Author Topic: Court claim for alleged damage  (Read 244 times)

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oscar21

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Court claim for alleged damage
« on: November 07, 2024, 06:27:11 pm »
Just like busses, they all come at once. I already have a court claim regarding a private parking ticket on the go at the moment and I'm dealing with this one as well.

Basically I was doing some work on the outside of a building as part of my job, I was under the instruction of the building tenant and I was fitting something to the outside of it. The building is a commercial unit and as I was driving a screw home it went through a gas pipe on the inside of the wall, basically it was in the cavity of the wall, as the pipe was before the meter we had to call Cadent out to repair it. They have since issued an invoice for the damage cause for about £800 which I didn't pay and they have now taken it to court.

I did put a defence in and its now time for the DQ part, the bit I'm stuck on is a reason for having the hearing in person.

The scenario is the pipe was completely hidden inside the wall, its a double skinned metal wall full of insulation. There was no way of knowing there was a gas pipe inside the wall and on every other unit on the estate any gas pipe supplies are on the outside. Even the grid in the tarmac marked "G" didn't have anything inside it apart from soil. I also knew for a fact that the building wasn't supplied by gas as I fitted all the electric heaters and electric water heater to it a few months ago.

When the first guy from Cadent showed up he reckoned we wouldn't be liable and it was just one of those things but later on when one of their managers showed up he said the exact opposite (I had left site by then, the owner of the building reckoned he was a bit of an idiot really) My defence was based on the fact that I wasn't negligent in any way so wasn't liable for the bill at all.

The also have my name wrong on the court papers despite filling it in correctly on like, my name is "Joe Bloggs trading as JB Electrical but they have it as Joe Floggs trading as JF Electrical (not real). Does that make any difference?

This is what I wrote for my defence. I thought they might drop things at this stage,

"In reference to the claim against me although damage occurred to
Cadents pipework, no negligence was involved. The pipework was
completely hidden from view inside a metal wall which I was
instructed to fasten a vehicle charger to.

There was no way to know any sort of pipework was inside the wall,
especially as the building didn't even have a gas connection
present. Also on every other building on the same estate the
pipework was external to the building where you could quite
clearly see it, another reason to assume there was nothing there.

As for the claim for the damage, Cadent didn't even repair the
damaged pipework, they just cut the supply off in the ground
outside the building as the supply was not needed, I don't believe
they normally charge for this service if a supply isn't needed
anymore.

I also checked the various grids for the gas stop-tap outside the
building and couldn't find one, yet another reason to assume there
wasn't any gas supply present to the building.

I was also working under instruction from the building owner or
tenant who specifically stated the position he wanted the charger,
maybe the claim should be against that person and not me.

Lastly I wish to reiterate that for this claim to be successful
there needs to be negligence on the part of myself and for the
various reasons stated above I don't believe there is and on that
basis I ask that the claim is struck out."



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mickR

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2024, 07:33:18 pm »
I thought it was regulation now that gas pipes HAD to be run on the outside of buildings until an entry point closest to the internal appliance

andy_foster

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2024, 07:37:55 pm »
If the building owner was suing you for negligence, then I would say that you have pretty much nailed the defence.

However, reading between the lines, you are being sued by a service provider that you contracted (albeit informally) to provide a service, and refused to pay.

Perhaps we could start with the particulars of claim, etc.?
I am responsible for the accuracy of the information I post, not your ability to comprehend it.

oscar21

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2024, 07:56:24 pm »
I thought it was regulation now that gas pipes HAD to be run on the outside of buildings until an entry point closest to the internal appliance

They certainly do on residential buildings, not sure about commercial, but when we removed the cladding (cladding was fixed and shouldn't really be removeable but it was an emergency) it was the same gas pipe as what was external on the other units but it had been cladded over for some reason, making it invisible. It is the sort of pipe you see externally all over the country, it has a square tap on the top that is used as an emergency cutoff. like this.

 

oscar21

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2024, 07:57:56 pm »
If the building owner was suing you for negligence, then I would say that you have pretty much nailed the defence.

However, reading between the lines, you are being sued by a service provider that you contracted (albeit informally) to provide a service, and refused to pay.

Perhaps we could start with the particulars of claim, etc.?

Thanks for the relies, This is a copy of the claim, they are definitely suing for negligence.




mickR

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2024, 08:09:17 pm »
what does their invoice say? can you post it up.

andy_foster

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2024, 10:02:01 pm »
And this "full details of the negligence" which "have been provided"?
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oscar21

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2024, 10:00:05 am »
And this "full details of the negligence" which "have been provided"?

The claim form is the only thing that came in the bundle, I have previously been sent a couple of pictures by cadent along with their invoice but they just showed a pipe with a small hole in it with the wall cladding removed, which I took off myself.

The claim form comes from the court though, wouldn't that be the only thing the court sent me even if cadent have sent copies of the pictures to the court, I'm not sure how it works. Does the court send everything they get to me?

As for my original question though, how can I word the bit where you ask for a physical hearing as opposed to "doing it on the papers", if indeed that is the right way to go about it. The DQ has to be in by the end of today.

Thanks

mickR

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2024, 10:35:44 am »
wheres the invoice we asked for??
we have no idea what work they are claiming to have done. you said they just "cut off the supply" if do they didn't do any repair work????
are you saying they haven't provided "full details of negligence"??

oscar21

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2024, 11:24:12 am »
I haven't got access to the invoice and pictures until Monday, they are at the office and I've been working away all week, I might be able to get someone to go down in  a bit and get a copy. I know I should have got on top of this earlier but I've just been so busy work wise, regardless I need to file the N180 document today.

The invoice was mainly for site visits by their staff to initially come out and do a safety check and also for digging the hole and filling it in again. I don't think they invoiced for a repair as they obviously didn't repair anything.

What they did do after I phoned them was send a guy out just to assess the situation and make sure nothing was going to blow up, I actually stopped the leak by screwing the screw back into the pipe which sealed it so the actual leak was minimal. He then reported back to his manager and they sent a team out to dig the car park up and cap off the supply in the street. They then returned a week or so later and filled the hole back in. This is what they are charging for.

Apparently there was still a gas meter on the inside of the building in a cupboard on the other side of the wall but nothing was attached to the outgoing side as it was an all electric setup. This meter has now been removed by cadent when they diconnected it.

Shouldn't they have supplied invoice and picutre copies with the defence bundle though.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2024, 11:29:53 am by oscar21 »

Dave Green

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Re: Court claim for alleged damage
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2024, 10:42:41 am »
As you were doing the work as part of your paid employment, do you have any public liability insurance in place?