Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: shawki1974 on July 25, 2025, 12:59:11 am
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Dear All
Thanks for all your help in advance.
As expected the council has rejected the appeal of the said PCN.
I am just a bit late in posting this.
Posting the councils response at this link. The 14 day period is over. So what are my options.
As you can see from the video , just drove at most a car length. So don't know what entire length of the Bus lane means. Could they have mistaken me for a different vehicle.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uwlJW6969aFJ5UdMzz1CJhLs9Qio1-1O/view?usp=drive_link
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This is extrapolation of the urine.
BEFORE you include anything, please screenshot their page as it contains no grounds at all: For later.
I make this informal challenge:
1. There is no evidence in the video of an advanced warning sign (958) allegedly passed. Neither is there any evidence of a 959 sign allegedly passed.
2. Even if there were such evidence, the legends on the road are so poorly maintained as not to be fit for purpose.
3. The alleged incursion is de minimis non curat lex.
Considering the above, please cancel the PCN.
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STOP/hold fire please. As above, the whole PCN less personal details. I will be back later with a draft.
@shawki1974 re. Yr Report to Moderator. Your PCN is in the link in your opening post and does not carry your name & address. For the convenience of Hippocrates and others I post it here.
(https://i.imgur.com/bDwfdHp.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/3fgH4RX.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/asTfSY7.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Z7x3s7I.jpeg)
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STOP/hold fire please. As above, the whole PCN less personal details. I will be back later with a draft.
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Please read the READ THIS FIRST - **BEFORE POSTING YOUR CASE!** (https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/) sticky post at the top of this Forum. The please post up all the pages of the PCN. Just redact your name and address, please leave everything else visible.
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Dear All
Hope you are doing well.
Unfortunately received a PCN for being in a bus lane as I entered early over the solid white line for a left turn up ahead, admittedly I was avoiding a couple of cars in the lane. Had been waiting there for cars to let me in for a couple of green lights. So went passed the Keep clear and then into the zig zags and just didnt get back in the labe early enough. Just drifted into the Bus Lane and was out in 4 seconds and probably travelled about 5 meters. But this is a cash cow for Newham Council , so didnt expect any leniency.
Sadly, I do this route twice a week, but usually better than this. Got the hours wrongs as its ok to travel there during weekdays around 3 pm. So, Wrong on both accounts!
Is there any grounds to appeal given I was looking to take the upcoming left turn and probably fall into De minimis.
Appreciate any advice, even if the best thing is to just pay up - thanks! Not got long.
Google Maps location: https://www.google.com/maps/place/East+Ham+Leisure+Centre/@51.533474,0.0577009,3a,48.9y,249.44h,80.83t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1s2hFQcCXQUANtiiTXOjyPhw!2e0!5s20220501T000000!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D9.165424202542297%26panoid%3D2hFQcCXQUANtiiTXOjyPhw%26yaw%3D249.4367445523559!7i16384!8i8192!4m6!3m5!1s0x47d8a6382b2e2a99:0x123176242eda06fd!8m2!3d51.532428!4d0.0563804!16s%2Fg%2F1tfc18f8?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDcyMS4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D
There is a video link for this and the PCN are posted below https://imgur.com/a/NaUIORd.
Video link is below. I am in the Brown Mini Countryman.
https://imgur.com/a/uruWZ4u
This is the draft i have written :
Dear Sirs,
I am writing in response to the Enforcement Notice issued to me regarding PCN: PN 77193357. I kindly request that you reconsider my informal representations, as I am now making formal representations against the Enforcement Notice.
I have several reasons for disputing this PCN:
- The alleged contravention did not occur as described. My actions were in accordance with the traffic rules and road markings in place. I was merely attempting to merge into the exit lane to make a left turn, creating a situation that can only be described as de minimis. According to the regulations, a 20-meter rule should normally be observed before issuing a PCN for a bus lane violation. In this case, my vehicle clearly did not enter the bus lane for this distance. I simply made a permitted left turn , crossed the traffic lights and slightly brushed across the bus lane, covering no more than 5 meters in a 5 sec period while I was attempting to move right and join the permitted roadway.
- The video evidence provided does not clearly show any signs allegedly passed or violated. This raises questions about the accuracy and validity of the alleged contravention.
- The road and traffic layout creates a very difficult situation for cars entering from Wellington Road attempting to turn left. All the vehicles coming from the right side of Barking road pack the permitted entry way before the lights and donot allow cars from Wellington Road any space to enter Barking Road. This road markings and layout can be confusing and misleading to motorists. This can contribute to being stuck on the Wellington road while being harangued by traffic behind your vehicle.
- The photographs included as evidence appear to be more helpful in indicating where my vehicle crossed over into the bus lane and the arrow indicating vehicles could enter the lane. This occurred almost immediately after my vehicle crossed over. Notably, less than 5 meters and 5 secs as is visible in these pictures and videos.
- I request that you provide strict proof that the camera used for monitoring and enforcement satisfies the admissibility criteria of evidence at the Tribunal, as outlined in Para 7(2) of Schedule 1 of The London Local Authorities Act 1996 (as amended) and Part II. Ensuring the accuracy and validity of the evidence is essential in any case. (I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THIS POINT, CAN REMOVE IF NOT RELEVANT IN CASE THERE IS CHANGE IN LEGISLATION)
Furthermore, I would like to highlight that my vehicle entered the bus lane for no more than 5 meters of the remaining stretch of that lane. Additionally, at the time of entry, there were no bus attempting entry. I entered the bus lane with the sole intention of turning right at the junction, which was a mere 4 meters ahead of my vehicle. I did not undertake any vehicles, nor did I gain any advantage over other motorists.
Considering the circumstances and the lack of any significant violation, I kindly request that you cancel the PCN. I would like to emphasize that this is the first time I have received such a PCN, and I am committed to abiding by all traffic rules and regulations in the future.
I appreciate your prompt attention to this matter and look forward to a favourable resolution. Please do not hesitate to contact me if you require any further information or clarification regarding my representations.