Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: sillybilly9 on December 08, 2025, 11:50:33 pm
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DO you already have an address where you will be residing abroad? If necessary, can you evidence that address with a utility bill or some other identification? If you can, the easiest way to kill this off would be to identify the driver with the foreign address and that would be the end.
However, as the Notice to Keeper (NtK) is not purporting to rely on PoFA to hold the Keeper liable if the driver is not identified, this would never, ever get near a hearing in a county court small claim. Also, the fact that Gemini is owned by APCOA and APCOA do not litigate anyway.
So, the choices you have are to just completely ignore it and do not respond to anything. As they don't litigate, nothing will or can happen. Any debt collector letters are always ignored anyway as they are powerless to do anything except to try and intimidate the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree into paying out of ignorance and fear.
Of course, you could be the unlucky first ever person they decide to make a claim against and if they were to (highly unlikely), if a claim was not responded to, you could get a CCJ by default. If there will be someone at the address that can check your post, then it wouldn't be ab issue and we would advise on how to easily defend it with the 99.9% guarantee that it would still never reach a hearing before being struck out or discontinued.
If you can identify the driver as being a foreign resident, then they cannot pursue anything out of jurisdiction. They would soon give up again.
If you want to go through the usual process of appealing, rejection, IAS appeal, rejection, county court claim (extremely low probability), defend, strikeout/discontinuance, then that is available also. In this case it would only go as far as IAS appeal, rejection, useless debt recovery letters and finally silence as they move on, then you can start with the fact that there is no legal obligation on the known keeper (the recipient of the Notice to Keeper (NtK)) to reveal the identity of the unknown driver and no inference or assumptions can be made.
The NtK is not compliant with all the requirements of PoFA which means that if the unknown driver is not identified, they cannot transfer liability for the charge from the unknown driver to the known keeper.
Use the following as your appeal. No need to embellish or remove anything from it:
I am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your 'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.
As your Notice to Keeper (NtK) does not fully comply with ALL the requirements of PoFA 2012, you are unable to hold the keeper of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions can be drawn. Gemini has relied on contract law allegations of breach against the driver only.
The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation of the law of agency. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable. Gemini have no hope should you be so stupid as to try and litigate, so you are urged to save us both a complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
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https://postimg.cc/9rLpH17w
Here is the back of the PCN.
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Please show the rear of the PCN as well.
There is no need to identify the driver, but if Gemini has complied with the requirements of the legislation (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4) then the liability can be transferred from the unknown driver to the registered keeper.
However, if they fail to comply and you appeal on this basis, it is likely that the appeal will be rejected “after careful consideration” simply because it’s what these companies do, they don’t care about the truth, they only care about your money.
On the subject of which, it is likely that the money you eventually paid went to the land owner and Gemini got nothing, but they have a contract with the land owner saying they can pursue anyone who breaks the rules and keep that money.
It may also be that the land is not ‘relevant land’ for the purposes of PoFA, if it is covered by bylaws, in which case there legislation can’t be used to transfer liability.
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Having used this forum to successfully challenge 12 PCNs issued for (unknowingly) entering a school zone I return seeking some advice.
I have read the pinned posts and done some searches so believe I should not be paying the PCN but would value any feedback on my particular scenario.
The driver of the vehicle entered Mile End Leisure Centre at 16:37.
Parking was paid for via the Apcoa Connect App at 17:36pm. The parking had not been paid earlier as the physical machine was not working and the driver did not have access to the app. The driver did however manage to download the app and pay for 2 hours of parking before exiting the car park.
Driver exited the car park at 17:38.
Based on forum comments about their being no requirement to reveal who the driver of the vehicle was, and the registered keeper of the car was not the driver I believe there is no need to a) pay the PCN or b) reveal who the driver was. Is that still correct?
As I will be moving overseas in a few months and would rather not have to deal with any appeals or tribunals, I would like to get this cleared up as quickly as possible. Thus any suggestion on the best route to take on appealing/ignoring this or subsequent correspondence would be greatly appreciated.
Image of PCN (hopefully) found here.. https://postimg.cc/9rYH4N4n