Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: artheone on May 03, 2025, 03:55:16 pm
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Perhaps it is worth trying to lodge a late appeal with the Adjudicator, if you can make some sort of case that you were mislead as to the process.
IMO, certainly you should contact the Tribunal and see if your PCN was registered for an appeal. During this conversation you could refer to We Pay Your PCN Ltd because why would you be the ONLY person affected by their incompetence/dissolution?
But do not lose sight of 16 May.
Do not discuss the whys and wherefores of your case with Tribunal staff, just enquire and gather info.
AND give us the dates of their correspondence to you because the timeline is hidden at present.
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Concerning the PCN and towaway. I assume you had to pay £240 release the car from the impound yard? Or was it £265?
Anyway at the time the yard should have given you a payment receipt, the PCN and a "Representations" form with instructions on how to challenge the PCN & removal and the deadline to do so. Sounds like you didn't do anything.
In case this happens again please be aware that it was a mistake not to challenge the PCN. Where a towaway is involved then always challenge and then appeal to the Adjudicator. You have no further financial risk in doing so and if you win then the £240 or £265 would be refunded.
As things stand there is no further remedy available to you. More than six months have elapsed since the contravention so I very much doubt that the Council will agree to any request to re-open the case, on the grounds that the process was not clear to you.
See does anyone else care to comment. Maybe it is worth asking the Council to consider a late representation?
For PCN PN21057693 it looks like you have an on-site PCN followed up with a posted Notice to Owner. It seems that somebody challenged the NTO by submitting a formal representation. Strictly speaking this should have been the Registered Keeper or a representative with written permission.
Anyway the Council did consider the representation/challenge and responded with a Notice of Rejection. The NoR provided details on how to appeal the matter to the Independent Adjudicator at the London Tribunals but it seems that you didn't do so.
Your right to appeal to the Adjudicator expired on Sunday the 23rd Feb. Since the PCN was still not paid a Charge Certificate was served followed by an Order for Recovery (of unpaid penalty charge). An OfR is a form of court order and cannot be ignored or the matter will escalate to bailiff enforcement and a £75 fee added, plus a further £235 if their initial notice is not paid.
Any attempt to appeal to the Adjudicator would now be over two months late, which is a pity because the evidence photos support your version of events. The evidence photos show different tyre valve positions, suggesting that the car was moved in between the initial observation and the PCN. And also this was a lower level contravention, towing your car in addition to the PCN was disproportionate.
The deadline to pay the OfR at £130 is the 16th May. Perhaps it is worth trying to lodge a late appeal with the Adjudicator, if you can make some sort of case that you were mislead as to the process.
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I don't see that the Traffic Enforcement Centre could have authorised a Warrant of Control as yet. The Order for Recovery has not yet expired. The deadline is Friday the
16th May 2025.
What's the status of the PCN for the car removal? And what's the PCN number. Did you submit a representation to Newham challenging this PCN?
The warrant would not have been issued yet, as you said the date has not yet passed.
I don't have the details of the PCN from the car pound.
I don't know the process of whether a representation was submitted to Newham challenging this pcn. Tbh, I don't know the process overall, Ive only gone on what wpyp have sent to me. I haven't received a letter from Newham about 'representation' and the letters I have received, Ive attached in the original post.
What would the next steps for me to take?
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If Newham claim that you didn't move the car then would they not have to demonstrate this with two photos of the same wheel in the same position with suitable timestamps?
I checked the PCN photos and there are two, but they show different wheel positions, so can this be used to evidence that the contravention simply didn't occur?
This information is correct. I would appreciate guidance on how to go about to present this point as part of my appeal, what would be the next steps? given that I am already at this advanced stage of the appeal process?
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Which PCN is which? IE what's the PCN number for the first PCN where you returned and re-parked after several hours?
And what's the number of the second PCN which you had to pay at the Council's impound yard to get the car back?
Was an appeal to the Independent Adjudicator at the London Tribunals ever submitted for PN21057693? By you or WPYP?
The first PCN is PN21057693 and is the PCN in question. Having reviewed the paperwork, I don't think an appeal was made to the Independent Adjudicator, this step may have been skipped by WPYP. I placed my trust in WPYP to deal with the process.
The second PCN I paid alongside its release fee, I don't have details of this as I don't keep the PCNs. However, it was cleared.
What would be the next steps? Should you recommend me paying for this PCN?
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I don't see that the Traffic Enforcement Centre could have authorised a Warrant of Control as yet. The Order for Recovery has not yet expired. The deadline is Friday the
16th May 2025.
What's the status of the PCN for the car removal? And what's the PCN number. Did you submit a representation to Newham challenging this PCN?
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You should pay attention to this info about that company, who were disolved just last week!
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/12794357/officers
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I hope this message finds you well. I am writing to provide you with an update regarding your PCN PN21057693 . At this stage, we are currently awaiting the order for recovery to proceed with a formal appeal.
This WPYP frew are very worry as they don'y know what tjey are doing.
There was no reason nat all to wait for the OfR; you should have registered and appeal with the tribunal, as was clearly stated in the rejection.
Where they later say "forms have been submitted to the court".
1/. They don't have any authority to make applications to TEC
2/. There are no possible grounds on which they could have filed a Witness Statment (TE9).
TE7 doesn't even come into it and you should not assume other, unrelated, cases you may have read are the same as yours.
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Which PCN is which? IE what's the PCN number for the first PCN where you returned and re-parked after several hours?
And what's the number of the second PCN which you had to pay at the Council's impound yard to get the car back?
Was an appeal to the Independent Adjudicator at the London Tribunals ever submitted for PN21057693? By you or WPYP?
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If Newham claim that you didn't move the car then would they not have to demonstrate this with two photos of the same wheel in the same position with suitable timestamps?
I checked the PCN photos and there are two, but they show different wheel positions, so can this be used to evidence that the contravention simply didn't occur?
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Hi All,
I am in a bit of a mess and have been advised by a friend to ask for advice on this forum.
on the 01/11/2024 I received a ticket for parking my car in a 30 minute bay for longer than the allowed time. The bay allows 30 minutes parking, no return within an hour. I had first parked there around 1pm, and then I moved the car and parked there again a couple hours later as I could not find parking on my own road. The PCN I received has an observation time of 13:49, and the PCN was issue at 15:36. I had parked there again the second day, at which point my car got another PCN and got towed. I have paid that PCN and the related release fees because I needed my car back. I had an issue with the first PCN that this post is about.
google street view link:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/VLATF5j8Ka6TkBLB8
PCN Front
(https://i.ibb.co/gbMgNCK1/20250503-153414.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vCxzp8n5)
Back of PCN
(https://i.ibb.co/MjvB4kg/20250503-154255.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ps7h8j1)
NTO Front
(https://i.ibb.co/Q3dzGNkY/20250503-153511.jpg) (https://ibb.co/zTJjwRFP)
NTO Back
(https://i.ibb.co/qYFP7tP4/20250503-153534.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0yVdmgdW)
Notice of rejection front
(https://i.ibb.co/hFnrnGYp/20250503-153632.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZzwvwQ2y)
Notice of rejection back
(https://i.ibb.co/Nn1NhPbq/20250503-153639.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sJ51SGz4)
Notice of rejection page 3
(https://i.ibb.co/ZzKVpVQ8/20250503-153711.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5hv6g6Q8)
Charge Certificate Front
(https://i.ibb.co/d4JVdw49/20250503-153758.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hF14PJF5)
Charge certificate back
(https://i.ibb.co/VpHYgzfP/20250503-153806.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rfb2xzD1)
Order for Recovery Front
(https://i.ibb.co/0VVbWvvh/20250503-153837.jpg) (https://ibb.co/prrFs55J)
Initially I was advised by a friend go through a company called WPYP (WePayYourPCN.com). I paid them around 50 quid for their services. What they have done so far:
- I sent them the PCN I received along with my reasonings. This was the initial email I sent them:
I am reaching out regarding a recent PCN and associated fees I incurred on 01/11/2024 and 02/11/2024 in Newham.
At the time I parked, the line markings were unclear and partially obscured by another vehicle, making it difficult to identify any restrictions. Although my vehicle has a valid digital resident’s permit, my car was towed, and I received two parking tickets. I had to pay both a release fee and the PCN to retrieve my vehicle.
Given these circumstances, I believe these charges were issued in error, and I would like to request a reimbursement for the fees I have paid. I would greatly appreciate any assistance you can provide in resolving this matter.
- They sent an informal and formal appeal on my behalf. I am not exactly sure whet they wrote to be honest.
- I received the NTO for Newham. I informed WPYP and they wrote back to say this
Thank you for bringing this to our attention.
I am writing in reference to PCN PN21057693. I understand that you have received a Notice of Rejection and now have the option to appeal to the tribunal.
If the cost has been reduced, you may choose to pay it now. However, if the cost remains at £130, it may be reduced back to £65 or potentially cancelled altogether during the appeal process.
I have reviewed the PCN details and would like to request additional information to assist with the assessment. The rejection letter states that you were seen in a 30-minute space and then again 2 hours later, but you are allowed to return after 1 hour. Would you please confirm if we can use this defence
- I replied back saying that that was fine and to go ahead with the defence[\li]
- Their reply was
I hope this message finds you well. I am writing to provide you with an update regarding your PCN PN21057693 . At this stage, we are currently awaiting the order for recovery to proceed with a formal appeal.
Please rest assured that we are monitoring the situation closely and will take the necessary steps as soon as the order is received. If you have any questions or require further clarification, do not hesitate to contact me.
Thank you for your patience and understanding.
[\li]
- the latest email I received from them:
I hope this message finds you well. I am writing to provide an update on the Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) PN21057693 for the vehicle with registration KE14 XDR.
The contravention occurred on 1 November 2024 at 15:36 on Wall End Road, Newham, London, under the jurisdiction of Newham London Council.
The required documents have been submitted to the court, and we have received confirmation that the submission has been successfully processed. The court has outlined the following next steps:
- Warrant of Control granted:*mThis will proceed in alignment with the standard enforcement process.
We will continue to monitor the situation closely and ensure that you are promptly informed about any developments or actions required on your part.
If you have further questions or need additional support, please do not hesitate to reach out.
[\li]
At this point I got a bit nervous as they said that as the email said that Warrant of Control granted and they were not responding to my emails. I filled out the TE7 and TE9 forms myself on advice of another friend. I am not sure what will be the outcome.
Is this standard procedure or is there something else I need to do? I know I probably should have sorted this out myself but personal circumstances meant that I could not.