Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: toblerone187 on October 26, 2025, 02:35:26 pm
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I have replied via e mail.
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Just thought I'd mention here since it's relevant. I've driven past a few school zones in Redbridge and the 'term-time only' text on the blue information signs under the healthy school street zone signage have been redacted/taped over. So the loophole for future cases may just be gone.
Yes it was taped over at the time of this "offence"
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Just thought I'd mention here since it's relevant. I've driven past a few school zones in Redbridge and the 'term-time only' text on the blue information signs under the healthy school street zone signage have been redacted/taped over. So the loophole for future cases may just be gone.
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@Hippocrates
Redbridge have rejected the appeal
Images of letter:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/pq2oq6kbd7sfgh7r7rd01/Redbridge-Rejection-page-1.jpg?rlkey=s6jbsde3649k10y0u1qzzm7rr&dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/x12bzx8cplmydo50qgc7d/Redbridge-Rejection-page-2.jpg?rlkey=yyax36qo382hgfef7fwi6z7k9&dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/uowlarf30pmidxqgplb5b/Redbridge-Rejection-page-3.jpg?rlkey=v681voke4bswmdahfihmpgjgb&dl=0
Link to PDF:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/icrewjcqf8mwfno6e7h51/Redbridge-Rejection-of-Representation.pdf?rlkey=7yr6kjmwk6o6icnlaz1zfz7ay&dl=0
To my mind, they have just responded with a generic paragraph that completely avoids the statutory requirement. They have again referred to the date of service not the date of the notice
Also am I right in thinking that they are referring to the wrong part of the legislation as they are making reference to Charge Certificates?
What is the next step and do you think that it is sensible to proceed with fighting this? What are the chances of success?
Many thanks
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PCN omits mandatory information.
I make this collateral challenge against the validity of the
PCN as it is missing mandatory information as provided at
Para. 4 (8 ) (v) of
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/section/4/enacted
(v)that, if the penalty charge is not paid before the
end of the 28 day period, an increased charge may be payable.
Clearly, this refers to Para. 4 (8 ) (iii):
(iii)that the penalty charge must be paid before the
end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of the notice;
Therefore, it follows that the statement: If you fail to pay the
Penalty Charge or make representations before the end of a period
of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice an
increased charge of £240 may be payable. adds to the lack of clarity
by its omission. Even on its own, whether the required information
was included or not, it is also arguable that it conflates the two
periods using the word "or" which many would view as being
conjunctive. Furthermore, even if the statement were to be
interpreted disjunctively, there is still no clarity due to the
missing information
Apologies I have been away
Also my thread appears to have been hijacked by others so I am not sure where I stand on this and what applies to my wife case or whether it is relating to Unhappyprince9's case
Is the above quoted info in relation to my wife's PCN AF2098641A??
Is this the grounds that we should be fighting it on or should it be fought on the poor visibility of signs?
What do we need to do next?
I am conscious that the 14 day deadline for 50% discount is coming up so just want to know where we stand and what needs to be done
Many thanks for any assistance
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Does anyone have the underlying order?
Where's the council's video in this case? (I'm drowning in references to other cases!).
Whether a 'blue sticker' is on an unofficial sign or not is not for me the issue.
If the Order restricts the application of the prohibition to 'term time' or any similar meaning, then the traffic sign is defective because it must convey the order's provisions and doesn't.
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I think Hippo has just won a load of cases for the same person on the silly term time only sign.
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/lb-of-redbridge-school-streets-pedestrian-zone-pcn-53j-perrymans-farm-road-appea/msg95861/#msg95861
I have asked cp to add the details.
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PCN omits mandatory information.
I make this collateral challenge against the validity of the
PCN as it is missing mandatory information as provided at
Para. 4 (8 ) (v) of
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/section/4/enacted
(v)that, if the penalty charge is not paid before the
end of the 28 day period, an increased charge may be payable.
Clearly, this refers to Para. 4 (8 ) (iii):
(iii)that the penalty charge must be paid before the
end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of the notice;
Therefore, it follows that the statement: If you fail to pay the
Penalty Charge or make representations before the end of a period
of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice an
increased charge of £240 may be payable. adds to the lack of clarity
by its omission. Even on its own, whether the required information
was included or not, it is also arguable that it conflates the two
periods using the word "or" which many would view as being
conjunctive. Furthermore, even if the statement were to be
interpreted disjunctively, there is still no clarity due to the
missing information
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I think Hippo has just won a load of cases for the same person on the silly term time only sign.
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The previous appeals were successful despite the presence of that sign though.
Is it worth trying?
Well, if previous cases have been sccessful, it must be. However, are the previous cases the same with the same signs ?
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The previous appeals were successful despite the presence of that sign though.
Is it worth trying?
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Unfortunately her case is compromised by the presence of an advance warning sign: -
https://maps.app.goo.gl/H4wTxALSh45CatA27
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The images of the PCN were rejected as spam by imgpile so here are Dropbox links:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/p4qd14zzktymqwf5cedte/PCN-front.jpg?rlkey=io8tic0v81nvjme8j8e016uj3&dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/loqy1xvc3tq9u5g3z63g6/PCN-back.jpg?rlkey=q1mvotbqauu3jakjj9feakw09&dl=0
In case the other imgpile links don't work here are Dropbox links:
Photos:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/irdoi3k63wwmp24oq9y13/2025-10-26-12.09.47.jpg?rlkey=pjt3f1ui04m1280ymt0m49o9a&dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/bwv5z8wmk6fpmre52khsg/2025-10-26-12.09.56.jpg?rlkey=1np9tw2e9counagyxwr2nxr0t&dl=0
Video:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fugonntqgrsjsbepedsvf/2025-10-26_12-09-28-front.mp4?rlkey=f22556ggi8bojqw2tmtqua0c1&dl=0
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EDIT: Dropbox links to my pictures and video now posted in my reply to this post as imgpile links do not seem to be working
My wife was visiting an area that she used to live in but had not been back to for a few years.
She turned right into Perrymans Farm Road to drive past her old school, not realising that is now restricted at certain times to pedestrians and cycles only.
Given the positioning of the restriction signs which are right at the entrance to the road, and parallel to the main road, they are almost impossible to read. This is exacerbated by the fact that there is a yellow box there so her focus was on navigating that as she was waiting for a car to let her through.
Please can someone advise if she has good grounds for an appeal and the chances of being successful
Here is the GSW link: https://maps.app.goo.gl/mY9w46dNAXxL6bKJ9
This is the same location as these previous threads:
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/redbridge-53j-perrymans-farm-road-pedestrian-zone-restriction/
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/redbridge-perrymans-farm-pcn-(school-roads)
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/redbridge-53j-entering-a-pedestrian-zone-perrymans-farm-road/
(The "Term time" wording mentioned in these cases has now been covered over by a blue sticker)
Front and back of PCN:
(https://imgpile.com/p/T8NCv6Z)
We took some photos today from which you can see that the signs are extremely difficult to read from the road position when turning right as they are positioned so close to the main road, unlike the 20mph restriction signs that are set back and able to be read before turning
(https://imgpile.com/p/pz9S35j)
Here is a dashcam video taken today that shows the same. The signs are almost impossible to read by someone in a moving car up to and throughout the turn. Bear in mind that the dashcam is from a position to the left of the driver (as are the photos as they were taken by a passenger)so from the driver's perspective they signs are even less visible
(https://imgpile.com/p/TVDjcTY)
Any help and advice would be greatly appreciated
Thanks
N.B. Dropbox links to my pictures and video now posted in my reply to this post as imgpile links do not seem to be working