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Messages - kingsy

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Here are:

The Birmingham City Council (Off-Street Parking Places) Order 2018
The Birmingham City Council (Birmingham City Council (Off-Street Parking Places) Order 2018) (Variation) (No.1) Order 2023

I've run the first one through OCR software so it can be searched, why local authorities don't do this with all their old paper-based orders is beyond me.

@kingsy how did your hearing go?

yeah had the hearing, nowhere near as bad as I thought it would be! He adjourned it as he wanted to consider whether he wanted to give the council a chance to respond to the evidence I uploaded at the last minute.

Either way he decided not to give council second chance and allowed my appeal simply on my account of the contravention in question and evidence I had of the ticket machine.

Thanks for your help!

TRO / New Charges evidence from the council for those concerned.

Rough skeleton argument:

I am appealing the PCN BM40615144 with the following main points:

1. There are compelling reasons why with the particular circumstances of the case that the authority should cancel the penalty charge according to Regulation 5 (2)(b)(ii)
2. The NoR served did not inform me of the capacity of the adjudicator to permit appeals after the 28 day period under Regulation 7(1)(b)
3. The NoR served did not indicate the nature of an adjudicator’s power to award costs according to Regulation 6 (6)(a)(ii).
4. NoR does not state that in addition to the grounds outlined in Regulation 5 (4) that a ‘compelling reasons’ argument can be made to cancel the penalty as stated in Regulation 5 (2)(b)(ii).

The compelling reasons as to why this particular charge should be canceled are as follows. On the night of the alleged contravention:
The one and only ticket machine for dispensing pay and display tickets was out of order (see Figure 2).
To the driver’s best knowledge there were no other methods of payment available at the time of the alleged contravention as it was almost pitch black in the area around the machine and sign due to the lighting being faulty and/or off.

In response the local authority argued that the details for the ‘pay by phone’ facility was printed on the machine and so there was an available method to pay and that I had examined the machine. I had never said I inspected the machine in any of my representations.

They also stated that the lighting was sufficient because in the enforcement officers photographs of the parked car, it shows that specific area where my car was lit. What they fail to mention is that the location of where the car was parked and the machine are not the same nor were there any machines located near where the car was parked, this has not been disputed by the local authority. It is quite possible for the car to be lit and the main parking machine and signage to be in darkness. This is backed up by the enforcement officer’s own image of the main sign (Figure 1.) and it shows that a strong flash was used when the picture was taken. If you also look at the image taken at the time when an attempt to purchase a ticket was made by the driver, it is clear that none of the machine’s features are visible at all except the backlit screen, clearly showing how dark it was in the area surrounding the machine.

It should be noted that the driver noted that the car park was more lit when they returned to their vehicle than when they initially first parked at around 1945. One reason for this is that at the time of parking, it was dusk and the automatic detectors for the lighting may not have turned the lighting on yet. This is important as the enforcement officer’s images were taken much later in the evening after 9 pm.

In addition to this, there is nothing on the sign itself to indicate that there are alternative methods to pay for a pay and display ticket nor has the authority given and proof that such information is on the pay and display ticket machine itself which they allege is present in the NoR.

According to Schedule 2  part 2 para. 13 of Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Representations and Appeals) Regulations 2022 an adjudicator is able to make costs under specific circumstances outlined here. According to Regulation 6 (6)(a)(ii) an authority, if it does not accept representations, its decision notice must “indicate the nature of an adjudicator’s power to award costs”. In the NoR that the authority, under section 4 the only references to the adjudicator’s power for awarding costs are the sentence “..costs are not normally awarded. Details about when an order for costs can be made can be found on the website”. A reasonable person would not be able to discern the nature of the adjudicator’s power to award costs and referring the reader to a website is not sufficient to meet Regulation 6 (6)(a)(ii) as it must be within the NoR.

The NoR it does not state that an adjudicator may extend the 28 days provided for lodging an appeal as provided by Regulation 7(1)(b) and while not required by any Regulation, existing Tribunal cases have accepted appeals on this point (see S. Sinclair vs London Borough of Lewisham, Case Ref 218033612A, 21 May 2018).

The only references to the 28-day limit are Page 2 of the NoR under heading 1. The reasons for rejecting your representations where it states in the last paragraph that “You have now 28 days from the date of this Notice of Rejection being served to pay the Penalty Charge or to appeal to an independent parking adjudicator (see below).” Later under section 4. How to appeal your decision, it states that “You should appeal before the end of the 28-days beginning with the delivery of this Notice of Rejection. Our website will explain this further.” Neither of these points clearly state the power of the adjudicator to extend this period.

Sinclair v Lewisham goes on to say, “a reasonable reader of the NoR would be unlikely to conclude that an adjudicator had the power to extend the 28 day period. That discretionary power is, in my view, an important component of appellate process and a power of which a potential appellant should be made aware.” It goes on to state in Miller v. London Borough of barnet (2170241413, 21 June 2017) another adjudicator, Mr. Chan held that “ was essential that a Notice of Rejection describes the power of potential extension to the 28 day limit.”. He went on to say that a NoR that does not contain this detail does not describe in general terms the form and manner in which an appeal to an adjudicator must be made, in accordance with Regulation 6(1)(c).

The ability to be able to appeal to an independent third-party is a fundamental component as highlighted in my previous point 3 by various previous adjudicators. Any reasonable person reading those statutory grounds for appeal would not be able to deduce that a ‘compelling reasons’ argument can be made for the penalty to be canceled under Regulation 5 (2)(b)(ii). This would in turn deter any potential appeals by appellants again penalty charges.

It should also be noted that at the ‘informal’ appeal stage this list of statutory grounds for appeal was also present in the response received from the local authority, clearly stated in a numbered list. I would assert that this list, without the ‘compelling reasons’ ground, stated at multiple stages of the appeal process by the local authority only disincentivizes any appellants to continue with the appeals process.

Have you been notified by the tribunal that your appeal has been registered? Post their communication.

Have you got any advice? I'm assuming I should probably do the hearing?

It seems like they have indeed replied and uploaded all their evidence - the Authority's response is as follows

With regard to the specific reasons for issuing the Notice, and the appellant’s main points concerning the contravention, Birmingham City Council would refer to the Notice of Rejection which they consider adequately presents the Authorities assertions at this stage.
The use of discretion has been considered in this case, however the council believes that the circumstances do not amount to any mitigation that would justify cancellation of the PCN.
As can be seen from the contemporaneous photos lighting was sufficiently clear for motorists to read any information on the machine/notice board. The appellant states that the vehicle was parked around  19:45 hours. At this time in November, it would be sufficiently dark enough for full lighting to be in use. It would not be dusk at this time in November. There would not have been any more lighting on the car park when the CEO issued the PCN at 21:37 hours.
The appellant clearly saw the notice regards the machine not working, yet failed to read any further information supplied on the machine. It is a motorists responsibility to read, understand and act on all information provided to avoid the issue of a PCN.
Contrary to the appellants belief that the Notice of Rejection did not provide all the information required, a copy has been attached showing the information it contained. The Council believe that the PCN was correctly issued, enforced equally, fairly and without discrimination, and remains valid and payable at £50.

Now I have 7 days to pick whether I want a telephone hearing or just get the adjudicator to decide on the evidence presented. A bit scared about doing the telephone hearing  :-X

Just wait now for the notice to keeper then submit your formal reps (appeal) using the same argument (+ things wrong with NtK) - you will probably get a rejection again and then it will be on to adjudicator :) I've just got to the adjudication stage with my own ticket.

Post the Notice to Keeper when you get it

Note dates when you get any letters from the council regarding the PCN.

Appeal has been registered now and Authority had 14 days to decide whether they want to contest it or not. Is there any chance they just will not bother?


I've already got two procedural points I think I just need to wordsmith my 'compelling reasons' point.

So it turns out I was given the wrong PIN code for the appeal so I've had to spend a week of back and forth with the tribunal people to get a working code.

The problem is now that the 28 day period has passed AND I've already received a Charge Certificate literally within the 28 days expiring and I've not even got around to writing my appeal!

When I submit my appeal through the portal can I request the adjudication occur via phone?

Are any gaps / procedural things regarding the Charge Certificate that need to be adhered to?

Will update with copy of charge notice asap

Ok thanks. Anyone have any tips/advice on going through the process apart from not going the paper-only route.

When did you submit the representations against the Notice to Owner, and how did you submit them ? Under the Traffic Management Act 2004, they have 56 days to respond. If this is exceeded, you win by default. The 56 days is counted from the date the council receive the reps.

Unfortunately, it has been less than 56 days  :( I think it has been around 30ish days since submission.

Part of the council's reasons for rejecting your reps was that the alternative of paying by phone was available and should have been used. IMO, it is therefore totally contradictory to insist that a pay and display ticket or voucher was required to be displayed. IMO, their own statement supports your claim and I would start your appeal with this. IMO, the correct grounds of appeal are 'tne penalty demanded.....circumstances of the case'. 

I would also add another point which is procedural impropriety. The NOR must, among other matters:

ii)indicate the nature of an adjudicator’s power to award costs, and

(iii)describe the form and manner in which an appeal to an adjudicator must be made, and

The NOR states:
'There is no charge for appealing and costs are not normally awarded. Details about when an order for costs can be made can be found on the website..'

The regs provide at para. 13 of Schedule 1 to the Appeals regs:
3), an adjudicator may make an order awarding costs and expenses—

(a)against a party (including an appellant who has withdrawn an appeal or an enforcement authority which has consented to an appeal being allowed), if the adjudicator considers that—

(i)the party has acted frivolously or vexatiously, or

(ii)the party’s conduct in making, pursuing or resisting an appeal was wholly unreasonable;

(b)against an enforcement authority, where the adjudicator considers that the disputed decision was wholly unreasonable.

IMO, 'costs are not normally awarded' does not meet the requirement for what the NOR must 'indicate'. What the authority have done is to signpost where, outside of the NOR, the mandatory info may be found.

cp has experience of this issue i.e. the distinction which the courts draw between whether something is presented e.g. evidence, as opposed to simply being referred to in another place e.g. a link.

I would add that this point is fundamental to the way most authorities outside London structure their NORs and therefore might be finessed by an adjudicator if they're minded to allow an appeal on the first grounds.

WaIt for others.

Thanks for your thoughts - yes I agree with you. I have also seen previous adjudicators allow the appeal based upon other procedural matters where the Authority does not explicitly say that the Tribunal has the power to extend the time permitted to submit an appeal to the IPT.

Has anyone gone to the tribunal lately? is it all done via written correspondence or do I need to orate my case over the phone to someone?

Reviving an old thread here now - Just got my response back from the council after my formal reps, obviously they rejected it.

Formal rep sent:

As stated in my initial appeal, there was no machine present that could have been used to purchase a pay & display ticket. The rejection letter dated 10/11/23 stated that payment for the parking should have been obtained via the ‘RingGo’ facility using a telephone - while this facility may have existed the driver was unaware of this fact due to the car park being pitch black as there was no lighting in the car park. Any signs that indicate other methods to pay for parking were not visible at all. The driver cannot possibly be held accountable if there are no clear instructions on other methods to provide payment for the car park and the only obvious method for payment (the machine) was not available. Evidence for the lack of lighting can be seen in the image I originally submitted with the initial appeal - it shows that the machine was not lit at all except for the backlit display. I have reattached the same picture at the bottom.

In addition to this, the alleged contravention code (83) which was given as “Parked in a car park without clearly displaying a valid pay & display ticket or voucher or parking clock.” also appears to be incorrect. If there was the option to pay by phone, that contravention code would still apply as nothing would be ‘displayed’ as it is all handled virtually. Therefore it appears to me the wrong contravention code has been used on the PCN itself - a quick search reveals contravention code 73 as “Parked without payment of the parking charge.” would be the correct contravention code.

Given these points, I respectfully ask you to rescind the PCN given the reasons outlined above.

Response from them:

I'm pretty annoyed about this because there were a tonne of other cars with PCNs given on the same night - probably for the same reason as me. Any advice / help for going to the adjudicator? I also note that my time limit is coming up so I need to submit it soon.

I do not know why they think I examined the machine, as I said in my original rep, it was pitch black. The only thing I could see was the backlit display saying the machine was out of order. As for the CEO evidence, it does show the area where my car was lit but this photo was taken ~2 hours after I parked, the machine was not near where I parked and from memory when I came back to the car park the lighting had come back on.

I also note that the rejection letter does not note that the adjudicator can extend the period given to appeal the PCN (as shown here)

Ah that makes sense, from searching cases similar to mine it appears that formal representation is also just rejected normally. Is it worth wasting the effort in actually writing a defence or should I submit a token formal rep just to get access to the adjudication?


Parked in Mosely Village Car Park one evening, machine was broken, took a photo and could not find another in the car park. The car park was also pitch black as the lights didn't appear to be working. A couple of guys who were at the machine said the 'app' wasn't working also so I didn't even bother trying to pay via that. I couldn't even see the signage so I had no idea what app I had to get to pay for the parking.

Anyway, got a ticket, appealed through their appeals thing which was confusing because it never actually said appeal, it just said "comment".

Initial PCN:

This was my initial appeal to them:

I am writing to you to appeal the PCN issued on 10/11/2023 against MF19 WDP in Moseley Village Car park.

The contravention was for parking without a valid pay and display ticket on display (83) - this was because the only ticket machine in the car park was out of order. No other parking machines in the car park were able to be located so it was therefore assumed that this was the only ticket machine in the car park. According to your discretion policy (under MC14) this appears to be a valid reason to have the PCN rescinded which I respectfully request given the reasoning above.

rejection letter:

I'm confused now as I think I have 28 days to appeal but cannot appeal again until I get an NTO? I've had a brief search of the forum and found this very similar case:

Any help / recommendations on how to get this revoked would be helpful

PS sorry for the formatting.

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