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Messages - The Slithy Tove

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1
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Speeding NIP - wrong location
« on: Yesterday at 08:18:31 am »
According to GSV, the road does transition between a 20 and a 30 limit between the two endpoints described. What was the alleged speed and limit?

Regardless of that, your mum must respond to the NIP. And if not significantly over the limit, there's no need to stress. A course or even 3 points and a fine are not a big deal in the grand scheme of things (assuming no accumulated points thus far).

2
News / Press Articles / Katie Price banned (again)
« on: April 08, 2026, 11:21:58 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gjp7xwjyzo

Not wanting to get into whether she has some mental health issues that result in her getting into so many scrapes with the law, and seemingly (not for the first time) burying her head in the sand and failing to respond to the S.172, but the article is a little odd.

It talks about the SJP being "secretive" and that "it is not known if Price was given the chance to argue against another driving ban." Surely the SJP doesn't dish out bans, presuming this is another totting ban. What it commonly said in these forums is that a potential ban (totting or otherwise) will trigger an in-person hearing in a court, to offer the chance of pleading exceptional hardship. Or maybe she just ignored all court letters as well, which results in the default action of SJP and totting ban.

3
The Flame Pit / Re: New 4D Speed Cameras
« on: March 28, 2026, 03:34:53 pm »
Quote from: andy_foster on March 22, 2026, 06:23:35 pm
4D is a somewhat creative use of language. Whilst a "dimension" in physics can be pretty much anything that can be measured, 3D refers to the 3 cartesian dimensions - length, with and height, or the x, y and z distances from a given origin, in perpendicular planes.
Are they trying to suggest that they are able to measure both the exact location of the target as well as its speed and direction (and don't start going all Heisenberg on me :)? If that's the case, then it should be 6-D as you need 6 pieces of information to specify location and velocity (using the proper use of the term velocity which shows speed and direction). That could be regular x,y,z cartesian coordinates, or some combination including angles and points of origin.

But in essence, it's all marketing bo****ks, in the same way as 3-D and 4-D number plates.

4
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: UK Red Light Camera – crossed stop line from right-turn lane to go straight (straight lane green). Any chance to dis
« on: March 15, 2026, 05:32:21 pm »
Quote from: NewJudge on March 15, 2026, 11:56:22 am
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/contents

It specifically refers to “filter lane” type signals. It clearly states that a driver may proceed beyond the stop line in the direction indicted by the arrow. This is what the OP did and I believe no offence has been committed.
That sort of "filter lane" surely would be where there is a single set of lights where the main green light is not an arrow, and the green right arrow is part of that set of lights to the right of the main green? That allows you to move forward in the filter lane on the main green and even to make the turn if it's clear. The green right filter light then indicates you can go (with the usual caveats) as the oncoming traffic has been stopped by a red.

In this case there are essentially two sets of lights: one controlling ahead and left turning traffic; the other controlling right turning traffic. Each controls its own lane(s). I would hesitate to try to use your logic therefore to say there is no offence here. (Not saying I know the answer, just that I think your argument is shaky.)

5
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Use of mobile phone potentially leading to a totting up ban & conflicting legal advice!
« on: February 09, 2026, 09:29:24 am »
Quote from: andy_foster on February 08, 2026, 09:46:59 pm
Were you (the vehicle) moving while using the phone? Personally, I do not consider that using a phone whilst stationary in queuing traffic constitutes driving for the purposes of the mobile phone legislation. Others may disagree.
"Others" would include most courts, would it not? Running that as a defence would be a brave move (in the English, understated use of the word "brave").
Quote from: andy_foster on February 08, 2026, 09:46:59 pm
What were you using the phone for? Ironically, if it was for interactive communication purposes, it could engage Article 10 ECHR - which would require any interference with the right to express and receive ideas and information without interference by public authority, unless such interference is provided for by law and necessary to protect other people's rights (in this case their safety). If the vehicle was stationary throughout, then I would argue that it would be difficult to argue that it was necessary to prohibit such actions to protect others from being hit by a stationary vehicle. Again others may disagree. If the vehicle was moving slowly then that would be an even harder sell.
Trying to use that one would be even more "brave". And likely expensive. Mind you, a successful use of such a defence would probably have all the Farage-ites suddenly not wanting to scrap the Human Rights Act after all.

6
Non-motoring legal advice / Re: Suing a water company
« on: January 27, 2026, 09:39:33 am »
My only thoughts are they they (and the other private water companies) are a total disgrace, and Ofwat is as bad, if not worse, for not properly regulating them. I have the worse of both worlds, with the incompetent SE Water providing my water (fortunately not in the areas affected recently) and my waste water handled by the even more incompetent Thames. The former are putting up the bills by some stupid amount, and Thames by even more (something like 50%). I don't buy their claims of investing in infrastructure, as that's what they've been telling us for years. Where the reality is that they have been jacking up the bills, not investing, but instead borrowing so they can shell out huge dividends and bonuses. If they want to invest, then the shareholders should be made to pay (through rights issues, for example). And if I refuse to pay their unjustified increases? I have no defence, and will be sued.

They are the mafia of the privatised public sector. Don't expect to get anywhere with any lawsuit.

7
Non-motoring legal advice / Re: not paying for fuel
« on: January 12, 2026, 09:51:50 am »
Quote from: lateman on January 12, 2026, 09:35:35 am
... the case will be escalated to the next process and issued to a third party for debt collector which may lead to court proceedings"

but anyway, my question is: do i have 14 days from the date of the letter or when it was served (almost a week later)?
A debt collector has even less ability to do anything than PMF. Don't worry about that particular threat, and you can safely ignore anything a third party debt collector sends you. That's all they can do: send letters with ever more red ink and block capitals.

8
Non-motoring legal advice / Re: not paying for fuel
« on: January 11, 2026, 04:09:16 pm »
I would agree with Andy that the use of the word "penalty" puts Pay My Fuel on very dodgy ground, as do threats of prosecution. And you can't transfer a debt without both parties (Morrisons and Pay My Fuel) contacting the alleged debtor stating this, which they haven't. That means Pay My Fuel can take no legal action for recovery, as it is not their debt to collect. They also have the problem that all they know is the vehicle's registered keeper, who is not necessarily the same person who filled up the car and didn't pay.

Morrisons branch is unlikely to play ball, but maybe a cheque (if you still have a cheque book) to Morrisons HO for the amount plus a small amount to cover their costs "in full and final settlement," giving all relevant details of course.

9
The Flame Pit / Re: Solicitor's Agents and Right of Audience
« on: January 11, 2026, 12:49:23 pm »
The YouTube chap really needs to learn how to be succinct and not waffle on or disappear on tangents. You realise what the job of a decent editor is when you have to suffer through videos like this (similarly podcasts where they take forever to get to the point).

But having rambled on myself :) I was wondering if Stephen Langley himself had to make all those arguments to court around the reasons for having right of audience refused. It's a huge effort for a Defendant, especially if they have no formal legal training themselves and are unfamiliar with the ins and outs of it all.

10
Non-motoring legal advice / Re: not paying for fuel
« on: January 11, 2026, 12:27:21 pm »
Quote from: DWMB2 on January 11, 2026, 11:02:44 am
Can you show us the letter you have received?

The 'penalty' sounds a lot like a payment in return for them not shopping you to the police.
I very much doubt they used the word "penalty". They'll probably claim it's an admin charge for chasing and handling the non-payment.

Morrisons are unlikely to relent if you went to the store and offered to pay: they're probably not set up to take such late payments, and they'll claim it's out of their hands and has been passed on to Pay My Fuel.

11
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Late NIP
« on: December 26, 2025, 09:52:36 am »
I would not have thought they would send out a reminder so soon. After all, they have 14 days to get the first NIP out and then there's another 28 days before the response is required. Getting a reminder less than 4 weeks after the event would seem a little premature.

At least all the responses have been submitted in a timely manner, so those obligations have been met. If eligible, you are likely to be offered a speed awareness course. The question then is, do you want the path of least resistance (the course, especially as you don't seem to deny speeding), or contest the timeliness of the NIP, which will be hassle and could end up being expensive?

12
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: 51mph in a 30
« on: December 21, 2025, 08:06:55 am »
Going to court is probably a waste of everyone's time. Sentencing is pretty formulaic, so unless there's any other aggravating circumstances (like you trying to excuse your own behaviour when replying :) then the sentence is likely to be as previously described.

A regular speeding offence is a non-recordable offence, so won't show up on a criminal records check, and does not need to be declared on ESTA (read what it says, it's asking about crimes of deception/dishonesty)

13
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: NIP received 21 days late
« on: December 17, 2025, 08:47:47 am »
While we all expect the Authorities to abide by the rules and that a late NIP should fail to get a successful prosecution, you also need to be pragmatic. 80 in a 70 is easily within scope of an awareness course, so apart from the cost and time to attend, there are no points on the licence. The alternative is a severe uphill battle in getting a court to accept the late NIP and the cost in losing that battle.

Your choice.

Don't forget the NIP must still be replied to within 28 days, whichever path you choose to follow. And (according to the dates on the NIP), most of those 28 days have already elapsed. Don't miss that.

14
News / Press Articles / Thousands of drivers wrongly fined for speeding since 2021
« on: December 16, 2025, 08:07:15 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c70rk80p9eqo

While any incorrect prosecutions will be reversed, fines and points remedied, what if there are people who totted up as a result of this, and the consequential losses from that?

"Meanwhile, police forces have stopped issuing fines from variable cameras until they have confidence in their accuracy." Free for all on many of England's motorways? Who wants to risk it?

15
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Speeding in a rental van - no NIP yet??
« on: December 10, 2025, 04:08:09 pm »
May be wishful thinking that it's "lost in the system". The rental company has a strong disincentive to not having robust processes in place in the form of hefty fines if prosecuted for Failing to Furnish. You could call them to check. The road to "Hoping it'll go away" is littered with casualties.

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