an MOT test could have been occasioned in the period of *** weeks since its MOT. You have reason to believe that the MOT certificate was issued improperly and possibly fraudulently. Would they please investigate.

IMO, as regards the seller the buyer shouldn't make idle threats about engaging with the civil court procedures until you have clear and provable(on the balance of probabilities) particulars of claim.
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #7 on: »
Quote from: Korting on May 23, 2025, 09:31:17 pm
Also report the garage who carried out the MOT to VOSA.

VOSA is no more. It was absorbed into DVSA many years ago.
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #8 on: »
From personal experience o buying a used car from an online seller last year, I've found a number of them are traders who masquerade as private sellers. One of those I had the misfortune to do a deal with last year was almost begging me not to get trading standards involved. I got most of my money back within a short spce of time.

The car I eventually settled on, quite a distance from the above dealer, another one masquerading as a private seller on a flashy legit-looking website. The sales invoice which he wanted me to sign was cleverly worded. I was aware that although the car had a very recent MoT, there would be things that are known to wear out after a certain mileage and was prepared for those expenses. But the MoT is only valid until the car emerges from the test lane at the testing garage.

County Courts take a dim view of such activities.
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #9 on: »
A local firm does this. "Selling cars on behalf of their customers".

Right...
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Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #10 on: »
I do know a all independent car sales showroom who do exactly that
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Quote from: andy_foster
Mick, you are a very, very bad man
Re: Private (?) car sale gone wrong
« Reply #11 on: »
Sorry to hear this.

The MOT link you provided shows it failed on a missing wheel nut which was rectified the same day.

I'd be interested to know what, in the eyes of the independent assessor, makes the car unroadworthy.  If it was tyre damage then of course that would easily be batted back as "Well! It wasn't like that when I sold it".

I agree with others that it does certainly look like a trader masquerading as a private seller and I hope you have screenshots of all the other vehicles he has sold before now. A good liar will wriggle themselves out of most corners I imagine.

I don't think the Police will be interested but it is certainly worth making calls to Trading Standards and DVSA. I'd doubt TS will act on one call. They are more likely to want to hear more than one complaint unless it is sufficiently serious but action could be slow.  DVSA are more likely to be hot on a garage overlooking things but I am not sure they can offer your friends' son any real assistance.
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