Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: anthomy93 on November 04, 2023, 01:13:36 pm
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I don't understand why you need my VRM and PCN ref number when all copies I have received are posted.
For starters I'd like to look at the original PCN photos on the council website, rather than having to rely on your photos of what is already an inferior paper copy.
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thank you cp8759. I do appreciate the time and input you have given for replying my query.
I don't understand why you need my VRM and PCN ref number when all copies I have received are posted. Contravention code (21) and their reasoning are stated on the pictures provided.
I can post up what the main display shows me of the PCN if that is any help
As I mentioned in a few posts above, I have parked next to the replaced sign, however that sign was identical to the other 9 signs that didn't get replaced for 6 weeks making their signs misleading as far as I could think of it.
In a normal case I would order the suspension logs from the council, as these usually help in parking suspension cases. The council already has the number plate and the PCN number, and if you end up going to the tribunal that information will end up published on the tribunal register at https://londontribunals.org.uk/
By refusing to give us this information, you're only hurting your chances.
Sorry to sound harsh but if you end up losing / having to pay, you'll only have yourself to blame.
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In a normal case I would order the suspension logs from the council, as these usually help in parking suspension cases. The council already has the number plate and the PCN number, and if you end up going to the tribunal that information will end up published on the tribunal register at https://londontribunals.org.uk/
By refusing to give us this information, you're only hurting your chances.
Sorry to sound harsh but if you end up losing / having to pay, you'll only have yourself to blame.
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These are all the letters I’ve received
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Now waiting for NTO or pay it by Tuesday
@anthomy93 I wouldn't worry about the discount, Waltham Forest usually reoffers it anyway as long as you challenge the NTO within 14 days.
As I have stated above, please could you give us the PCN number and the number plate.
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Yes..
So basically they rejected my informal appeal that I have sent in the original post on 11th of October but I didn’t receive the letter until 31st of October.
Then they have sent a letter to extend my early fee discount on the 31st of august giving me until 7th of November to pay it.
Now waiting for NTO or pay it by Tuesday
I’m pretty sure it was parked next to that one sign that was changed….......
In which case how it is phrased will be important.
And at least now I have a clearer idea on the system progression.
PCN 8th Oct...we need to see all of it not just the front
Informal Challenge ? Date and Text needed
Informal Rejection dated 31st Oct
Now waiting for NTO/trying to decide whether to pay discount
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I’m pretty sure it was parked next to that one sign that was changed….......
In which case how it is phrased will be important.
And at least now I have a clearer idea on the system progression.
PCN 8th Oct...we need to see all of it not just the front
Informal Challenge ? Date and Text needed
Informal Rejection dated 31st Oct
Now waiting for NTO/trying to decide whether to pay discount
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I’m pretty sure it was parked next to that one sign that was changed…
To answer your direct question, yes, misleading signage is a valid reason to challenge, comes under ground of contravention did not occur.
I would however suggest that you spend the time to post up all documents.
People that focus on one ground that they think is strong often come unstuck.
If we are to discuss or advise, we need all the information.
An example for you which may or may not be the case.....
You parked right next door to the one sign that had been changed.
A motorist has a duty, each time they park, to check restrictions.
Given the above, an adjudicator could easily decide that the signage did not mislead.
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To answer your direct question, yes, misleading signage is a valid reason to challenge, comes under ground of contravention did not occur.
I would however suggest that you spend the time to post up all documents.
People that focus on one ground that they think is strong often come unstuck.
If we are to discuss or advise, we need all the information.
An example for you which may or may not be the case.....
You parked right next door to the one sign that had been changed.
A motorist has a duty, each time they park, to check restrictions.
Given the above, an adjudicator could easily decide that the signage did not mislead.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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To answer your direct question, yes, misleading signage is a valid reason to challenge, comes under ground of contravention did not occur.
I would however suggest that you spend the time to post up all documents.
People that focus on one ground that they think is strong often come unstuck.
If we are to discuss or advise, we need all the information.
An example for you which may or may not be the case.....
You parked right next door to the one sign that had been changed.
A motorist has a duty, each time they park, to check restrictions.
Given the above, an adjudicator could easily decide that the signage did not mislead.
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Please post up the PCN, or at least give us the PCN number and number plate.
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However, you have yet to post up the PCN ! It is important to see it, because sometimes they contain fatal errors of content making them void.
Their letter in response to your reps has not considered anything at all as far as I can see. I suspect this means they realise they have f**ked-up, but send you the usual FOb-Off letter, knowing most people then cough-up.
So, are you going to fold and cough-up ?
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PCN is posted with the first post alongside with the pictures provided by the council
Only document in opening post is a reply to your challenge/reps?
Yes that’s the only reply I’ve gotten.
Agent via phone told me council has failed to do their job to rake down the signs, but I still have to pay it according to him.
They sent me a copy of our recorded phone call so I have it as evidence to back up
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I have posted the letter I have received and their reason for giving PCN and refusal of my informal appeal.
Is misleading signage grounds to make a formal appeal or at tribunal if needed?
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As I posted in Pepipoo
As I understand what you are saying, there had been 10 signs, along the parking bays, all suspending parking on 28th August, then the council came along, took down one of these signs and replaced it with another one that looked identical to the others but it was for a later date of 8th October. More detail on the sign positioning is really needed, please.
From your narrative, there seems to be a case to be made for misleading signage. However, you have posted-up nothing at all, so we need to see (1) the PCN (all sides), and (2) the location. A GSV link will probably be sufficient.
So I assume you recieved a PCN on your car on the 8th October. Any reason for coming on here so late ?
You've now posted up some photos
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PCN is posted with the first post alongside with the pictures provided by the council
Only document in opening post is a reply to your challenge/reps?
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PCN is posted with the first post alongside with the pictures provided by the council
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Before we can think to help we need to see the PCN and all the council photos we can get them if you leave the PCN and reg number on view or you can get and post them
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more pictures from the road signs that were left up for 6 weeks upon completion of work
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Hi,
I have recently received a PCN on the grounds of parking in a suspended bay marked with a large yellow sign for 08/10/23 that suspended 1 bay on the whole road, however there were 10 large yellow signs on the road that we’re suspending the whole road for one day from 28/08/23 and all 10 were left up for 6 weeks and only replacing 1 out of 10 signs.
So they suspended parking on both sides of the road for the 4th of September, but left up all signs for 6 weeks then replaced one sign on the 30th of September suspending parking in one bay for 8th of October.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/2JqX4JBKyqjv9ntA8?g_st=ic
Do I have grounds on confusing and hard to understand road signs for appealing it to tribunal?
Thank you for responding.
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