Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: Sabab4321 on June 23, 2025, 04:04:59 pm

Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on August 07, 2025, 02:57:52 pm
Thank you so much

I will note the date on my diary and keep you informed

Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: b789 on August 07, 2025, 02:33:12 pm
The reply from Northern Trains’ Debt Recovery & Prosecutions Unit (DRPU) is a common attempt to pressure a response from the driver, despite the fact that:

• There is no legal obligation for the registered keeper to identify the driver under Railway Byelaw 14; and
• Liability under the byelaw attaches only to the driver or the owner, not the registered keeper, and ownership must be proven beyond reasonable doubt in a criminal court if they pursue prosecution.

Northern’s response is designed to bait you, the keeper, into identifying the driver or giving “permission” for the keeper to act on their behalf — both of which would compromise your strategic position by effectively admitting driver identity. Do not do either.

Send this (preferably on day 6 or 7) to maintain the timing strategy. Also CC it to yourself:

Quote
Subject: Re: Penalty Parking Notice [Insert Number]

Dear Suzanne,

Thank you for your response.

I am the registered keeper of the vehicle and am responding solely in that capacity. I do not intend to identify the driver, nor am I under any legal obligation to do so.

My earlier correspondence stands and was made without prejudice as to the identity of the driver or owner. As no further liability is accepted, and in the absence of any clarification regarding the signage or basis for enforcement, I consider the matter closed unless and until formal proceedings are issued.

Yours faithfully,

[Your Full Name]

Key Points to Understand

Do not give permission for the DRPU to speak to anyone else "on your behalf". You’re not appealing — you’re responding to a penalty invitation and asserting your rights as the registered keeper, nothing more.

Do not answer their phone number. It's designed to extract admissions or gather evidence. Keep all correspondence strictly in writing.

Byelaw prosecution must be commenced within 6 calendar months of the alleged offence (in this case, by 23 December 2025). Until then, you continue the strategy of delaying without admitting.

They may send further letters or demands. You only need to respond once more, and only if they issue a formal Notice of Intended Prosecution or initiate a Magistrates' Court summons — both of which are rare.

Let me know if they escalate or send another communication.
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on August 07, 2025, 10:47:16 am
Good morning all

I sent the email yesterday and I received the response below today. Any advice on what to do next

Thanks

Good morning,

Thank you for the correspondence below.

Notices can only be discussed with the driver unless they provide permission to discuss the matter on their behalf with a designated person.

Should the driver wish for you to appeal on their behalf they will need to email this permission or contact the office on 01904 568 181.

Please note, should no permission be received within the next 7 days the matter will proceed accordingly.

Yours Sincerely,

Suzanne

For the Unit Manager
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on August 03, 2025, 09:26:26 pm
Noted thank you
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: b789 on August 03, 2025, 08:52:46 pm
It says 14 days of RECEIPT. Allow 2 working days for service. You can send it a day or two earlier if you wish. Won't make a huge difference.
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on August 03, 2025, 08:37:53 pm
The letter sent said 14 days and not working days

Will 8th August not fall after the 14days period

Just asking for clarification

Thank you
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on August 03, 2025, 08:32:32 pm
Thank you so much

I will note the date on my diary and do the needful
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: b789 on August 03, 2025, 07:00:54 pm
On Friday 8th August (make a not in your diary) you should send the following email to DRPU@northernrailway.co.uk and also CC in yourself:

Quote
Debt Recovery & Prosecutions Unit
Northern Trains Limited
FREEPOST NEA 3188
Bradford
BD1 1BR

By email to: DRPU@northernrailway.co.uk

Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: Notice to Owner – Penalty Parking Notice No. [Insert Number]

Date of Issue: 23 June 2025 – Barnsley Station

I write in relation to your recent correspondence regarding the above parking notice. I am the registered keeper of the vehicle referred to, and I am responding without prejudice as to the identity of the driver or owner.

The vehicle was parked at Barnsley Station on the date in question during a journey using Northern rail services. Prior to travel, information publicly available online indicated that station parking was free for rail users. Upon arrival at the station, no payment machine was visible, which appeared to confirm that understanding. The absence of clear signage or prominent instructions did not alert the driver to any requirement to register the vehicle at the station reception.

It was only upon return that the driver became aware of the parking notice. A subsequent enquiry with station staff revealed, for the first time, that vehicle registration was required at the reception desk to avoid a penalty — a requirement that was not clearly conveyed by any signage encountered.

This appears to have been a genuine misunderstanding caused by inadequate or non-prominent signage, compounded by a lack of prior experience using this particular station. In the circumstances, I would respectfully request that Northern Trains exercise discretion and cancel the notice. The railway byelaws are intended to regulate intentional misuse of station facilities, not to penalise first-time users acting in good faith based on incomplete or unclear information.

Should you decline to cancel the notice, please be advised that I do not accept liability and do not intend to make payment. Any attempt to pursue this matter further would require Northern Trains to prove, beyond reasonable doubt, that the legal owner of the vehicle committed the alleged offence. As you will be aware, the DVLA registration document (V5C) is not proof of ownership.

I trust you will give due consideration to this request for discretion. Please confirm in writing whether the penalty has been cancelled.

Yours faithfully,

[Your Full Name]


There is no proper appeal process for this type of notice. It's not like a parking ticket from a private company or a council where there's a set appeals system you can follow. This is a Penalty Notice under railway byelaws, and the only real way they can enforce it is by taking the case to the Magistrates' Court.

So, writing to Northern isn't a legal appeal — it's just asking them to use their discretion to cancel the notice. You're not arguing over a charge that can be appealed like a fine. You're politely asking them to drop it based on the circumstances: that the driver was a first-time visitor, used the train, didn’t see any clear signs, and made an honest mistake.

This kind of letter sometimes works because companies like Northern do have the power to cancel these notices if they think it’s fair to do so. But again, it’s not a formal appeal — you’re simply asking for them to show some flexibility. The letter has to be worded carefully so it doesn’t admit anything or make things worse.

The letter is being sent near the final deadline to give Northern as little time as possible to take the matter to court. They are issued under railway byelaws and can only be enforced by taking someone to the Magistrates' Court within six months of the alleged offence. That deadline is 23 December 2025 in this case.

The keeper is not legally required to identify the driver or pay the notice. The law says that only the owner of the vehicle can be liable, and the registered keeper is not automatically the owner. Northern would have to prove who the owner is and that they were responsible for the parking incident, and they must prove it beyond reasonable doubt, which is a very high standard.

The letter being sent does not admit who was driving and does not admit who owns the vehicle. It simply explains that this was a misunderstanding caused by poor signage and asks Northern to cancel the notice out of fairness. The wording is careful so it cannot be used to suggest that the keeper was the driver.

The idea is to appear reasonable without giving away any useful information. By waiting until the last possible day to respond, it also shortens the time Northern have to take any legal action. If they do nothing before the six-month deadline, the case is over and cannot be pursued.
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on August 03, 2025, 05:02:27 pm
Good evening

I received the attached letter from the debt recovery and prosecution unit.

Please any advice on how to proceed.

Thank you

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on June 24, 2025, 03:07:58 pm
Thank you so much

Well understood


Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: DWMB2 on June 24, 2025, 02:54:30 pm
As above, if your goal is to engineer a time out, everything should be done as late as possible.
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: b789 on June 24, 2025, 02:51:12 pm
Quote from: Sabab4321 on June 24, 2025, 01:55:01 pm
Going through all to have a good appeal

I think you under the misapprehension that this is like a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) where you can appeal it. This isn’t a private parking “fine” — it’s a Penalty Notice issued under Railway Byelaw 14. That means there’s no formal appeal process.

The notice is effectively an invitation to pay a fixed penalty to avoid possible prosecution in the Magistrates' Court under Byelaw 24(1). You're not legally obliged to respond — and crucially, you're not required to identify the driver.

The notice refers to the registered keeper, but the Byelaw only permits liability for the owner of the vehicle — a distinction that matters legally. The DVLA logbook (V5C) itself states it’s not proof of ownership, so unless Northern can prove that the keeper is also the owner, enforcement becomes shaky. It's not for you to disprove that you are the owner.

There’s no harm in writing to Northern to explain the situation, but it’s not a legal appeal — it’s a request for discretion. If you do go down that route, it’s best to wait until Northern send a Notice to Owner (NtO) or formal demand. That’s when you’ll receive a new written deadline.

It’s best to wait until that letter arrives, and then, if you want to contest the matter or explain the circumstances, you should only do so shortly before the new deadline they set. This delays the process and limits their window to initiate court proceedings, which must be done within six months of the alleged offence. For now, do not identify the driver, do not respond to the windscreen notice, and don’t engage early — timing is everything with these.

If they issue a formal demand later, you’ll still be well placed to challenge it — but for now, no need to panic or rush to engage. Stay calm, don’t identify the driver, and play for time.
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on June 24, 2025, 01:55:01 pm
Thank you all for your time and assistance.

Going through all to have a good appeal

I will send a sample to this thread before submitting the appeal

Thank you once again
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: roythebus on June 24, 2025, 11:29:15 am
There's a couple of fairly recent live cases on here, search under "APCOA" "station parking" for details. I think one was in Bedford, can'r remember wher the other was.
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: b789 on June 24, 2025, 10:13:49 am
This is easily defended if it ever reach court in front of a magistrate. The burden of proof in a criminal matter (Northern would have to prosecute under Railway Byelaw 24(1)) is "beyond a reasonable doubt", unlike in the civil court where it is merely "on the balance of probability".

Whilst the fact that they would try and prosecute this as a criminal matter under Byelaw 24(1) shows the absurdity of the matter and underlines why under The Road Traffic Act 1991, parking offences were decriminalised, you would be able to argue that only the driver is liable and they have no idea who that is unless you blab it to them. There is no legal obligation for the Keeper to identify the driver.

They will try and argue that it is the "owner" who can be liable under Byelaw 14(4). However, there is no "register of owners". They will try and argue that the Registered Keeper is most likely the owner. However, remember that the burden of proof is on the prosecution and all the defendant has to do is show that the Registered Keeper is definitely not proof of ownership. It states very clearly on the front of the V5C that this document it is NOT proof of ownership.

SO, with the requirement for the prosecution to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt", and there being good persuasive civil cases that show, even under "the balance of probability", that the Keeper cannot be liable just because the vehicle is registered in their name, there is little chance of a case like this succeeding, if it were to ever get that far.

So, you string this out by not making any responses to anything until the last possible day. When you do, you introduce a query that needs responding to which then forces them to respond and so on.

If it ever does get as far as a summons, then you just need to remember that the burden of proof behind a reasonable doubt, rests on the prosecutor, not you and how do you think they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that you are the "owner" of the vehicle?
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on June 23, 2025, 06:49:23 pm
Thank you for the latest update

I will go through the link to get more insights because I don't even know how to appeal to drag it for long
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: DWMB2 on June 23, 2025, 06:01:12 pm
Quote
But don't panic, that rarely happens.
Northern can be quite court happy, including prosecutions.

We had a semi recent case on here, but no conclusion reported yet: Single Justice Procedure for Railway Parking Fine (https://www.ftla.uk/speeding-and-other-criminal-offences/single-justice-procedure-for-railway-parking-fine/)
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on June 23, 2025, 05:54:30 pm
Thank you

I will search for more on the forum
Title: Re: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: The Slithy Tove on June 23, 2025, 05:35:51 pm
What makes these penalty notices different from your normal private parking charge is that these are issued under Railway Byelaws and can actually end in prosecution! But don't panic, that rarely happens. There's just a slightly different way of dealing with them.

For a start, a prosecution would mean that Northern Rail wouldn't see a penny of the fine, whereas if they get you to pay this penalty, they get the money. So they'll keep pursuing the penalty. What you have to do is to string it out for 6 months, after which they cannot prosecute and thereafter can simply go whistle. So you appeal every stage, always just before the deadline. You don't admit who the driver was, as is normal with such tickets. You ask lots of clarification questions and invoke any other delaying tactic you can to keep it going for that 6 months.

Look for other Railway Byelaws cases to see what others have done.
Title: Northern Penalty Parking Notice
Post by: Sabab4321 on June 23, 2025, 04:04:59 pm
The driver is seeking advice regarding a parking notice received at the train station.

This was the driver’s first time using the station, and based on the information available online, it was understood that parking is free for train users. Upon arrival, no payment machine was visible, which seemed to confirm that understanding.

However, upon returning to the car, a parking notice (attached) was found. After enquiring with station staff, the driver was informed that vehicle registration must be recorded at the reception to qualify for the free parking — a step he was unaware of due to lack of clear signage or prior experience.

We kindly request your advice on how best to proceed in light of this misunderstanding.

Thank you for your time and assistance.

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