Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: Movieman9000 on October 02, 2023, 01:24:32 pm
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Thanks for this , I didn't know it otherwise I would've carried on to challenge it . I've paid it now as I just don't have the head space to battle it right now .
A shame it doesn't seem like a big task to be honest but I've got a lot going on . Sorry chaps
Would've been nice to get the results as well or at least get an answer to share the knowledge.
Thanks for all your help guys
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These feels like a double or quits 😂 I take it if I wait for the NTO or go to tribunal I would have to pay 130 if I fail .
It depends. If you challenge the NTO within 14 days of the date of issue, every council in London will reoffer the discount if the representations are rejected. So it's only really at the formal notice of rejection stage that you have to decide whether to risk the full amount.
At the tribunal stage of course it's the full amount at stake.
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thanks guys, i don't know if i have the will power to fight this, I agree its pretty shitty but to take this thing to independent adjudicator (FYI what I've said is 100% the truth not some elaborate story)
you are spot on it doesn't take into account the request, that it be mitigated on circumstances. NOT whether it was issued correctly that was never the question (of course it was, it was obvious lol)
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These feels like a double or quits
That's exactly what it is ! This feature of parking enforcement was put into the original legislation in 1991 and was designed to encourage people to pay-up rather than take the matter to adjudication. It works too, because less than 5% of PCNs issued end up with the adjudicators.
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These feels like a double or quits 😂 I take it if I wait for the NTO or go to tribunal I would have to pay 130 if I fail .
Yeah it's a bit of a rough pill to swallow . Is there another appeals process , or I have to wait until I get the NTO and then appeal again
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I would carry on.
IMO, their reasoning is a procedural impropriety i.e. you acknowledged being parked on the footway contrary to law but asked them to exercise their power of discretion.
A refusal cannot be justified solely on the grounds of 'you did it and the PCN was served correctly' because this misunderstands the authority's role which is to consider whether they should cancel the PCN based upon your representations and not simply to determine the binary question of 'was the PCN issued correctly' which is what they've done IMO.
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Personally I would wait for the notice to owner and have another go, formal representations are normally dealt with by slightly more senior staff who have more discretion.
This is also a scenario where a tribunal adjudicator might direct the authority to reconsider the mitigation, which works two thirds of the time.
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I do not know how someone can get out of bed and write something like that. Please accept my condolences but also **** you pay me the money.
Terrible people with absolutely no moral compass.
yeah I know what you mean, this was an appeal on compassionate grounds on another note Westminster Council were very quick to dismiss the ticket I got with them,
and of course I'm pretty sure the staff will be on commission or maybe lose a bonus if they don't meet / exceed certain targets.
Otherwise morally you wouldn't do it, I don't have the heart for it. I don't blame the person who wrote this they just doing their job. They have to go home at night and know what they've done!
and its a good point you raised, morally being a traffic warden can't be a rewarding job, a satisfying job, no one likes you, even other traffic wardens don't like you lol.
but there you go, thanks for the help i received from this forum and posters in the topic much appreciated :)
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I do not know how someone can get out of bed and write something like that. Please accept my condolences but also **** you pay me the money.
Terrible people with absolutely no moral compass.
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thanks for your help guys, unfortunately I Was unsuccessful , I wonder if it would have made any difference if i had parked on the single yellow and blocked the road or a double yellow (not blocked the road) here is the council response.
Challenge
In your challenge you state that your father passed away in September 2023, you are his
only child and tasked with clearing his house. You said you hired a van (zipcar.com) Friday
29th Sept at 10.30pm, but when you arrived at the pick up point there were not any parking
spaces. You also said that there was a single yellow line where it would have been free to
park at that time but if I did park in the road, it would have blocked the whole road off so you
parked on the curb of the single yellow line. You included a copy of your father's death
certificate, proof of your zipcar booking and your driving licence details, to support ylour
claims.
Response
I have considered your points and I do not dispute your mitigating circumstances therefore, I
would like you to please accept my condolences for your loss.
However, I must inform you that there is a London-wide ban at all times on vehicles parking
on any part of the footway over which pedestrians have access. According to parking
legislation in order to qualify for the exemption to park on a footway for unloading / loading,
the vehicle must not be left unattended.
Please refer to parts 3.d, 3.d(i) and 3.d(ii) of the “Greater London Council (General Powers)
Act” 1974 which clearly states that:
(3)A person shall not be convicted of an offence under this section with respect to a vehicle if
he proves to the satisfaction of the court that the vehicle was parked
(d)for the purpose of loading or unloading goods, and—
(i)the loading or unloading of the vehicle could not have been satisfactorily performed if it had
not been so parked; and
(ii)the vehicle was not left unattended at any time while it was so parked.
As your vehicle was left unattended at the time the PCN was issued, I must reject your
challenge.
I must therefore still request payment of £65.00 before the end of the period of 14 days
beginning with the date of service of this letter. If payment is not received within this time the
full amount of £130.00 will be due.
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Thanks for letting me know me much appreciated
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They have six months to serve a notice to owner, if they don't then it's too late.
Usually it should take 2 - 3 months at most to get a reply to informal representations.
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Oohhh geez I guess mine is informal if ok compassion grounds , so they could wait like a year and just say no
I guess they wait it out as long as possible to try and allow you time to absorb the situation.
So is there any deadline at all
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Thanks DD as I understand it there is a 56 day rule , so hoping they take their time , I'll update the thread once I receive a response thank you
The 56 day rule applies only to formal challenges against an NTO
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Thanks DD as I understand it there is a 56 day rule , so hoping they take their time , I'll update the thread once I receive a response thank you
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Hi guys just to update this thread I haven't had any reply from tower Hamlets appeal submitted 06/10/2023 and receipt confirmed
Generally 4-6 weeks for a reply with London boroughs.
There is no deadline except they have to serve an Notice to Owner within 6 months
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Hi guys just to update this thread I haven't had any reply from tower Hamlets appeal submitted 06/10/2023 and receipt confirmed
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Replace
I can provide the contact details of the housing officer at the local council to confirm the keys have been returned and house cleared.
with
The housing officer can be contacted at (insert contact details) to confirm that the keys have been returned and house cleared.
Then you're good to go.
thank you very much , appeal submitted with the above amendment, lets hope for the best
For what its worth I did get a parking ticket right outside my dads house as we were clearing it about 2 weeks ago and they the council upon compassionate appeal did waive the parking ticket, although it was just outside his house.
I'll let you know how it goes with tower hamlets thank you
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Replace
I can provide the contact details of the housing officer at the local council to confirm the keys have been returned and house cleared.
with
The housing officer can be contacted at (insert contact details) to confirm that the keys have been returned and house cleared.
Then you're good to go.
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Dear Tower Hamlets,
I would like to appeal the parking ticket on compassionate grounds.
My father passed away 4th September and I am his only son and tasked with clearing his council house.
I hired a Zip van Friday 29th Sept at 10.30pm, I unfortunately when I arrived at the pick up point there weren't any parking spaces.
There was a single yellow line and I was aware that it would be free at that time but if I did park in the road it would've blocked the whole road off so I parked on the curb of the single yellow line.
I hired the Van as there is quite a lot of items to clear from his house and during the day the vans are booked up quite far in advance plus the traffic is quite heavy.
I've attached my receipt from zipcar and also my dads death certificate (not attached in this topic) I can provide the contact details of the housing officer at the local council to confirm the keys have been returned and house cleared.
thank you
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Ordinarily I'd say you have no hope, however many authorities have policies that are lenient towards people who have recently been bereaved. I would suggest you simply draft up a representation explaining exactly what you've told us, attach a copy of the representation and hope for the best.
It's advisable to put a draft on here first.
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Hi guys,
Tower Hamlets - code 62
Parked with one or more wheels on the or over the footpath or any part of the road other than carriage way
Notice number TT56248306
Reg EJ59AOE
date of notice 30/09/23
Ticket front
(https://i.ibb.co/FBcvGBB/parking-ticket.jpg) (http://"https://ibb.co/Zhvsyhh")
Ticket reverse
(https://i.ibb.co/V9XpG0M/Parking-ticket-back.jpg) (http://"https://ibb.co/Syq7gDV")
Car parked images
(https://i.ibb.co/9ZMK2KD/car-park-1.png) (http://"https://ibb.co/nPWdfdG")
(https://i.ibb.co/gTYbh18/car-park-2.png) (http://"https://ibb.co/KqncSZg")
(https://i.ibb.co/zQ4bnRs/car-park-3.png) (http://"https://ibb.co/gmRwjTy")
Street view
https://maps.app.goo.gl/FjHKThBwo7hJpZUe9 (note there are no building works any more
google maps link
https://maps.app.goo.gl/HP18T4MPqo3J61NB9
Situation
I'm not sure if I have any leg to stand on here :(
the only mitigating circumstance I have is I went to this location to pick up a hire van to clear my dads council house (died 3 weeks ago) I tend to go late at night as roads are quieter and vans are available (they're fully booked during the day) , note I have death cert and can get vehicle logs from hire company to prove where I've been.
Had to park like this as no other spots available and the hire car is on the clock but other than that I accept that I didn't park correctly and to pay the ticket
any help greatly appreciated, thank you