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Messages - churst121

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1
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 23, 2024, 04:21:49 pm »
Quote from: Southpaw82 on May 22, 2024, 08:00:12 pm
I think the OP needs to read up on separate corporate personality. There is no “I” here, the company is the defendant and will be convicted and fined.

Fully understood. I am saying "I" as I am the one completing the form. I do understand that the company is a separate entity.

Thank you

2
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 22, 2024, 05:11:21 pm »
Thank you and would it be upto £1000 fine but no points?

3
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 22, 2024, 04:38:04 pm »
Understood Andy. So I am better off changing my plea to guilty and taking the financial hit?

4
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 22, 2024, 04:32:52 pm »
Thank you for your reply. What would be the punished for the company if we pleaded guilty by post?

I recieved it orginially around 2 weeks ago and replied with a letter stating what has happened and now I have been sent a court date in July.

I am thinking of changing to a guilty plea by post.

I already have 6 points so I cannot accept anymore points as the company director.

Thanks again

5
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 22, 2024, 03:05:27 pm »
Quote from: andy_foster on May 22, 2024, 02:46:33 pm
Who is the SJPN addressed to? Who is the RK? What is that status of the company?

SJPN notice is addressed to the Limited Company .

Van is leased so registered Keeper is the lease company, and agreement is between the lease company and limited company.

If you need any other information please let me know. Thank you

6
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 22, 2024, 03:03:58 pm »
Quote from: 666 on May 22, 2024, 02:50:54 pm
Apart from the immediate issue, you need to get your admin in order.

Start logging receipt of NIPs, photocopying replies, and getting (free) proof of postage.

100% Agree, I have introduced this today.

7
Speeding and other criminal offences / Company - Failing to Give Driver Details
« on: May 22, 2024, 02:07:24 pm »
I posted on here last week about a personal issue and now I'm back with a company issue!

I own a company which has around 25 vans. We receive Request for Driver details on a very regular basis and always reply.

I have today been summonsed to court for failing to give driver details.

I cannot say 100% if I ever received the notice but I do know that every single notice we receive is replied to.

There is a few possible reasons.

1. We never recieved it
2. We sent it back but the police never recieved it
3. Possible admin error in office but I have spoken with staff member and do not think this is the case
4. I bought some stamps from ebay which turned out to be counterfeit, I was using them and sending post to my customers and they was recieving £5 fine cards from customers. I stopped using them but its possible the letter was sent back with one of those. I have prove of purchase etc if needed.

I know who the driver is and can declare that. This incident dates back to December 2023 but I can see we received another one in January 2024 (different incident) for the same van and driver and that one was replied to.

We have an admin who sorts this, I do not get involved.

What would be my best course of action? I want to go not guilty and would be happy to give drivers details but I am not sure if it is not pass that stage?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you

John

8
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Single Justice Procedure - Failing to give drivers details
« on: May 18, 2024, 05:15:37 pm »
Thank you all.

There is something I really dont like about putting in writing that I am guilty.

If I was to ignore the SLP then Im guessing the fine would be the full £1000 as I would not get the 33% discount. I am ok with that.

If I do ignore it, is there a small chance it never mades it to court or the judge rules in my favour on the day as no reply to everything?

Or am I just being stupid and over thinking and better get my guilty plea in before the time is up?

Thanks again everyone

9
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Single Justice Procedure - Failing to give drivers details
« on: May 17, 2024, 10:02:34 pm »
Quote from: NewJudge on May 17, 2024, 09:48:40 pm
It really doesn't matter why the police decided to send a Request for Driver's Details to you and there is no time limit in which they may do so. They did and you had an obligation to respond.

The court cannot impose anything other than six points for the offence. A disqualification is an alternative (as it is for any offence which carries an endorsement) but there is no reason why one would be imposed.

Anecdotally, an MS90 endorsement doubles a premium in the first year, tapering off annually until he offence no longer needs to be declared after five years.

Understood, thank you for the advice.

So my best option is to plead guilty by post without a court hearing. Should I add any facts for the judge to consider when giving the sentence in case they consider a ban or is that very unlikely? I am worried that by saying too much I could turn it into something bigger than it needs to be. I am very busy with work and days in court are money lost to me so I want to avoid that if possible.

Thanks again

10
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Single Justice Procedure - Failing to give drivers details
« on: May 17, 2024, 09:38:01 pm »
Quote from: The Rookie on May 17, 2024, 06:57:46 pm
If it’s leased it’s fairly unlikely it’s registered to your work, the lease company is almost certainly (invariably) the registered keeper, if in doubt get out the V5c registration document that is sent to the registered keeper and check the details on it are correct.

Perhaps phone the lease company and ask them, also ask if they got a NIP and replied to it naming you/the company and if so what details exactly they gave.

An MS90 is an endorsement code that insurers love to have to just accepting 6 points may be a bit premature as the fine may be the least of the costs.

Your right, sorry I didn't make it clear. The lese company is the registered keeper, I don't have the log book. The lease company do not have my personal name or address on their system. The police haven't contacted them they have decided to go straight to the insurance policy holder which is myself. My guess is they have looked at registered keeper and insurance and assumed its a personal lease to myself and wrote to me.

The other vans on lease from the same lease company - we receive the NIPs direct to the office , as they first write to lease company, they get forwarded to limited company and then we pass them onto the driver. These vans are on a commercial fleet insurance policy.

11
Speeding and other criminal offences / Re: Single Justice Procedure - Failing to give drivers details
« on: May 17, 2024, 09:29:45 pm »
Yes big mistake from myself. I should of dealt with it at the time. Seeing as this is a regular occurrence for the business I just assumed they would also write to the business once they spoke to lease company and I could deal with it through the usual avenue. Then if I'm honest I forgot about it, it was 6 months ago.

Here is the time line.

Original offence being investigated - Careless Driving.

Date of offence: 12.10.23

Initial combined SIP/S172 Notice sent to policy holder - 17/10/23

defendant identified as policy holder for vehicle insurance

Reminder sent 08/11/23

offence date (failing to give evidence) 17/11/24

charged date 05/05/24


Is it worth me writing a letter with the guilty pled in the hope of receiving less points or is it not worth the time?

How much do you think my insurance will go up?

If I have missed anything else please let me know and I can add the details. Thank you

12
Speeding and other criminal offences / Single Justice Procedure - Failing to give drivers details
« on: May 17, 2024, 06:09:17 pm »
Hello all, I am after some advice please.

I have received a SJP notice for failing to give the drivers details.

The car is question is a car that is registered to my business but the notice has been sent to myself at my home address rather than the business because I am the named insurance policy holder. Its a lease car and the agreement is between the lease company and my business, my name is not on it anywhere. We have around 20 vehicles in total in the business, all the others are vans and are on a commercial policy. We have 1 car and the commercial policy would not cover it so I got it insured personally and now this is the one that the police are writing. I get multiple NIPs for the vans to the office and always reply with drivers details .

This particular NIP come to my home address as I was the insurance policy holder so I decided to ignore it hoping they would write to the company and then I could follow it up there. Its a business car so I thought that would be the appropriate avenue.

It seems from the notice that the car was involved in a collision around 6 months ago, I was not aware of this and the car doesn't have any damage or had been fixed by the time I checked on it. I have tried to get to the bottom of who took the car but I am not able to. We have around 5 vans always at our yard and everyone has access to the key cabinet. The car spare key was in the key cabinet.

I think the best thing to do is plead guilty by post, accept the 6 points and £1000 fine and move on but I am wondering if I have any grounds to fight this.

I am not aware who the driver is , the car is registered to the lease company who has an agreement with the limited company, i checked with the insurance and there hasn't been a claim so i am guessing the collision wasn't bad but I cannot say 100%.

I would really appreciate any help. Thank you

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