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Messages - stevec

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I've now received the latest response from Lambeth Council.
As they did last time, they have rejected the grounds of the signage not being clear, which was to be expected.
However, they make no reference at all to the grounds of their not having the right to transfer liability.

Do I submit a third appeal and draw their attention specifically to those grounds?



2
Apologies for not being clear in my last post.

It's scenario 1; the PCN was addressed to my LLC and yes, I made the representation without specifying my position and authority at the company.

So should I resubmit the same representation as before but stating I am representing the LLC in my capacity as director?

Is it still worth submitting the 'signage not clear' grounds, given they have already rejected that?
Or should I just go with the "council did not have the right to transfer liability" grounds?

3
Actually, no, the name on the PCN is my limited company and the PCN was sent first to the registered office address before it was forwarded to me at my home address. Didn't really think of that when I submitted he representation....

I'm a director of the limited company but the registered keeper is the lease company so I can't submit an representation on their behalf.
However, as the PCN was sent to my limited company, can I resubmit the representation as a director of that company? Or will that not help my argument that the PCN should not have been transferred to me?

4
I received the following response today from Lambeth Council via post. As you suspected @mrmustard, they have rejected the grounds of inadequate signage.

Regarding the point of their right to transfer liability, they actually start the letter by saying they are unable to consider a representation from a third party, given I am effectively unknown to them as the registered keeper of the car will be the leasing company.

They say they have put the case on hold for 14 days to allow the registered keeper to make the representations on my behalf or make the discount payment of £65.
Given the leasing company will not do that; as far as they're concerned, liability for any parking fines are my responsibility under the leasing contract; what should my next step be?




5
I made my representations yesterday evening, using both points advised by @mrmustard.
When I submitted it, a message was displayed saying "Unfortunately, we have been unable to send a copy of your challenge by email. Your challenge has been logged and will be processed by one of our officers promptly".

Not sure why they were unable to send an email but I assume I'll receive a response by post. I shall update this thread here when I do.

Thanks both to @mrmustard and @Hippocrates for your help so far!

6
ah, I see. So I should just go ahead and submit that via the 'informal challenge' option on their website?

7
Wow, this is amazing @mrmustard, thank you!
What would your confidence levels be of an appeal on these grounds being successful?

How do I go about making those representations? Is there any point in my going through the informal challenge or will they simply reject it because it's a 'moving traffic violation'?

That being the case, do I need to wait until I have been issued a reminder then make the formal appeal?

8
@Hippocrates, ah, I see I did not read it closely enough and managed to miss the wording "You cannot make an informal challenge against a moving traffic or postal PCN".  As ours is a moving traffic violation, it seems we cannot make an informal challenge.


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Thanks for the homework @Hippocrates  :) . I see that if I make the informal challenge within 14 days from the date of issue, I will receive a discounted rate if my challenge is unsuccessful. So I have until October 17th to do this.

@mrmustard, the car is on a business contract hire lease which I tried to attach but got an 'upload folder is full' error so could post it to imgur and embed the links here if that would help.

It is a 48 month lease, due to end on 5/02/25.
Clause 5.2 states that "The Customer agrees to indemnify the Lessor from any fines, fees, charges, invoices or penatlies resulting from motoring offences or violation of traffic or parking regulations or restrictions".
I'm guessing this is not what you would have been looking for though?

I definitely count myself among those who want to fight as I hate paying PCNs, but if it seems like there is little chance of successfully challenging one, I'd prefer to pay the discounted amount than the full amount.

Any advice you can give will be gratefully received!

11
Got it.. thanks both of you for your replies!

Here is the front page of the PCN:



And here is a link to the location: https://maps.app.goo.gl/kVNdkEggoFyXBhmB7

On your point about not paying the PCN without first trying a representation, I thought if you appealed and were rejected, you ended up having to pay the full £130 rather than the discounted £65. Is that not the case?

12
Hi All,

We have just received a PCN for exactly the same contravention described in this thread (52 Failing to comply with a prohibition on certain types of vehicles) i.e. turning into New Park Road (D), recorded on August 26th.

@cp8759, I'm tagging you as you made the last posts to the other thread in May this year. From those, it looks like the once solid defence of Lambeth not having GLA consent is no longer valid, at least until March 2025.

If I have understood that correctly, is there any other chance of appealing this PCN or should I cough up while it's still in the discounted period?

Thanks!
Steve

13
Hello All,

We have just received a PCN for exactly the same contravention described in this thread i.e. turning into New Park Road (D), recorded on August 26th.

From the last messages, it looks like the once solid defence of Lambeth not having GLA consent is no longer valid, at least until March 2025.

Have I understood correctly?
Is there any other chance of appealing it or should I cough up while it's still in the discounted period?

Thanks!
Steve

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