Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: plonka on October 11, 2023, 03:59:49 pm
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We've not previously found a challenge for this location, and this image suggests you could have avoided the bus gate:
(https://i.imgur.com/BwVufjQ.png)
The only option would be to make a submissions that tried to catch the authority out in making a procedural error, but of course there is no guarantee that this would work.
I was a recent victim of this particular trap and it was the first non-parking related fine I have received in my 16 years of driving. I went through the full appeals process and my appeal was dismissed, but it still agitates me to no end because there is genuinely a guessing game involved with this utterly ridiculous Bus trap.
1. The first traffic sign is incredibly misleading, both in terms of distance and the option presented to the driver. (1st attachment).
This is about 100 yards away from the actual bus gate. They erroneously tell you that the bus gate is 30 yards away and you have the only option of using a Local traffic only access road ahead. I guess the actual escape road is a planned surprise. More on that later. Its confusing because there is an actual bus stop 30 yards ahead but you can ignore this.
2. What they don't tell you is that there are in fact 2 left turns. The first one is the Local Access only road. The second one is the escape route, where the sign is positioned a generous 3 yards from the exit (attachment 2). This tiny sign now magically refers to a blocked road instead of a bus gate, but okay. What is consistency right.
3. If you are lucky enough to react to this sign, think again: the escape road is also clearly marked "Private Road" (attachment 3), which immediately makes you wonder if this is the Local Only Road that was being referred to earlier. So either you use a last second "Private road" or you go through the bus gate.
I presented this line of reasoning and it was rejected on the basis that all the signs are oh-so-very-clearly-marked-and-obvious.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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We've not previously found a challenge for this location, and this image suggests you could have avoided the bus gate:
(https://i.imgur.com/BwVufjQ.png)
The only option would be to make a submissions that tried to catch the authority out in making a procedural error, but of course there is no guarantee that this would work.
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First off, to get to the adjudicators, (Traffic Penalty Tribunal), you first have to submit reps to the council.Only when they reject your reps can you take them to the TPT. When rejecting, they will no doubt say everything is OK, and possible re-offer the discount. If they do, you have to weigh up the matter. If they don't, it is a total no-brainer to take them to the TPT, as the penalty doesn't increase and there are no additional costs.
Assuming the advance sign is what I posted, I think you have a reasonably good case, but we can never predict what an adjudicator will decide. Certainly if you take the TPT path it is essential you ask for a telepone hearing with an adjudicator or even a hearing at their office. You must convince an adjudicator that the advance sign is totally inadequate. I think it is, but it's not me you have to convince.
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Thanks. The question is if that would work as a response, or would only an adjudicator see that? And without a vast knowledge, what would anyone suggest?
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All there is, is this piddling little sign a few yards in advance of the bus gate signs. Not good at all. No wonder there making shedloads of money here. Manchester have form for poor signing on Oxford Road, and the adjudicators were scathing about it. However, Manchester are very unlikely to give way, as they like the money so much, so you'd have to risk the full PCN penalty instead of the discount.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/HJGq7mQZ2J1Z9mnu6
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Hi
Just wondering if anyone can kindly advise
This is a Bus gate/Lane contravention in Manchester, Bridge Street West.
I have 2 issues with this PCN, and wondering if you could advise if I have a leg to stand on, and if you think it is worth pursuing.
1. There is a sign earlier up the road, however if you look at the video, there is a bus right in front of me which is clearly blocking my vission (its 20mph limit, so I was close), so it would be impossible to see the sign untill I had passed the actual sign itself
2. Please see this link HERE (https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/bus_lane_bridge_street_west) on "What do they know request", and it seems that on verage 300 people are getting a ticket here per day, does this not question the signage and fairness?
Any thoughts would be greatfully appreciated
Location
Bridge Street West, Manchester
https://maps.app.goo.gl/qjvZfwvkWTw8b6yS9
The redacted PCN
Page 1 (http://admindata.co.uk/C1.jpg)
Page 2 (http://admindata.co.uk/C2.jpg)
Page 3 (http://admindata.co.uk/C3.jpg)
Page 4 (http://admindata.co.uk/C4.jpg)
The Video provided
Video (http://admindata.co.uk/C1.mp4)