Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: MrsDee on November 01, 2023, 10:33:43 pm
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It does state ‘you were the registered keeper of the vehicle or you have been named by the registered keeper as the driver/hirer at the time’ … but I suppose this does not confirm as to whether I was the alleged driver OR the hirer?
Ah yes, missed that on first reading, my mistake. Although it's rather shoddy of them to use the same template for both keepers and hirers. The hire company has named you as hirer, they do not know who was driving at the time as they were not there.
You could appeal along the lines of the below:
Dear Sirs,
I have received your Parking Charge Notice (Ref: ______) for Vehicle Registration Mark ______. I was the hirer of the vehicle in question, and I am appealing in my capacity as hirer. There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so.
Your notice makes a number of references to paragraph 9 of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA). Paragraph 9 refers to the requirements that a notice to keeper must comply with if the parking company wishes to recover the parking charges from the registered keeper. As I am not the registered keeper, this is entirely irrelevant, and the notice you have sent me cannot be relied on as a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b) of PoFA.
If you wish to recover the charges from me as the hirer of the vehicle, you must comply with the conditions of paragraph 14 of PoFA. I note that you have either failed, or chosen not to, comply with these conditions. These failures include (but are not limited to):- A failure to serve a Notice to Hirer containing all the information required by 14(5) of the Act.
- A failure to include the additional documents mentioned by 13(2) of the Act.
As a result of this, you are unable to recover the specified charge from me, the hirer. As I do not have liability for this charge, I am unable to help you further with this matter. I therefore look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you do not cancel the charge, you must issue a POPLA code.
Yours...
If you submit this online, make sure you do so as the hirer, be careful of any drop down boxes/menus etc. that ask you to name the driver, and once submitted keep an eye on your spam folder for a response. If you submit this by post, do so by regular first class post, obtaining a free certificate of posting from a post office. As you mentioned in your first post, waiting until day 20 from the issue date for them to receive your appeal may be wise.
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As requested, this is the back of the PCN. This was the only document sent to me from UKPA…
It does state ‘you were the registered keeper of the vehicle or you have been named by the registered keeper as the driver/hirer at the time’ … but I suppose this does not confirm as to whether I was the alleged driver OR the hirer?
Thank you so much for your help and advice too :)
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Can you show us the back page of the notice too? The notice you have uploaded calls itself a 'Notice to Keeper', and refers to you as the 'Registered keeper' - is this letter addressed to you, or is it a copy of the one addressed to the hire company?
Today, 1st November 2023, the hirer received via post the re-issued penalty notice (dated 26/10/2023)from UKPA but there were no copies of the hire agreement enclosed. From reading the info on the POFA 2012 and various posts I understand that this does not follow correct procedure and the POPLA would always uphold any appeals on this basis. Is this correct? (or do the attached copies that were sent from the Hire Company count?)
You are correct that the parking company should include additional documents (one of which is the hire agreement) - the full list is given in 13(2) of Schedule 4 of PoFA - it seems you've read it already, but if not, there's a link in my signature at the bottom of the post. If UKPA don't uphold your appeal, POPLA should (but we can never offer guarantees).
I understand that to appeal to POPLA, an appeal first needs to be submitted to UKPA?
Correct. I have some suggested wording for your appeal, once you've answered my query about the notice above I can tweak it for your case.
Regarding waiting until day 19/20, yes, it's to avoid them re-issuing everything correctly and then claiming to have complied.
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Advice needed please…
On 31st Aug 2023, a hire car overstayed by 20 mins due to foolishly not remembering exactly where they had parked in a large retail park (and not remembering exactly which shade of grey the hire car was! :-[ )
The PCN (dated 5/9/23) was sent to the Hire Company who then emailed the hirer on 22/9/23 to notify them that they had requested the PCN to be re-issued to the hirer. They attached a copy of the PCN, plus a copy of the hire agreement to the bottom of the email.
Today, 1st November 2023, the hirer received via post the re-issued penalty notice (dated 26/10/2023)from UKPA but there were no copies of the hire agreement enclosed. From reading the info on the POFA 2012 and various posts I understand that this does not follow correct procedure and the POPLA would always uphold any appeals on this basis. Is this correct? (or do the attached copies that were sent from the Hire Company count?)
I understand that to appeal to POPLA, an appeal first needs to be submitted to UKPA? But I am confused by the timing of it - there is talk of waiting for 20 days etc…? And also, when appealing to UKPA, would a person use the fact the hire document was not included as the basis of the appeal? Is that why people wait, so there is then insufficient time to forward the necessary documents?
I think I understand the principles but would really appreciate any guidance as to how the hirer should proceed with this.
Many thanks
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