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Messages - InterCity125

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1
But were there specific signs stating, "This site is now under the management of UKPA" or "Please note that the T&Cs have recently changed"?

2
When did UKPA take over management of the site?

Did they install extra temporary signs highlighting the change in T&Cs?

3
Why would you pay the initial fee?

It's a con.

Write to them with a Subject Access Request in order to get the original PCN and then we can help.

4
It was expected and is part of the process.

Nothing to worry about.

Your defence is very simple.

No need for an AOS - Just log onto MCOL and submit the following;


Leeds Railway Station defence.

1. This claim is denied in its entirety and no debt is owed to the Claimant.

2. It is acknowledged that I was the Registered Keeper of the vehicle at the material time.

3. That the driver of the vehicle is not known to the Claimant and that there is absolutely no legal requirement for me to reveal the drivers details to an unregulated private parking contractor.

4. That no assumption of who was driving can be drawn from me simply exercising my right to say nothing in a situation where the law does not require me to disclose driver information.

5. That the Claimant is using a 'Boiler-plate' Particulars of Claim which lacks accuracy and relevance to the particular matter.

6. That with the driver not known to the Claimant, the Claimant is attempting to use Protections of Freedoms Act (2012)(PoFA) in order to invoke what is known legally as 'Keeper Liability'.

7. That the attempt to use PoFA Keeper Liability is not applicable to this specific location since the location is not classed as 'relevant land' under the legislation - the location at Leeds Railway station is subject to Railway Byelaws and therefore it is excluded from PoFA.

8. That the Claimant's own Parking Charge Notice (PCN) Notice to Keeper (NtK) specifies, ironically, in large bold print, that the NtK is "Non-PoFA".

9. That PoFA Keeper Liability is therefore not available to the Claimant.

10. That with both the driver unknown and no Keeper Liability available, there is no legal route to liability in this matter.

11. That liability is therefore denied.


Additional Defence Points;

12. That it is not possible for the Claimant to have formed a contract with the driver in any circumstance since a driver would never consider that the Claimant's signage constituted an offer of contract since the signage simply resembles normal road signage.

13. That, in law, in order for a contract to have been formed there would need to be 'clear intent on the part of both parties to form a legal relationship' - it therefore stands that no contract can be formed in a situation where the driver does not recognise that a contract is being offered.

14. That the road markings and signage demonstrated in the parking operators evidence are contradictory in nature and are therefore in breach of the Parking Operators own industry Code of Practice.

15. That whilst some signage specifies, "No Stopping" there are additional road markings such as double yellow lines which allow brief stops for dropping off and picking up passengers.

16. That in order to be compliant, No Stopping signage can only be supported by double red lines.

17. That in previous correspondence, the Claimant's legal representatives have consistently sent me legal letters which attempted to completely misrepresent their true legal position in an attempt to pressure me into paying.

5
Private parking tickets / Re: Euro car parks over time
« on: Today at 08:06:03 am »
The driver did make a purchase in the store but has not kept the receipt.

Proof of purchase through a bank statement? Loyalty Card?

You could try writing anyway.

Failing that, the RK can appeal on the basis that there is no liability since the NtK is not PoFA compliant and they have no idea who the driver was.

6
It might be worth adding that parking operators are required to display further prominent temporary signage, for one month, in circumstances where the T&Cs of parking have been changed or if new enforcement is taking place.

So you could mention the above and then say;

"I therefore hold the Claimant to STRICT PROOF to provide the Court with pictorial evidence that demonstrates that such temporary signage was in place at the location at the material time"


I would also number all those bullet points so the Judge can easily reference them if it did go to hearing.

7
Hi jfollows, your message is gratefully received. I planned my defence to be one of procedure not being followed as b789 was suggesting. Your thoughts would be appreciated.


Quote
6. Next steps
Once a Letter of Claim compliant with the Protocol and PD-PACP is served—including the documents and information specified above—I will take advice and provide a full Protocol response within 30 days.

If proceedings are issued without first supplying the outstanding documents and allowing that 30-day period, I will apply for a stay with costs under paragraphs 13–16 PD-PACP and invite the court to disallow any unrecoverable add-ons.

Please provide the requested materials within 30 days and confirm whether you rely on PoFA keeper liability.


There's danger attached to simply providing a defence which focuses purely on 'procedure' as you put it.

A County Court hearing is the lowest level of Court in the UK and most Judges tend to take a slightly informal approach to weighing up the evidence. As such, a Judge could very easily skip over such procedural errors on the part of either party.

What is the real basis of your defence?

8
I received an email today informing me the client has discontinued the claim. A day before WS statements were due.
Thank you everyone for all the advice you’ve provided, directly and via others’ posts.
I appreciate all the time the experts invest in helping us numpties.
Power to the parkers!

Nice job. Well done.

Normal DCB Legal behaviour and it's about time the Courts did something about this.

9
Is there examples of what we need to send in? As we have never done this and only been guided by yourselves with great thanks

We have no idea what to send in or how to write such witness statements its very stressful this. Over a year now.

Thanks in advance

Do you have a copy of the original PCN?

10
The Notice to Keeper is not PoFA compliant so there can be no keeper liability.

However, I would appeal as the Keeper and state that you understand that the driver was caught in traffic and at no point did they park. State that the driver was simply trying to exit and at no point was a parking contract entered into.

11
Are you able to get pictures of the signage?

It could come down to the wording.

The wording of the PCN appears to place you in a good position since you did not 'park'.

12
Private parking tickets / Re: Euro car parks over time
« on: Yesterday at 09:05:55 am »
ECP NtKs are never PoFA compliant.

Are you a genuine Morrisons customer?

13
I would start with something like;

1. It is acknowledged that I was the Registered Keeper of the vehicle at the material time.

2. The vehicle driver is not known to the Claimant and, as this is a contract dispute, I will not be identifying the driver under any circumstance as the law does not require it.

3. The Claimant appears to be relying on Protection of Freedoms Act (2012)(PoFA) in order to transfer liability from the unknown driver to myself.

4. In order to invoke 'keeper liability' using PoFA the Claimant must demonstrate that their Notice to Keeper (NtK) is compliant with Schedule 4 of PoFA - in this instance the NtK is not compliant as it was served well beyond the 14 day period required by the legislation.

5. As a result, with the driver unknown and no option of keeper liability, there is no legal route to liability in this matter.

6. Liability is therefore denied entirely.

Further defence points which the Court should be aware of;

7. (then add your further points being very careful not to imply that you were the driver)


And please introduce spacing. Judges hate blocks of text which are unspaced.

14
Thank you for your response - do you have an example somewhere on what grounds I could complain to the SRA?

Also re the original issue of APCOA never responding to our Appeal, is there also a body we can complain to about their handling of this matter?


Don't bother with APCOA - this is a numbers game and they don't give a toss about complaints etc.

SRA is more serious because they regulate solicitors etc.

The SRA complaint would revolve around the content of the GCTT letter which is a deliberate attempt to misrepresent the true legal position of both their client and yourself - namely that they are claiming that you could be pursued through the County Court and that you could end up with a CCJ against your name and could damage your creditworthiness etc when in fact the Penalty Notice is clearly out of time and can no longer be enforced even if they went via the magistrates court.

15
Your full address and your vehicle registration mark should be enough according to their letter.

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