Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: AWPH on June 03, 2025, 12:33:21 pm

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: AWPH on June 22, 2025, 03:30:29 pm

Hi again,

Apologies, I thought I'd made the image public, it should work again now:

https://imgur.com/a/fpn-310525-hillingdon-apcoa-back-sxZOnht

I have good news. I appealed online to the council, on the basis that despite having my driving licence, they spelt all 3 of my names incorrectly, and the incident happened outside a very different number house to the one that they reported. The council initially replied with the following:

"Hello,

Your report to Challenge FPN reference number: 6729-5162-4215-7218 has been closed.

The closure reason provided is: Challenge to be reviewed

FPN challenge under review by APCOA

Kind regards,

The Street Scene Enforcement Team"

I then received this from APCOA:

"Thank you for your challenge in relation to the above Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN).
Further to your enquiry concerning the FPN that was issued to you on (31/05/2025) we can confirm under
the circumstances outlined we have on this occasion cancelled this FPN as a goodwill gesture.
The FPN is now cancelled and requires no further action from you. Please note that should you get
another FPN under similar circumstances this may not be cancelled.
Kind regards
Environmental Team"

So despite how spurious my appeal was, it seems, as I hoped, that I got off on a technicality or 2.

Similarly, the behaviour of traffic officers to particularly Private Hire drivers around Heathrow has shifted, from polite request to move on, to much more aggressive discussion after they've got the cameras working. It may be worth drivers taking photos themselves, if, for example, the APCOA officers and colleagues park illegally themselves while trying to 'book' PH drivers. It is also worth pointing out technical errors, which is the point of my initial request to FTLA, as it may get you off. Avoiding parking in the PSPO areas completely is, of course, the best tactic, and driving away before any discussion or photos taken may also avoid further action from the officers, but I wouldn't guarantee it.

Thanks again for your help.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: cp8759 on June 12, 2025, 11:27:36 pm

Quote from: AWPH on June 12, 2025, 11:18:54 am

Thanks for further information, H C Andersen and cp8759, it’s very helpful and very much appreciated. As requested, please see the back of the FPN ticket in the link below.

https://imgur.com/gallery/fpn-310525-hillingdon-apcoa-back-sxZOnht

Your link doesn't work.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: AWPH on June 12, 2025, 11:18:54 am

Thanks for further information, H C Andersen and cp8759, it’s very helpful and very much appreciated. As requested, please see the back of the FPN ticket in the link below.

https://imgur.com/gallery/fpn-310525-hillingdon-apcoa-back-sxZOnht

I’m going to appeal via the following link, as it can’t seem to harm my case, even if turned down, in which case I simply pay the fine.

https://www.hillingdon.gov.uk/article/13815/Challenge-a-Fixed-Penalty-Notice-FPN

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: H C Andersen on June 11, 2025, 04:12:35 pm

..because to do so would be outside the scope of the Act, s59 refers:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2014/12/part/4/chapter/2

How the council justify such a blanket PSPO as regards coverage i.e. whole wards, seems odd when, as mentioned, other measures would, on the face of it seem sufficient e.g. PCNs etc.

But we don't know what life was like for residents. 20+ hours of PHVs, taxis and whatever lurking in this estate waiting for their passengers just to save airport charges perhaps?

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: cp8759 on June 11, 2025, 12:24:47 pm

Quote from: H C Andersen on June 11, 2025, 11:03:18 am

FWIW, my take is that the intention of this provision is to prevent a double whammy but doesn't preclude a FPN when criminal and decriminalised activities are taking place together.

I'm not sure that's the case, there are anti-double whammy provisions for moving traffic & bus lanes that say that any PCN must be cancelled if the police are taking action / and FPN has been issued. For parking, it just seems to be a blanket ban on criminal proceedings.

Otherwise what's to stop a council making a PSPO that mirrors all its traffic orders and then enforcing them all under the criminal law?

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: H C Andersen on June 11, 2025, 11:03:18 am

I wondered the same, hence drawing attention to parking in the bay.

FWIW, my take is that the intention of this provision is to prevent a double whammy but doesn't preclude a FPN when criminal and decriminalised activities are taking place together.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: cp8759 on June 11, 2025, 10:42:23 am

Is it just me, or does the use of a PSPO appear to be an attempt to circumvent the restriction in regulation 8(1) of The Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Approved Devices, Charging Guidelines and General Provisions) (England) Regulations 2022 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2022/71/regulation/8)?

8.—(1) No criminal proceedings may be instituted, and no fixed penalty notice may be issued, in respect of conduct constituting a parking contravention, except a pedestrian crossing contravention.

@Southpaw82 what are your views, if the conduct complained of constitutes both a civil parking contravention and an offence of contravening the PSPO, can the council bring criminal proceedings?

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: H C Andersen on June 11, 2025, 09:17:58 am

As I understand it:

You were the person in charge of the vehicle.

You know the area.

You knowingly parked in a Permit Holder's Only bay when not permitted which carries a penalty of £140.

You were issued with a FPN for £100.

You gave your name and address, therefore they could pursue you because a summons could be served.

GSV is a little out of date, but what it does show is a road with more double yellow lines and double kerb blips than I've ever seen, some in places where they shouldn't be, which implies hell for residents caused by hordes of taxis etc. waiting for passengers while avoiding airport fees and charges. Heathrow's own forming-up area.

What defence do you think you have against the offence which would be worthwhile pursuing if it placed you in jeopardy of paying the full penalty?

It's impossible to advise because we've not seen the back of the FPN and whether you can even submit an appeal at this stage.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: Enceladus on June 11, 2025, 04:19:38 am

Looks like the PSPO is here (https://www.hillingdon.gov.uk/article/4803/Restriction-of-activities-in-public-places). Down the page a bit, "PSPO 2025
Taxis, private hire vehicles and chauffer driven vehicles waiting in streets near Heathrow Airport."

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: cp8759 on June 11, 2025, 01:37:38 am

@AWPH I suggest you look up the PSPO (you'll probably find it on the council website), and post a link on here.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: Incandescent on June 10, 2025, 10:29:38 pm

This FPN is within the criminal law, and alleges you failed to comply with a Public Space Protection Order, whatever that is !! Clearly you don't know, and I don't think many people on this forum for council parking and traffic PCNs do either. Parking is not mentioned on the FPN, so I would suggest you try to find out how you have contravened their PSPO.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: AWPH on June 10, 2025, 10:18:17 pm

Hello cp8759, and thanks for your previous comment. Have you had a chance to review my reply please? I need to pay the fine or appeal by  Friday 13th June and just need to know if you believe I’ve a case based on wrong address and/or misspelt names? Thanks in advance…

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: AWPH on June 03, 2025, 11:24:53 pm

My apologies, more detail would have helped.

I was waiting for a fare mid-afternoon flying into Heathrow on Saturday 31st May in Bolton's Lane. The parking bays intended for local residents were quite empty and I did notice that there weren't many , if any, PH drivers around, but put that down to day and time, that time being a relatively quiet time for travelling. I was parked in a residents bay and had effectively ignored the signs, but from previous experience, APCOA/Hillingdon Council officers politely ask you to move on, which of course you do.

The sign by where I parked says "Permit Holders Only, 9am - 5pm, H1" and at the other end, there is a new sign regarding the prohibition of Taxi and Private Hire drivers parking in the vicinity, which I had missed. Ergo I am "guilty as charged". This was the first time in my experience that officers took photos  before asking me to drive on; I never leave my car unattended in that situation, so, mistakenly perhaps, expected being in attendance gave an element of security from ticketing. My car displayed a certificate for my licensing authority in the windscreen, so I could hardly deny being a PH driver. I didn't realise at the time that I did not have to show ID to the officer, and should have taken a photo of the officers' car parked illegally on a double yellow line very close to a corner of the road.

My query is on the 2 examples of the officer capturing the offence happening outside the wrong address, and the officer, despite having my driving licence in front of him, capturing my home address correctly, but misspelling each of my first, middle and last names on the ticket. If, on your advice, there's any potential defence there, I'll appeal on that basis, however if you believe it would be futile, I'll pay the fine before it increases from the minimum amount.

Again, much appreciation for your help and advice.

Title: Re: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: cp8759 on June 03, 2025, 10:53:06 pm

Well the FPN doesn't really say anything so you'll have to fill in the blanks for us: why would the officer have given you the FPN in the first place? What were you doing that the PSPO prohibited you from doing?

Title: FPN APCOA for Hillingdon Council PH parked in PSPO space
Post by: AWPH on June 03, 2025, 12:33:21 pm

Good morning,

I received a FPN on 31st May for parking within a PSPO, and usually you are asked to move on, however on this occasion, the first action was the officer taking a photo of me and my PH car. On request, I showed my driving licence and complied with the officer throughout. I understand subsequently that I didn't have to present my licence and should probably have driven away at the first sighting of the officer.

I have not paid the fine yet; I'm still within the 14 days for lesser amount of £50, however the ticket has my first, middle and surname all spelt incorrectly, albeit close to correct in each case, and it states I was parked outside 96 Bolton's Lane, Hillingdon, when I was actually parked outside 28 Bolton's Lane.

While these may be minor 'errors' on the ticket, are these points worth appealing to Hillingdon Council?

Many thanks for your help and consideration and please let me know if you cannot see the image.

https://imgur.com/a/vNVrk2u