Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: icedspurs83 on July 22, 2025, 10:11:47 pm

Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on September 14, 2025, 08:47:06 pm
Great news update!

Got a reply from Zenith apologising, saying the £50 charge will be refunded, as will the £10 administration fee, and they will apply a £10 goodwill credit for the inconvenience.

They've also committed (so they say) to reviewing their processes for future occasions.

Thank you so much for your help @b789 - could not have gotten anywhere close to a resolution without you. Hugely grateful for the time you spent in helping.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on August 08, 2025, 05:52:27 pm
Thank you very much for this. This hits the nail on the head completely (again).

I managed to speak with someone from the fleet team at my employer (who, for what it's worth, noted the incredible detail of your response!).

The only comment they made is to offer Zenith one final chance to respond properly and not make this the formal 'letter before action' - hoping for some goodwill now the employer is in cc. And then saving the LOA in our back pocket for the next response, if they don't play ball.

To my mind, I agree with you in that the LBA feels right to do now... but it's useful to have the fleet team on side so i've removed that line for now.

Thanks again - will let you know what they come back with.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: b789 on August 08, 2025, 12:50:14 pm
Zenith’s latest reply is wholly inadequate, factually incorrect in places, and ultimately self-serving. Here is a formal rebuttal to their email that you should send in response (either to the same representative or escalated to their formal complaints team) and CC: [Fleet Manager Name],

– for visibility and also CC yourself:

Quote
Subject: Formal Complaint – Continued Mishandling and Misstatements Regarding PCN [REF]

Dear [Name],

Thank you for your delayed response. Regrettably, your email fails to address the material issues raised and introduces several inaccuracies that must now be formally challenged. This is now escalated as a formal complaint.

1. Misstatement Regarding PoFA Schedule 4 and Lease Vehicles

You claim that Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 does not apply to long-term lease vehicles and only to short-term hire agreements. That is categorically incorrect.

PoFA Sch 4 clearly applies to both hire and lease vehicles, as the legislation refers to “a vehicle hired to a person under a hire agreement”, and includes no distinction based on the hire duration or whether the hirer is a corporate entity. Further, the standard required for transferring liability is not that the lease agreement must be ‘suitable’ or contain specific wording. It simply requires:

• A copy of the hire/lease agreement; and
• A statement of liability signed by the hirer (Schedule 4, paragraph 13(2)).

If your lease documentation with the company is unsuitable for this statutory mechanism, then it is a failing of your processes—not of the law. Your claim that “parking companies reject” such transfers is unsubstantiated and immaterial. It is your legal obligation as Keeper to attempt the transfer under PoFA, and Premier Park's own NtK expressly invites you to do so. Instead, you chose to pay the charge and pass on the cost, thereby extinguishing my legal right to appeal. This is not best practice; it is systemic failure.

2. Incorrect Application of Policy Wording

Your continued reference to “fines” and “penalty notices” in your lease agreement documentation does not cover Parking Charge Notices (PCNs) issued by unregulated private firms. PCNs issued by Premier Park are not fines in law—they are speculative invoices based on alleged breach of contract.

Unless the wording of the agreement explicitly extends to civil contractual charges of this nature, your actions in paying and recharging the amount are legally questionable. You have admitted that the terminology is “not technically accurate”. That is a tacit admission that you are relying on vague or misleading language to justify automatic deductions from employees' wages—amounts that are not statutory, not enforceable without court judgment, and are hotly contested.

3. Post-Payment Appeal Option – Misleading Advice

Your claim that most operators allow appeals after payment is unsupported and directly contradicted by Premier Park’s own NtK, which states:

Please note, where payment of the parking charge is made this will preclude the ability to appeal.

It is misleading to suggest that appeal is still available. POPLA also confirms this explicitly: payment is deemed acceptance of liability and removes any right of appeal.

Further, your suggestion that I take the matter up with my employer is both inappropriate and evasive. You are the contracting party who paid the charge, failed to exercise your legal rights under PoFA, and are now attempting to shift responsibility. My employer was not a party to the appeal process and cannot retrospectively resolve a situation caused by your failure.

4. Goodwill Gesture – Refund of Admin Fee

While the refund of your administrative fee is noted, this does not resolve the substantive issue: the full charge was paid and recharged to me when it should never have been paid at all.

5. Outstanding Requirements

To resolve this matter, I require the following within 14 days:

• A full refund of the PCN amount recharged to me;
• A copy of the actual lease agreement you claim precludes PoFA compliance (if not provided, this will be assumed to be a false representation);
• Confirmation of your membership status with the BVRLA;
• Confirmation that this matter has now been logged as a formal complaint and is being investigated at the appropriate level.

Please treat this email as a Letter Before Action. If the refund is not issued within 14 days, I will:

• Pursue the matter via the small claims track of the County Court, and
• Report your organisation to the BVRLA and the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) regarding unlawful processing of my personal data and unauthorised deductions.

This incident reveals a fundamental failure in your internal processes, a misapplication of law, and repeated attempts to shift blame. That is unacceptable in any regulated leasing operation, let alone one dealing with large-scale corporate clients and employee salary deductions.

I am copying in Fleet and HR colleagues as this matter has implications for employee rights and salary deductions under the current car scheme agreement with Zenith. I respectfully request that this issue be reviewed internally in light of Zenith's failure to follow statutory process.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Full Name]

[Employee Number, if relevant]
[Vehicle Registration Number]

It is advisable—and tactically sound—to copy your employer’s fleet manager and/or HR department into the correspondence, for the following reasons:

Zenith claims their actions were “in line with the agreement made with your company”. If your employer is a party to that agreement, they may bear some contractual or practical responsibility for the flawed process that led to your loss of appeal rights. Your employer should therefore be aware that their agreement is causing financial and legal detriment to staff—particularly where it allows automatic deductions for speculative, non-statutory charges without due process.

Once your employer sees that Zenith’s system is undermining employees’ legal rights, they may apply pressure for better handling in future. It also opens the door to a broader review of the lease agreement, deduction process, and handling of PCNs.

If you escalate to court, copying your employer shows that you made every attempt to resolve the issue and highlight the flaws in the process, which supports a claim for reasonable conduct.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on August 08, 2025, 12:09:02 pm
After chasing multiple times - I finally received a response...

Quote
Good Morning,

Please accept my apologies for the lateness of the reply to your email regarding the Parking Notice [XXX]. I hope that I can go some way to providing an satisfactory response to each of your points.

1. Failure to Transfer Liability under PoFA Schedule 4
As the legislature in PoFa Schedule 4 states, the registered keeper of the vehicle becomes liable for the parking notice subject to the parking operator complying with a series of requirements on issuing the NTK (Notice to keeper). It also includes details on how the registered keeper may request a transfer of liability for the notice to another party. The legislature however was written to address the transfer specifically for a hire vehicle and does not have clauses that support a similar option where a vehicle is on long term lease, especially to a corporate customer, as is the case with this vehicle. One of the strict requirements is for the keeper to provide a signed copy of the hire agreement, a document that contains the admission of the hirer to accept liability for any parking notices incurred while the vehicle is on hire. Unfortunately the lease agreement we have with your employer is unsuitable for this and so we are unable to meet the legal requirement to request a transfer of liability under schedule 4 of PoFA. Transfer requests such as this are met by the parking company rejecting the request as not meeting the legal requirement, and escalating the cost of the notice to the full value, typically £100. To avoid this situation the agreement with your employer is for us to make payment of parking notices when received to take advantage of the discounted amount.

2 Incorrect Application of Lease Agreement Clause
It is important to us that our policy agreements are clear and easily understandable by our customers. As part of making the policy document clear we had opted to use the colloquialism 'Fines' for Parking Notices as they can be referenced under a number of different titles, Parking notices, penalty notices, Byelaw contraventions etc. The term 'Fines' while not technically accurate as you have stated, is one that the majority of readers would be able to identify against a parking notice.

3 Preclusion of Appeal
Briefly mentioned above, our agreement with your employer is for us to make payment for the parking notices we receive as soon as possible to take advantage of the discount period, this usually reducing a £100 notice amount to £60. Most of the parking companies allow appeals to be submitted post payment as they understand that the NTK may not be sent to the driver of the vehicle who may wish to appeal the notice. There are however a few parking companies that will not consider an appeal after payment has been made. We are working with the BVRLA and are submitting our experience in the current Government consultation on private parking to have this option to appeal after payment be a legal requirement that parking operators have to allow. Understandably this doesn't help with the notice we have paid for this vehicle and can appreciate the frustration the outcome of the parking companies refusal to consider an appeal now. Our recommendation in these rare situations would be for you to submit all the appeal information to your employer to consider if they believe the appeal would have been successful had the parking company considered it, if reasonable they may consider not recharging the notice to yourself.

Given the frustration this may have caused you, I will arrange for us to credit back our administration fee and hope that this gesture and the above information goes some way to ameliorate your experience. If, however, this does not please let me know and I can pass this on to our complaints team.

Kind regards


My comments/questions are as follows:


I would very much welcome your views on what they've said, and would of course appreciate any wording to use in a response.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on July 25, 2025, 07:28:48 pm
Thank you very much for this. I have responded to them and will let you know when I hear back!
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: b789 on July 25, 2025, 02:01:27 pm
That response is a classic example of intellectual malnourishment from whoever authored it. I suggest you respond robustly with the following:

Quote
Subject: Re: Mishandling of Parking Charge Notice – Formal Rebuttal and Refund Demand

Dear Zenith,

Thank you for your response, which regrettably fails to address the substance of the issue raised and instead offers a series of evasions dressed up as procedural compliance.

Your assertion that the PCN was “paid and recharged in line with the agreement made with your company” is a non-answer. I invite you to identify the specific clause in that agreement which authorises payment of speculative invoices issued by unregulated private parking firms—particularly where liability could have been lawfully transferred under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA). The agreement refers to penalties and fines, not Parking Charge Notices, which are neither statutory nor enforceable without a valid contract.

Your failure to follow the statutory mechanism for transferring liability—despite clear instructions on the Notice to Keeper—has deprived the hirer of their legal right to appeal. This is not a minor administrative oversight; it is a fundamental breach of process that has resulted in financial loss and procedural injustice.

Moreover, your repeated reference to Premier Park as an “issuing authority” is both factually and legally indefensible. Premier Park is a private, unregulated parking firm. It is not an authority in any statutory sense. Authorities—such as local councils or the police—issue penalty charge notices under statutory powers. Premier Park issues parking charge notices, which are speculative invoices based on alleged breach of contract. The distinction is not semantic; it is foundational.

Your use of the term “authority” in this context suggests either:

• A fundamental misunderstanding of the legal framework governing parking enforcement, or
• A deliberate attempt to mislead, by cloaking a private entity in the language of statutory legitimacy.

Either interpretation reflects poorly on your organisation’s competence and integrity. I suggest you review your internal communications protocols to ensure that future correspondence does not perpetuate such legally illiterate terminology.

Your suggestion to “appeal in writing” to Premier Park is equally disingenuous. POPLA and Premier Park’s own documentation confirm that payment constitutes admission of liability and extinguishes any right of appeal. Your advice is therefore not only misleading but demonstrably futile.

I now require the following:

• A full refund of any amount charged to my account in relation to this PCN.
• A copy of the agreement you rely on to justify payment of non-statutory charges.
• Confirmation of your internal process for handling PCNs and how it aligns with PoFA 2012.
• Confirmation of your BVRLA membership status, as I am preparing a formal complaint under their ADR scheme.

I reserve the right to escalate this matter via the County Court should you fail to resolve it within 14 days. Your procedural failure is not shielded by vague references to internal agreements, and I will not absorb the cost of your statutory illiteracy.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Name]
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on July 25, 2025, 01:32:16 pm
Hi both

See below from Zenith - not very helpful...

Quote
I am sorry to hear you unhappy with how we have handled this notice. Please note this notice has been paid and recharged in line with the agreement made with your company. Due to this we would be unable to amend this process. We would advise to speak to your Fleet team or HR team if you are unhappy with the current agreement.

In regards to the appeal process; Although Issuing authorities portals will not allow you to submit an appeal due to the payment being made, you are still able to appeal in writing directly with the issuing authority. To do so you will need to write a letter of appeal and send this along with the third party permission letter attached directly to Premier Park. Please note the address for Premier park can be found on the third party permission letter. If your appeal is successful we will need proof of cancellation and refund from Premier park so that we can raise the appropriate credit.

As we have followed the process agreed with your company correctly we would not be able to issue a refund and would advise to appeal with the issuing authority in writing if you believe the notice has been issued in error.


To my mind a few points coming out of this are:

Would welcome your thoughts on how best to respond.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on July 23, 2025, 11:46:22 am
Understood - thank you very much.

I've complained to the lease company - I will report back when I hear.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: b789 on July 23, 2025, 11:36:18 am
There is NO WAY that the unregulated private parking firm is going to let you appeal when it very clearly says on the back of the NtK the if paid, there is no appeal opportunity. You can try and waste your time and effort whilst they snigger at your wasted effort.

I have just discussed this case with my friend, a district judge, and he has agreed that you have been wronged by your lease company and the only recourse you have if they refuse to refund you is to sue them for the money.

As I mentioned, it would cost you £35 to file a claim ending MCOL and when you are successful, assuming they don't agree to settle before a hearing, you would receive the amount you are claiming plus your costs, which would include the £35.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on July 23, 2025, 09:44:50 am
Thank you both - this is incredibly helpful (and apologies for missing the emphasised point on charges versus fines/penalties - annoyed I missed that!)

Just to confirm, there is no other reference to 'parking charges' (or similar) in the agreement.



Ok - so I will escalate via the lease company in the first instance and report back. Thank you for the template wording above - this is incredibly helpful.

In respect of the charge itself - am I right in saying there is no way of appealing it (either via company or POPLA)? Just wondering whether running that appeal in parallel to the complaint with the lease company gives two avenues as opposed to one.



Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: b789 on July 23, 2025, 09:39:34 am
It is not a FINE or an OFFENCE and you received no PENALTY! If they are deducting this money from your payslip then you will have to sue them for the money in the county court. This is a simple procedure done online and we will advise through every step of the way and they would be liable for the fixed costs of the claim too.

It costs £35 to file the claim using MCOL. It would be heard at your local county court.

There is NOTHING you have shown us in that agreement that permits them to charge3 you for a speculative invoice from a private firm.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: DWMB2 on July 23, 2025, 09:35:29 am
Quote
Check your lease agreement and show us exactly what it says about parking charges, not fines or penalties
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on July 23, 2025, 09:33:14 am
Thank you both. In response to the points you've raised:


Quote
You are responsible for all fines. These can include parking fines, fixed penalties, camera offences, bus lane contraventions and all congestion charges/pre-payments incurred whether the vehicle is being used for business or private purposes. For all congestion charges, all bus lane fines, parking fines and penalty charge notices, Zenith will be charged directly as registered keeper of the car. This cost will then be charged to you with the addition of an administration fee of £10 plus VAT as a deduction from your net salary.

My questions are therefore as follows:

Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: b789 on July 23, 2025, 09:03:58 am
Just to point out, you cannot appeal an NtK that is not addressed to you as you are not the Registered Keeper. This is why the lease company should transfer liability to you as the Hirer and the operator then has to issue a Notice to Hirer (NtH) in your name.

They have absolutely no idea who the driver is and ONLY the driver can be liable. As the NtK and no doubt the subsequent NtH are and would have been non-compliant with PoFA paragraph 9(2)(a) and subsequently paragraphs 13 and 14, as long as the driver is not identified, there would be no liability.

All the Hirer has to do is refer to the driver in the third person. No "I did this or that", only "the driver did this or that". These types of PCNs are "golden tickets" as long as the Keeper or Hirer don't mess it up, just like your lease company have managed to do.
Title: Re: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: b789 on July 23, 2025, 08:55:02 am
If your stupid ignorant lease company have paid the charge, there is absolutely nothing you can do to appeal this. Premier Park are laughing all the way to the bank and your only recourse is to either chargeback the amount your stupid lease company have paid or sue them for it in the small claims track of the county court.

If your lease company is a member of the BVRLA, report them as being incompetent idiots. All they had to do was follow the instruction on the back, right at the top which states:

Quote
Vehicle Hirers
If you are a vehicle-hire firm and the vehicle was on hire at the time of the parking incident, please let us know and provide us with a copy of the hire agreement and a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement.

Having done that, they would be absolved of any liability under PoFA 2012 as the Keeper of the vehicle and Premier Park would have had to issue a Notice to Hirer (NtH) in your name and, knowing how every single unregulated private parking firm manages to screw this part up, you would only have had to appeal to POPLA for this to be cancelled.

Check your lease agreement and show us exactly what it says about parking charges, not fines or penalties, as a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) is simply a speculative invoice and an unregulated private parking firm is not an 'authority' of any kind. You have been stung by the incompetence of your lease company and you should make sure that any charge they make to you is refunded, either by getting your bank or credit card company to make a chargeback or by making a claim in the county court small claims track.

I suggest you write to your lease company with the following which will put you in a very strong position should they try to charge you for their mistake and you then need to recover the money, either through a chargeback or with a court claim:

Quote
Subject: Formal Complaint and Demand for Refund – Mishandling of Parking Charge Notice

Dear [Lease Company Name],

I am writing to express my profound disappointment and anger at your handling of a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) issued by Premier Park in relation to a leased vehicle under your management. Your decision to summarily pay the charge—rather than correctly transferring liability to the hirer in accordance with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA)—is both procedurally negligent and demonstrative of a troubling lack of competence in managing statutory obligations.

The Notice to Keeper (NtK) issued by Premier Park included clear instructions for vehicle-hire firms, prominently stating:

Vehicle Hirers If you are a vehicle-hire firm and the vehicle was on hire at the time of the parking incident, please let us know and provide us with a copy of the hire agreement and a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement.

Had your team taken the minimal effort required to read and act upon this guidance, liability would have been lawfully transferred to the Hirer, and Premier Park would have been required to issue a Notice to Hirer (NtH). This would have afforded the Hirer a straightforward route to appeal.

This Parking Charge Notice (PCN) is not a 'fine' or 'penalty' issued by an 'authority' under statutory law. It is simply a speculative invoice from an unregulated private parking firm, yet you have decided arbitrarily to simply pay it and asked the Hirer to appeal, which is an impossibility. Had you bothered to actually read the NtK, you would, or should have known that once this speculative invoice had been paid, there is no recourse to appeal as it clearly states on the back, just under the instructions to Hire/lease companies that:

Appeals & Enquiries
Please note, where payment of the parking charge is made this will preclude the ability to appeal.

Instead, your actions have deprived the Hirer of any opportunity to appeal, handed an unregulated private firm an unearned financial reward, and demonstrated a worrying disregard for both statutory process and customer protection. This is not merely an administrative oversight—it is a failure of basic competence.

I therefore require the following:

• A full refund of any amount charged to my account in relation to this PCN.
• Written assurance that your internal procedures will be reviewed and amended to ensure future compliance with PoFA.
• Confirmation of your membership status with the British Vehicle Rental and Leasing Association (BVRLA), as I am considering escalation via their ADR scheme for breach of Code of Conduct.

Should you fail to issue the refund within 14 days of this letter, I will pursue recovery through a chargeback or the small claims track of the County Court without further correspondence.

I trust you will treat this matter with the seriousness it warrants and take immediate steps to rectify the consequences of your mismanagement.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Name]
[Your Address]
[Your Contact Information]
Title: Premier Park PCN - Not Parked Wholly Within Bay - Capital Shopping Park, Cardiff
Post by: icedspurs83 on July 22, 2025, 10:11:47 pm
Background:





Image of contravention:


(https://i.imgur.com/7ELS4KS.jpeg)



Notice received is as follows:

Page 1:

(https://i.imgur.com/yfH3Iba.jpeg)

Page 2:

(https://i.imgur.com/7DCCvMu.jpeg)



Signage in car park

Apologies - I have not had a chance to go back out to the car park. I will do so to take pictures of the signage.

In the meantime, here are two helpful street view images (albeit, from 2021) - exact location here (https://maps.app.goo.gl/SmRyvWNhVMfjWbcE9)


It doesn't appear the entrance to the car park has any signs.


First one is one of the sign (apologies for blurriness)


(https://i.imgur.com/UfB5VTw.png)


Second one is of the car park - I have circled where my car was parked, and the nearest sign


(https://i.imgur.com/pslSgts.jpeg)


Request

I would be grateful if you could let me know whether you think I have grounds for appeal. If so, I would appreciate if you could share any input as to what to include in the appeal / how best to go about doing this.


Thanks[/u][/b]