Free Traffic Legal Advice

General discussion => The Flame Pit => Topic started by: ojnab on March 31, 2025, 12:45:53 pm

Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: roythebus on April 14, 2025, 06:58:49 pm: It seems the Swiss have a slightly better sense of humour than the German polizei!
Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: ojnab on April 13, 2025, 05:20:00 pm: Quote from: baroudeur on April 13, 2025, 12:32:30 pm
There is a time limit for payment/reply which you seem to have exceeded if you haven't paid or replied yet.

I already submitted the admission of guilt with the statement of mitigating circumstances, but didn't include a copy of my passport photo page because it didn't say anywhere on the forms that I needed to (and what's the point if I am admitting that I was driving).

The German police asked the Swiss police why I didn't include the passport photo page. The Swiss police that came to my house joked with me about German bureaucracy and signage. They said the Germans would probably put up a signpost to warn you that there's a signpost.

Anyway all the forms are completed correctly and the Swiss police said they'd tell the Germans off for wasting their time.
Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: baroudeur on April 13, 2025, 12:32:30 pm: Quote from: ojnab on April 13, 2025, 11:34:00 am
Quote from: ojnab on April 02, 2025, 07:46:13 am
Thanks I'll see if I can find anything that I can understand on TCS's and ADAC's websites (at least TCS will have French)

So I found this by asking on expat FB group
German traffic fine calculator (https://www.how-to-germany.com/traffic-fines-calculator/)

It says that the fine is only going to be about EUR 150-180 and possibly banned from driving within Germany for a month.

There is a time limit for payment/reply which you seem to have exceeded if you haven't paid or replied yet.
Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: ojnab on April 13, 2025, 11:34:00 am: Quote from: ojnab on April 02, 2025, 07:46:13 am
Thanks I'll see if I can find anything that I can understand on TCS's and ADAC's websites (at least TCS will have French)

So I found this by asking on expat FB group
German traffic fine calculator (https://www.how-to-germany.com/traffic-fines-calculator/)

It says that the fine is only going to be about EUR 150-180 and possibly banned from driving within Germany for a month.
Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: ojnab on April 02, 2025, 07:46:13 am: Quote from: baroudeur on April 01, 2025, 04:02:09 pm
The op needs to consult Swiss/German motoring clubs/forums.

Thanks I'll see if I can find anything that I can understand on TCS's and ADAC's websites (at least TCS will have French)
Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: baroudeur on April 01, 2025, 04:02:09 pm: According to ADAC

A strengthened German-Swiss Police Treaty comes into effect on May 1st, 2024, enabling the enforcement of traffic fines issued in Switzerland against drivers residing in Germany, and vice versa, warns the German auto club ADAC.

The new treaty empowers Swiss authorities to collect outstanding fines from German drivers re-entering Switzerland'

Presumably, the Swiss authorities can also collect fines from Swiss drivers who get German penalties?

The op needs to consult Swiss/German motoring clubs/forums.
Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: BertB on April 01, 2025, 10:06:56 am: There is no mention of payment, but at this stage it seems to resemble what we would receive in the UK of a combined NIP/S.172 letting you know the nature of the offence and an invitation to supply/correct your details. The next step will be communicated to you after.

https://i.imgur.com/bWNHEmC.png (http://)

The above image is from Google Translate. I cannot confirm the accuracy in its translation.

Edit, reading that again it is almost a combined NIP/SJPN as it seems you have the chance to make representations via the form.

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Title: Re: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: John Glacier on March 31, 2025, 09:33:02 pm: Does the large NIP say anything about naming the driver or court?
Title: Confusing signage 87 in 60 and 64 in 50 during same minute B14 Stuttgart
Post by: ojnab on March 31, 2025, 12:45:53 pm: I know this is a UK website, but people here are very knowledgeable and have helped me in the past, so I hope you can help. 

 I was driving into Stuttgart seeing multiple signage about 80kmh for cars and 60kmh for trucks, plus signs about low emission zones, in addition to the direction signage that I was looking for. I never saw any lower speed limits signs at the time. Reviewing the dashcam video I see that there was a 60 sign at the start of a tunnel and reminder on a sharp curve, and for the second ticket there was an 80/60 sign followed by a 60 sign, then almost immediately a 50 and immediately afterwards a low emission zone sign. And yes I was going the alleged speed. (attached are both NIPs redacted)

 The second offence is a simple EUR 40 fine so its easy to pay, but for the first one there's no information about payment.

 Does this mean I have to go to court? Is it worth filing a defence on the basis of confusing signage? What is the likely fine? Is it worth combining both tickets into a single case?

I cannot get points on my licence as Switzerland does not have a points system, but the Swiss will enforce EU fines. If the fine is going to be large do I need a lawyer?

 PS: If this belongs in the Flame Pit because it's non-UK then please feel free to move it.

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