Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: Hashim on July 04, 2025, 03:39:56 pm
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OP, slow down.
You have received a Charge Cert despite making representations against the NTO in time but not receiving a formal Notice of Rejection from the council.
This does NOT mean they did not send one, it means that it wasn't received.
These things can happen.
I notice that they reserve the right to reply to reps by email if one was included in the reps. Was an email included? Have you checked your emails, including junk?
This is a procedure and you must stick with it or risk dragging defeat from the jaws of victory. The council are in this with you and know how things work.
So find out by contacting the council. Keep it light, don't complain and don't make it sound like an appeal or challenge against the CC. Just tell them a CC has been received despite making reps in time and would they confirm whether and when a Notice of Rejection was sent, if so would they please send a copy and when might they issue an Order for Recovery. You never know, if the c**k-up is at their end then they could even cancel the PCN.
All you're doing is finding out how and when a NOR was sent and asking for a copy to give you a head's up before the post-CC process kicks in. Have you read the link provided earlier? There's also this which comes from the tribunal website, you're at the Charge Certificate stage:
https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/parking-penalty-charge-notice-enforcement-process
In short:
You don't pay the CC but wait for the Order for Recovery. You complete the enclosed Witness Statement by ticking one box, signing and returning to the Traffic Enforcement Centre who would then cancel the OfR, write to the council and tell them to cancel the CC and copy this letter to you.
The council then have to refer the matter to the adjudicator who would likely require you to provide them with a copy of your reps (so keep a copy) after which an adjudication hearing would be scheduled.
All routine, nothing special or out of the ordinary in your case.
*-you/your =your friend.
NB. you cannot contact the council unless authorised in writing by the registered keeper because of data protection rules.
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Ok. So what happens after all this process...
We go to court???
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Apologies for the discrepancy. Writing on behalf of a friend. Yes quite rightly NTO was received on the 9th Sept and a response was given on the same date and we were waiting for THIS response which we never received.
For them now to claim that we did not respond to the NTO is absolutely false as we have an email dated the 9th September giving a reference number.
https://ibb.co/tMGZ0NNV
What now please....
Then you need to follow the advice here:
https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/charge-certificate-cases-under-the-traffic-management-act-2004-no-original-notic/
(https://i.ibb.co/QFg8Wqqy/IMG-20251126-WA0014.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tMGZ0NNV)
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Apologies for the discrepancy. Writing on behalf of a friend. Yes quite rightly NTO was received on the 9th Sept and a response was given on the same date and we were waiting for THIS response which we never received.
For them now to claim that we did not respond to the NTO is absolutely false as we have an email dated the 9th September giving a reference number.
https://ibb.co/tMGZ0NNV
What now please....
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+1
HCA is right to raise the discrepancy: I did not read far enough back in the thread - your post today is at odds with your post #8 of 7th September last.
Did you follow Incandescent's advice in post #9 of the same date?
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???
We have now received the NTO.
You must now respond to the NtO, (pay or submit a formal representation).
So after 2 months of waiting for the NTO He received this notice today which states that he did not respond to the NTO and so has lost all rights of appeal.
OP, pl explain.
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The matter can be reset - have a read of
https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/charge-certificate-cases-under-the-traffic-management-act-2004-no-original-pcn/
For convenience:
(https://i.ibb.co/5xTWF2sq/Screenshot-20251125-155116-Whats-App.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fGMYvQrm)
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This is typical Newham council.
So after 2 months of waiting for the NTO He received this notice today which states that he did not respond to the NTO and so has lost all rights of appeal.
They never send the NTO as this has happened to him before even though they claim to have done.
https://ibb.co/fGMYvQrm.
Whats next.....
Thanks
Hashim
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You must now respond to the NtO, (pay or submit a formal representation). There is no point in paying, because the penalty cannot rise any higher than the full PCN penalty if you submit them and they refuse them. When they refuse, you register an appeal at London Tribunals. The full PCN penalty is in play, but nothing more.
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Hi.
We have now received the NTO. What's next....
All the other signs on the same road have also have their timings taped over.
Not sure who this was done by...
https://i.imgur.com/9WYqtjN.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/7tkiqpB.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/Zdt865z.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/id4EdNH.jpeg
Thanks
Hashim
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Mr Chips
No idea why the timings have been taped over.
Stamfordman
What is NTO? and how do I go about representing this there.
Thanks
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The next step is the NTO not the tribunal.
I would be inclined to go on with this, reminding Newham of its duty to act fairly, and hoping at least for a recommendation to cancel at the tribunal should they push you there.
I think I've got a similar case to cite - I'll see if I can locate it.
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I can't find the case I was thinking of but this one has some relevance but the mitigation may be more compelling.
Case reference 2250161884
Appellant xxxxxxx
Authority London Borough of Havering
VRM HJ20LUD
PCN Details
PCN HG29912472
Contravention date 22 Aug 2024
Contravention time 09:42:00
Contravention location Vine Street
Penalty amount GBP 110.00
Contravention Parked resident/shared use without a valid permit
Referral date -
Decision Date 06 Aug 2025
Adjudicator Sean Stanton-Dunne
Appeal decision Appeal refused with recommendation
Direction Full penalty charge notice amount stated to be paid within 28 days.
Reasons Miss xxxxx has attended the hearing today by video link.
It is not in dispute that Miss xxxx’s car was parked in the permit holder only parking bay during the controlled hours. Miss xxxx appeals because she says that she held a valid resident’s permit for the period from 4 November 2023 to 3 November 2024 and that the permit was renewed on 27 October 2024.
The Council does not dispute that there was a valid permit for this period. The Council resists the appeal because the vehicle registration HJ20LUD had been removed from the permit on 5 August 2024 and was not added back until 10.11am on 22 August 2024. The Council says that there was, therefore, no permit for this vehicle when the PCN was issued.
The Council has provided a screenshot which confirms the removal of the vehicle registration. Miss xxxxx says that it was removed because a different vehicle was being used for this period. She has explained to me that she went on holiday and that vehicle registration HJ20LUD was left at the airport. Miss xxxxx says that she added her mother-in-law’s car to the permit in place of vehicle registration HJ20LUD as her mother-in-law was house sitting while she was away. Miss xxxxx says that she returned with the car to the property on the morning of 22 August and that the PCN was issued before she had the chance to go online to add the vehicle registration back to the permit.
Whilst there was, in strict legal terms, a contravention, this is clearly a very unfortunate situation where a resident has been diligent in having a permit in place and made a temporary alteration of vehicle details due to holiday arrangements. It is clear from Miss xxxxx’s evidence that she had just returned to the property and was going to add the normal registration back. In the circumstances, I am asking the Council to reconsider cancellation of the PCN.
Recommendation cancel the Penalty Charge Notice.
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In the photo, the sign doesn't state the hours of operation of the restriction - just says "Mon-Sat". Do you know why this is? Has someone taped over the bottom portion of the sign?
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It was done the same day. Ticket was issued around lunchtime and by the time he got through to the relevant department (Whose systems were down initially) they managed to transfer it over.
Is it worth taking them to the tribunal?
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This is one where a reasonable council might use discretion but this is Newham and they just want to extract more money from a resident.
When exactly was the permit in force for the new VRM?
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Good afternoon
I have received a reply today from Newham council stating that they reject my appeal.
Please see details attached.
What now?
Thanks
Hashim
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Is this you?
Not sure why he didn't find out first what was needed to change the VRM.
The bay is permit holders only at all times but the contravention is code 12 - it should be code 16. But this isn't a winner usually.
But you can obviously ask them to cancel as the car had a permit and we might be able to come up with something on the word 'valid' if they are awkward.
(https://i.ibb.co/pBxy6sr1/n3.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/21LvRwqH/n2.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/TM2D1Y1d/n1.jpg)
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A friend received this earlier today outside his house.
He bought a private number plate and went to the shop with his car to have it changed over.
He then came back parked outside his house with his new number plate and was in the process of going to phone Newham council to have it changed over to the new plate. They informed him that he needs to send them a copy of the new V5 document and then they will change it over. But when he came out of his house he found the PCN already issued because the new plate has not been registered yet.
What's the play here please..
Thanks
Hashim
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