Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: sometimeslucky7 on August 05, 2025, 11:24:43 am
-
You're not at tribunal, this only comes with a rejection of formal reps against s Notice to Owner..as it says in their reply.
So for now you either pay or wait until a NTO is served on the registered keeper.
So, who is the RK and are their DVLA details current?
-
Thank you. Any salient points I should mention?
In my view you don't have a defence (on the facts) as IMO you were clearly parked more than 50cm from kerb (see my post above).
However it is Greenwich who need to make the case of your contravention.
Personally I would take the discount if it is still available.
If it is not - then I would appeal along the lines that H C Andersen suggests, and put them to the test to proving otherwise.
Then hope that Greenwich make a hash of making the case that the distance was greater than 50cm, or fail to provide an evidence pack, at all, to the tribunal. (The latter isn't uncommon for Greenwich).
-
Greenwich have to prove their case, doubt should be exercised in your favour but much depends on which adjudicator you get. The only way to pay nothing is to start an Appeal at the tribunal so just do it.
Thank you. Any salient points I should mention?
-
Greenwich have to prove their case, doubt should be exercised in your favour but much depends on which adjudicator you get. The only way to pay nothing is to start an Appeal at the tribunal so just do it.
-
If the width of a front number plate is 520mm
(according to this (https://www.yournumberplates.co.uk/blogs/news/understanding-the-legal-requirements-for-uk-number-plates#:~:text=For%20vehicles%2C%20the%20front%20number%20plate%20must%20be,to%20road%20safety%20and%20easier%20identification%20of%20vehicles.))
Then this picture would seem to confirm that the car was parked greater than 500mm from kerb, and therefore in contravention.
IMO To appeal successfully would rely on a **** up on the council's part.
-
Evening all,
As expected, Greenwich standardly refused my appeal.
I will take it to tribunal, would be really grateful for any advice.
-
A good measure would be whatever the width of the yellow line is. It's in TSRGD, but I'd reckon 7.5cm. (3inches in old money).
-
Diameter of tyre is 59cm.
I'm still confident the car is not more than 50cm from the nearest point on the kerb. The fact the kerb line slopes away makes it look worse than it is. If the kerb continued in a straight line, there's no way it would be considered more than 50cm away.
-
Yes. A 195/55R15 tyre has a diameter of 594mm when brand new.
And the PCN is for parking more than 50cm from the edge of the carriageway. Doesn't that mean 50cm measured from the kerbstones and not from the yellow line?
-
195 (wide) 55 15 (rim diameter)
55 is the ratio between the sidewall height and width in % so the tyre height is:
55 x 195 /100 = 107.25mm = 10.725cm.
So diameter is 38cm rim + 2 x 10.7 = 59.4cm.
At least that's what I think.
-
Travelling doesn't preclude you accessing a tape measure, does it?
If others know the dimension, perhaps they'll chip in.
I’m abroad
-
15 inch tyres means the silver part of the wheel is 38cm diameter.
Looks borderline to me, but I'd say the onus is on the council to prove the allegation not you to defend it. It wouldn't be beyond the wit of man for the council to provide their CEOs with a 50cm tape measure they could use in their photos.
-
Travelling doesn't preclude you accessing a tape measure, does it?
If others know the dimension, perhaps they'll chip in.
-
You get a risk-free shot at the title provided you submit reps before 16th - read the back of the PCN.
Contravention did not occur
You can see from the photos that your parking was not exactly driving test standard, but none the less you dispute that no part of the vehicle is within 50 centimetres of the edge of the carriageway. As the CEO didn't have any way of inserting a scale in their photos, all parties are left to deduce. From your perspective, you would refer to the diameter of your wheels, including tyres, which you have just measured as ****. It can be seen that if your rear offside wheel was laid on its side it would *******.
OP, if you would measure your wheel from tread to opposite tread and let us know the measure then we'd know how to finish the above.
I’m currently travelling and won’t be back by the 16th, however my tire tire size is 195/55 R 15 if that’s any help?
-
@mrchip Thank you! I will try write something up. My tire size is 195/55 R 15 if that’s any help? I will submit my response tomorrow so any additional guidance is appreciated!
Yes please I do need help for the yellow box. I already submitted an appeal which was rejected so it will have to go to tribunal. I’m currently travelling so the only details I have to hand for are
Penalty Charge Notice: GR23795637
Verification Code: 76G5 | 3
Vehicle Registration Number: SBIOYLN
Date of Contravention: 27/06/2025
Location: PEARTREE WAY
Many thanks in advance!
-
Thank you! I will try write something up. My tire size is 195/55 R 15 if that’s any help? I will submit my response tomorrow so any additional guidance is appreciated!
Yes please I do need help for the yellow box. I already submitted an appeal which was rejected so it will have to go to tribunal. I’m currently travelling so the only details I have to hand for that are
Penalty Charge Notice: GR23795637
Verification Code: 76G5 | 3
Vehicle Registration Number: SBIOYLN
Date of Contravention: 27/06/2025
Location: PEARTREE WAY
Many thanks in advance!
-
You get a risk-free shot at the title provided you submit reps before 16th - read the back of the PCN.
Contravention did not occur
You can see from the photos that your parking was not exactly driving test standard, but none the less you dispute that no part of the vehicle is within 50 centimetres of the edge of the carriageway. As the CEO didn't have any way of inserting a scale in their photos, all parties are left to deduce. From your perspective, you would refer to the diameter of your wheels, including tyres, which you have just measured as ****. It can be seen that if your rear offside wheel was laid on its side it would *******.
OP, if you would measure your wheel from tread to opposite tread and let us know the measure then we'd know how to finish the above.
-
To me, that back wheel looks closer than 50cm from the edge of the carriageway. As long as some part of the car is within 50cm of the kerb, then my understanding is that it isn't a contravention.
It definitely looks to be no more than a wheel diameter, and I would estimate yours are about 40cm?
Ps do you want us to look at the box junction PCN too? They are often beatable even if you did stop within the box.
-
Do I have any grounds here or should I not bother to appeal and pay? Any help would be appreciated
-
Greenwich currently loses a lot of tribunal cases because it doesn't supply basic evidence so loses by default. But who knows if they'll get their act together.
-
@John U.K. it was placed on my car. Please see attached
-
@stamfordman There was no other parking on the street, it always gets like this on a Friday. Car park just next door was completely full also. I was supposed to get back in my car later that evening but didn’t end up doing so, so I left my car there.
The ticket was issued on the Saturday and it looks like there’s a load of space behind and I purposely left a big gap, however there was actually a different car parked directly behind me to which I parked much closer.
-
There was no other parking on the street, it always gets like this on a Friday. Car park just next door was completely full also. I was supposed to get back in my car later that evening but didn’t end up doing so, so I left my car there.
The ticket was issued on the Saturday and it looks like there’s a load of space behind and I purposely left a big gap, however there was actually a different car parked directly behind me to which I parked much closer.
-
Hi all,
I received a ticket for allegedly being parked 50cm away from the line.
Was this PCN served on car or sent by post?
If on car, please post both sides (unredacted) here; if postal all sides of the PCN, redacting only yr name & address. Please also post any Council photos and a GSV link to the location.
I’m exhausted as I received another ticket last week for being in a yellow box junction
If you'd like help with this PCN then start a separate thread with brief account of the circumstances an post there all sides of the PCN, redacting only yr name & address, also the video and a GSV link..
------
For Guidance on posting images see
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/
-------
EDIT:
This post crossed with Stamfordman. There may be a technical argument, so please post the PCN.
-
A fair cop guv is my opinion.
-
Could be marginal or not 50cm.
Why did you park there and like this.
(https://i.ibb.co/21pt1Xfc/gr4.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/PGfhDdpL/gr3.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/GfQLRRTS/gr2.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/hnS6DjT/gr1.jpg)
-
Hi all,
I received a ticket for allegedly being parked 50cm away from the line.
I’m exhausted as I received another ticket last week for being in a yellow box junction because the driver ahead of me suddenly switched lane, so I’m not trying to be out of pocket for £160 🥲
Council is Greenwich and PCN no. is GR11682123
Reg SB10YLN
Do I have any grounds to appeal?