Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: Layrex9 on March 10, 2025, 04:58:40 pm

Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 11, 2025, 08:54:17 am
Please provide some context to the above post.

Dear b789,

Sorry - I was replying to HC Andersen, as some questions/thoughts were put forth. Thank you for your recommendation - I will get in touch with Jackson Yamba. I am going away today but shall take my computer with me - the WiFi might be ropey, but I shall phone and/or email him. Thank you for all your help so far. I’ll let you know how I get on.

Best wishes,
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 11, 2025, 08:13:55 am
Please provide some context to the above post.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 10, 2025, 10:30:25 pm
Dear HC Andersen,

Thank you for your message. There is an electronic receipt for several hundreds of pounds from inside the premises, dated and time-stamped. Yes, the disabled person could not access the machine owing to a huge queue and no seating. The terminal is situated in the members only area, so one has to alert reception to tell them they’re there. This is not the case for the able-bodied, just the disabled bays - for these you have to enter the reg into the terminal on arrival, as the able bodied get 3h free parking without having to use the terminal. They only need to input the reg if they’ll be longer than 3h. The people visiting business within the club, are able to use the spaces in the same manner as the club members. It was appealed twice and rejected twice, and a letter of complaint was sent to Parkingeye. The club was contacted and asked to cancel the ticket, which was agreed, then management called the following day and said Parkingeye couldn’t let than and it had been taken out of their hands. This is not the “complete control and flexibility” of their car park, that their collaborated marketing material with Parkingeye boasts of. Having mentioned that to them in the last communication, 3-1-5 have not responded. A letter of complaint was sent additionally mentioning that this was discriminatory - it is a free car park after all, and Parkingeye didn’t take kindly to that point being made. They reiterated that money was owed or POPLA, so POPLA was appealed to, and this is the current situation. Today, POPLA asked for the disabled badges, which have been sent. The club themselves have copies of the disabled badges.

Best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: H C Andersen on April 10, 2025, 04:00:05 pm
Is a view.

OP, I don't know where you're going with this..other than the more you write the more you are likely to identify the driver.

Also, as you received a 'reminder' well within the 28-day period attached to the NTK then you had all the time you needed to 'appeal'.

I suggest you get back to the essence of your 'appeal'. Remember, unless you can cause the assessor to conclude that a parking charge is not due from the driver then the only issue is whether they could hold you liable as keeper. You've seen the NTK, albeit late, and I suspect that a judge would be convinced that it was posted in time. The issues then revolve around its compliance with PoFA.

If you've got sufficient time and energy to attack on two fronts, fine, but if not then I suggest you focus on the NTK and the breach.

Cage rattling and name calling might make you feel better, but when it comes to the crunch .....!

Anyway, what do you know:
1. Use of the accessible parking bays is permitted by Blue Badge holders ONLY whilst using 3-1-5 Health Club.

But there's no evidence that the driver, whoever they were, was using the Health Club.

2. Parking Eye are acting as agents of the landowner and the contract is formed between the driver and the landowner. (this is stated in the sign)

What you don't know:
The exact relationship between the 'medical person' and 3-1-5 e.g. their customers were entitled to use the car park etc? In which case does being unable - did anyone try- to access the reception area and validation terminal equate to frustration of contract? Did anyone ask at the time?

I'm trying to tease out the essence of the issues but there's so much 'noise' that it's difficult.

So, who is pursuing the parking charge and with what authority?
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 10, 2025, 03:53:07 pm
Why are we arguing this here? You can start a thread in the flame pit of the legal forum if you want to try and argue the point. For now, the only way an item posted can be deemed given within two working days is by first class post. If all the hybrid mail receipts say that a delivery service of 2-3 days is used, then there can be no guarantee that it can be delivered in two working days. Royal Mail states that first class post is 1-2 working days, therefore the only guaranteed postal method that can guarantee two working days must be first class post.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Charitynjw on April 10, 2025, 03:26:00 pm
s7 of the Act

7 References to service by post.

Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression “serve” or the expression “give” or “send” or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

No mention of 2 days there.
Or 1st class post.

The two working day presumption comes not from the Act's wording but from judicial interpretation and Civil Procedure Rules (CPR) practice, where first class post is generally treated as taking two working days for deemed service.

Specifically:

• Under CPR 6.26, documents sent by first class post are deemed served on the second business day after posting.
• This presumes the use of first class post, as it reflects Royal Mail’s published delivery aim.
• If an operator uses a slower hybrid service, then they lose the ability to rely on the two-day deemed delivery rule.

The two working day rule arises from CPR 6.26 and not directly from s7 of the Interpretation Act.

PoFA 2012 Sch 4(9)(6)
See above
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 10, 2025, 03:20:16 pm
s7 of the Act

7 References to service by post.

Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression “serve” or the expression “give” or “send” or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

No mention of 2 days there.
Or 1st class post.

The two working day presumption comes not from the Act's wording but from judicial interpretation and Civil Procedure Rules (CPR) practice, where first class post is generally treated as taking two working days for deemed service.

Specifically:

• Under CPR 6.26, documents sent by first class post are deemed served on the second business day after posting.
• This presumes the use of first class post, as it reflects Royal Mail’s published delivery aim.
• If an operator uses a slower hybrid service, then they lose the ability to rely on the two-day deemed delivery rule.

The two working day rule arises from CPR 6.26 and not directly from s7 of the Interpretation Act.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 10, 2025, 03:14:19 pm
Jackson Yamba is 100% legit. He has a fantastic track record of suing private parking companies. You will see his name on many of the persuasive appeals that we now use against the claimants such as VCS v Edward 2023 (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/zra61px7l3if53o3bp9c4/VCS-v-EDWARD-Transcript.pdf?rlkey=bv4bba389nau5qpfglqkpjq5l&st=mmzmssqo&dl=0), Brennan v PPS 2023 (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/1b9rpna57dutsetdgwi60/Brennan-v-Premier-Parking-Plymouth-CC-Judgment-20230821-V-Final_-14.pdf?rlkey=203u1fav6fve811lz8cm8wpwx&st=b8xvi7g1&dl=0), CEL v Chan 2023 (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/nb9ypbecuurpmln00dily/CELvChan-appeal-transcript.pdf?rlkey=7mpuvpmpe45s2zbhch21om1ez&st=oqhy5zyy&dl=0), CPM v Akande 2024 (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/y631olc61z1slr6xfrdsk/CPM-v-AKANDE.pdf?rlkey=kltpojedcxiwarxr0sdfyjo05&st=9diue1ku&dl=0), VCS v Carr 2024 (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ob8hw1062bdaiw8ine4u8/VCS-v-Carr.pdf?rlkey=m33wuz8wjogdz13mbisu69ziy&st=u1khe1os&dl=0) to name a few. These are appeal wins. He has many non persuasive wins and I suggest you have a read of the blog on the Contestor Legal website to see whether you think this is legit or not.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Charitynjw on April 10, 2025, 03:09:45 pm
All the ppc has to do is show, on balance of probability, that the first pcn was correctly addressed, postage paid & put into the postal system.

They do not have to prove that it was delivered.

In fact, once they've done the above, the burden of proof falls to you to prove that it was NOT delivered. (https://emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji52.png)

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1978/30/section/7 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1978/30/section/7)

Absolutely WRONG!!!!! If challenged, the operator must prove that the notice was actually entered into the postal system. It is not enough to simply assert that it was.

Under the Interpretation Act 1978, a notice sent by first class post is deemed to be delivered (i.e., "given") on the second working day after posting — but only if it was properly addressed, postage paid, and posted by first class.

You only need a free Proof of Posting certificate from any post office for this presumption to apply.

Private parking companies do not generally post items themselves. They outsource to mail consolidators using hybrid mail services. These consolidators print and dispatch the mail, often using bulk business postage that does not qualify as first class.

What the operator typically tries to rely on is the handover receipt from the mail consolidator, claiming this proves the date the notice entered the postal system. It doesn’t. At best, it proves the date the item entered the consolidator’s internal system — not the Royal Mail postal system.

I will confidently wager £100 that any "evidence" they provide from the mail consolidator will not show the use of Royal Mail first class post. Instead, it will show a 2–3 working day delivery service, which is not deemed delivery within two working days.

Only first class post qualifies for the two working day presumption under both the Interpretation Act and the Civil Procedure Rules. If they’re using a slower service, then three working days minimum should be allowed for delivery — and that must be reflected in any procedural deadlines tied to the date of service.

s7 of the Act

7 References to service by post.

Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression “serve” or the expression “give” or “send” or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

No mention of 2 days there.
Or 1st class post.

Perhaps Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Sch 4 (9)(6)

(6) A notice sent by post is to be presumed, unless the contrary is proved, to have been delivered (and so “given” for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4)) on the second working day after the day on which it is posted; and for this purpose “working day” means any day other than a Saturday, Sunday or a public holiday in England and Wales.

But it doesn't mention that it must be 1st class.
Just A notice sent by post.

& for completeness

All the ppc has to do is show.......

Ie demonstrate, not just assert.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: ixxy on April 10, 2025, 01:32:41 pm
Hmm they don't look dodgy do they. I thought you had an issue with unregulated businesses? Shouldn't that apply even more so to a firm operating in a generally regulated sector who proudly proclaim "We are a leading unregulated law firm" on their website?
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 10, 2025, 09:36:45 am
Contact Jackson Yamba at Contestor Legal Services (https://www.contestorlegal.co.uk/home).
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 09, 2025, 10:17:39 pm
Dear b789,

Ah thank you, that is reassuring. If I email again, what should I say? Should I send the same email again or should I modify it?

Thank you very much for asking your friend about it, it is very much appreciated. What an awful situation! I just wish they would cancel it. If it had been my business and this had happened, I would cancel it without question, fully understanding that the machine was inaccessible! The disabled badges have to be displayed as a condition as well - and mine were - but nobody seems bothered about that and only bothered about entring your reg into a machine that you cannot get to unless you are a member!

It is as if it has been done to pick specifically on disabled people and it is so, so wrong! A set-up!

Best wishes,
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 09, 2025, 08:08:40 pm
If you are not successful at POPLA, ParkingEye may well eventually issue a claim against you. However, that is nothing to fear. This is not a criminal matter. It is a civil contractual matter. In the vast majority of cases, it never gets as far as a hearing even. More often than not, the claim is either struck out or discontinued.

A county court claim is actually ideal as it is the ultimate dispute resolution service. It's not Rumpole of the Bailey.

I've asked a barrister friend who is very successful in defending these cases to have a look at yours and provide any further advice regarding whether to try and sue X-Force Ltd for the damages.

If you've had email responses from either ParkingEye or 3-1-5, then just use that. Whenever you send an email to anyone, make sure that you CC in yourself as then you will have a copy of what was sent showing their email address.

Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 09, 2025, 07:39:48 pm
Dear b789,

Thank you, that is all really good advice, I shall look into that. I think perhaps another letter to push the cancellation - especially after I saw the marketing material collaborated between Parkingeye and 3-1-5, in which they said they loved the flexibility of being able to have control over the car parks and cancel the tickets for genuine mistakes. It strikes me as something smelling rotten in the State of Denmark.

Do I need to follow up the emails to 3-1-5 with postal letters? I have only emailed 3-1-5 so far. Parkingeye with my original complaint, I sent a letter - and they emailed me back!

I will certainly get on and look into these other suggestions - thank you - I would have had zero clue!

If the POPLA appeal were to fail - what happens then? Would Parkingeye take me to court? I have never had anything like this - being chased for money! It sounds like you could serve notice on anyone for anything - for no reason - just because you have a notice up! I can’t believe it. It seems legally criminal.

Best wishes,

Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 09, 2025, 05:28:55 pm
Don't worry too much about this. If the POPLA appeal is successful, that is the end of the matter. If it is not, their decision is not binding on you. You certainly don't pay it.

Since 3-1-5 Health Club hasn’t replied to the formal complaint and legal warning letter that was sent to them on 12 March 2025. It looks like they’re hoping you won’t follow through, and they’re choosing to ignore the situation.

At this point, you could take them to court for disability discrimination under the Equality Act. However, I’ve looked into the company behind 3-1-5 (X-Force UK Ltd), and there are warning signs that they may not be financially stable. They’ve had insolvency issues in the past and currently have charges (debts) registered against them.

This means that even if you win your case, there’s a real risk that the company might not be able to pay you—and you could end up losing money, such as the court fees. Because of that, it’s worth thinking carefully before going ahead with legal action.

If you don’t want to risk going to court, there are other ways to keep the pressure on them and possibly get a result:

• Contact the landlord or landowner – If 3-1-5 rents their building, the landowner may be concerned about discrimination taking place on their site. They may step in.
• Public pressure – You can leave reviews online (Trustpilot, Google, etc.) or share your experience on social media. You can also contact local newspapers or disability support groups. This can damage their reputation and often pushes businesses to take complaints seriously.
• Make a data complaint – If ParkingEye still has your personal details or Blue Badge image, and they had no right to keep them, you can complain to them under data protection law (UK GDPR). If they don’t handle that properly, you can escalate to the Information Commissioner’s Office (ICO).
• Use a final letter to push for cancellation – One last short letter could say that due to their financial situation, you’ll pause any court action—but if they don’t cancel the PCN and apologise, you’ll take other steps instead. This sometimes makes them reconsider.
• Contact the Equality Advisory and Support Service (EASS) (https://www.equalityadvisoryservice.com) – They offer free advice about your rights and how to push forward with your complaint without going to court.

You don’t have to decide straight away, but these are all ways to move forward without spending more money or taking legal risks. Let me know what you’d like to do.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 09, 2025, 03:44:12 pm
Dear b789,

3-1-5 have not responded to my email of the 12/03/2025. I cannot access my POPLA appeal, I thought, when it said I would have access to the portal, that my evidence would be on there. Only their evidence is on there. I  said what had happened, that the machine is not accessible, that my disabled badges were displayed. On the night that I uploaded the POPLA appeal, I could not upload my disabled badges and I said I needed additional help with this - and I said that 3-1-5 have a copy of my disabled badges also.

I am sorry, I didn’t realise you required a copy of my POPLA appeal. I have emailed POPLA and asked for a copy. I thought I had saved it to my computer, but it is old, and I cannot find it unfortunately. I am not used to things like this. Yes, I have 7 days, from last Friday, but I was away.

Best wishes,
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 09, 2025, 11:43:09 am
@Layrex9, what is the status of your formal complaint to 3-1-5?

What 'precisely' did you put for your POPLA appeal? You have not shown us yet you expect us to provide advice on how to respond to the operators evidence pack.

Any response must highlight the operators failure to answer or rent any of the points in your POPLA appeal and then you can begin to rebut anything in their evidence pack. You only have 7 days to respond.

I wouldn't worry about an unsuccessful POPLA decision if that were to be the case. Their decision is not binding on you and has no effect on anything going forward.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 09, 2025, 11:28:00 am
All the ppc has to do is show, on balance of probability, that the first pcn was correctly addressed, postage paid & put into the postal system.

They do not have to prove that it was delivered.

In fact, once they've done the above, the burden of proof falls to you to prove that it was NOT delivered. (https://emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji52.png)

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1978/30/section/7 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1978/30/section/7)

Absolutely WRONG!!!!! If challenged, the operator must prove that the notice was actually entered into the postal system. It is not enough to simply assert that it was.

Under the Interpretation Act 1978, a notice sent by first class post is deemed to be delivered (i.e., "given") on the second working day after posting — but only if it was properly addressed, postage paid, and posted by first class.

You only need a free Proof of Posting certificate from any post office for this presumption to apply.

Private parking companies do not generally post items themselves. They outsource to mail consolidators using hybrid mail services. These consolidators print and dispatch the mail, often using bulk business postage that does not qualify as first class.

What the operator typically tries to rely on is the handover receipt from the mail consolidator, claiming this proves the date the notice entered the postal system. It doesn’t. At best, it proves the date the item entered the consolidator’s internal system — not the Royal Mail postal system.

I will confidently wager £100 that any "evidence" they provide from the mail consolidator will not show the use of Royal Mail first class post. Instead, it will show a 2–3 working day delivery service, which is not deemed delivery within two working days.

Only first class post qualifies for the two working day presumption under both the Interpretation Act and the Civil Procedure Rules. If they’re using a slower service, then three working days minimum should be allowed for delivery — and that must be reflected in any procedural deadlines tied to the date of service.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 09, 2025, 08:35:12 am
Hello, How do you prove that it was not delivered? It sounds rather like they have just served notice on me in that case and I have to pay it, from a free car park, where I couldn’t access the machines, and my disabled badges were displayed. I thought, that because of the timing of the reminder, that proved that they hadn’t sent out the original PCN? I can prove that my letter of complaint was sent, registered. I thought the burden of proof was on the one who was making the claim. I’d spent £650.00 that day in the premises. Many thanks
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Charitynjw on April 08, 2025, 11:01:05 pm
All the ppc has to do is show, on balance of probability, that the first pcn was correctly addressed, postage paid & put into the postal system.

They do not have to prove that it was delivered.

In fact, once they've done the above, the burden of proof falls to you to prove that it was NOT delivered. (https://emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji52.png)

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1978/30/section/7 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1978/30/section/7)

Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 08, 2025, 10:35:42 pm
If I had a penny for every 'no first postal pcn' that I've seen, I'd have a lot of pennies.

The consequences are that the keeper loses the right to appeal, & the 'mug's discount' ship has long sailed....£100 is now chased.

Of course, post does go missing, an unfortunate fact of life.

It does seem, however, that private parking companies are more unlucky than most in this regard.

Dear Charitynjw,

Thank you for your response - I wonder if it happened because of the timescale involved - they have said that the ticket was issued on the 24th Dec - Christmas Eve. With post being unusually busy over the Xmas period, even though my reminder was dated 2nd January (which I thought was odd in itself - I thought it was a bit too soon for a reminder to be issued early Jan when the ticket had only been created on 24th Dec and the parking event was on 18th Dec). That’s not long afterwards for a reminder, I wouldn’t have thought? The reminder itself didn’t actually arrive until January 6th!!

There was definitely no original PCN. I have seen other people saying the same thing and I wonder if they are skipping the first  step of the process in order to, like you say, it forces the registered keeper to lose the right to appeal - and I am guessing loads of people just pay without questioning the scam because of the hassle factor!

It has certainly opened my eyes - I don’t think I have ever had one of these before - they’re very persistent!

Thank you for your help, Best Wishes :)
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 08, 2025, 10:21:45 pm
These were the two attachments they attached to the response to the Letter of Complaint. It was the first time I had seen the Parking Charge Notice, because all I had received up until that point was the reminder:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/xhspc96p9nz392g8kqyl8/REDACTED-ATTACHMENT-1.pdf?rlkey=92hemeee3sor2ytnpi3adeiy4&st=i7mb1t30&dl=0

And this one:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/pi473xbwgkhz7vscszoxe/REDACTED-PARKINGEYE-ATTCHMENT-COMPLAINT-2.pdf?rlkey=ytfzsavqjtq7b5wvrp2qsykor&st=1e00ir9s&dl=0

I am sorry I have been struggling with the technology and know-how in order to upload these, that is why I have uploaded different ones (I don’t know what I am doing) but finding out fast!

Best wishes and I hope it all works!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Charitynjw on April 08, 2025, 10:14:16 pm
If I had a penny for every 'no first postal pcn' that I've seen, I'd have a lot of pennies.

The consequences are that the keeper loses the right to appeal, & the 'mug's discount' ship has long sailed....£100 is now chased.

Of course, post does go missing, an unfortunate fact of life.

It does seem, however, that private parking companies are more unlucky than most in this regard.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 08, 2025, 10:09:05 pm
This was their response (by email, not post) to my letter of complaint:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/j3onfxe5f0ls1rhpcypos/REDACTED-PARKINGEYE-RESPONSE-TO-COMPLAINT-LETTER.pdf?rlkey=9vl30l386gyleqv6u4ae48qbm&st=knefifzm&dl=0
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 08, 2025, 10:04:05 pm
This was the original letter of complaint I sent to Parkingeye by post - they have omitted this from the evidence upload to POPLA. It was sent registered delivery:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/bdtapcda5033emjlhemps/REDACTED-Parkingeye-Letter-COMPLAINTS-CHORLEY-2.pdf?rlkey=1wr60u8uplnzil7blynj02yrs&st=52dh5nwg&dl=0
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 08, 2025, 09:10:44 pm
Dear b789,

This is the link to dropbox - it has taken me ages - I do hope it works. I shall also put another link so you can see what they left out! Best wishes,

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/dqmk1llxbxjv8m9tu972y/POPLA-SCAN-COMPLETE.pdf?rlkey=t509yd0j0wm90asq39tg7vfce&st=ovdy3gec&dl=0
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on April 08, 2025, 02:39:57 pm
Please host the redacted operator evidence on DropBox or Google Drive.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on April 08, 2025, 01:20:00 pm
Hello everyone,

I have not heard from 3-1-5 after sending the email on 24/03/2025, however Parkingeye have uploaded information to POPLA.

It shows the following:

"Case History
18/12/2024 Date of event
System check/manual check identified breach of terms and conditions, prior to DVLA request
24/12/2024 DVLA response received - Success
24/12/2024 Parking Charge Letter Issued - Letter1 - Ltr01-260
02/01/2025 Parking Charge Letter Issued - Letter2 - Ltr02-259
07/01/2025 Letter Issued - Website Appeal Response
07/01/2025 Website Appeal received for this case and is queued for processing.
10/01/2025 Letter Issued - GDPR Request - With Appeal
10/01/2025 Letter Issued - Disabled Blue Badge Evidence Request (w/ Att)
01/02/2025 Letter Issued - Website Appeal Response
01/02/2025 Website Appeal received for this case and is queued for processing.
14/02/2025 Letter Issued - Unsuccessful POPLA - Signage (w/ Att)

Rules and Conditions
We have included a signage plan showing that there are signs situated next to the Blue Badge bays within the car park and confirm the terms & conditions for these specific bays. These signs confirm that the bays are to be used by Blue Badge Holders only. Blue Badge holders must enter full, correct vehicle registration using the Blue Badge button at the terminal in reception, and present a copy of their Blue Badge, to obtain a permit for the duration of stay.

The ANPR equipment is installed within the bollards at the front of the bay and these cameras capture
photographs of the vehicle entering and exiting the individual bay. The bays also have clear floor markings to show they are for the use of Blue Badge Holders.

Authority
We can confirm that the above site is on private land, is not council owned and that we have written authority to operate and issue Parking Charge Notices at this site from the landowner (or landowner’s agent).

It must also be noted that any person who makes a contract in his own name without disclosing the existence of a principal, or who, though disclosing the fact that he is acting as an agent on behalf of a principal, renders himself personally liable on the contract, is entitled to enforce it against the other contracting party. (Fairlie v Fenton (1870) LR 5 Exch 169). It follows that a lawful contract between ourselves and the motorist will be enforceable by us as a party to that contract.

Additional Information
Our records confirm that no vehicle registration details were entered on the date of the event. Section 17.4 of the BPA code of Practice references different types of keying errors that could take place and instances of when a reasonable fee to cover processing costs could be offered by the Operator. In this instance, this section of the code is not applicable case as there had been no attempt to input the vehicle registration into the machine/terminal.

The appeal was rejected on the basis that the terms and conditions as outlined on the signage were breached."


It then shows the photos of the car etc, the emails to and fro, etc. It shows the original appeal, which I had no copy of. I have attached this below.

Interestingly, they have not provided POPLA with the letter of complaint I sent to Parkingeye, it has been omitted. This was included and then TWO parking charge notices - the original (which I never received) and the reminder, which I did. And this:

"Whitelist Lookup – XX XXX
Whitelist Name Plate Description Start Date/Time End Date/Time Input Date/Time Duration

No results

The above system extract displays all permits, payments for parking, and terminal entries relating to the vehicle on the date of the parking event.

Please note, if no results are displayed, this confirms that no permit, payment, or terminal entries were recorded."


On the POPLA website, when I was submitting my appeal, I could not upload my disabled badges - my server wouldn’t allow it (technical problems) however, I told POPLA this and asked them if I could have an email address so that I could send a copy of the badges. They didn't get back to me on that matter. 3-1-5 definitely had an email copy of the disabled badges.

I received this from POPLA on Friday and I have 7 days to respond, but I have been away and I was unable to, immediately. I am not sure what to do. I am going to try and copy the original appeal.

Best Wishes

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 25, 2025, 09:59:20 am
Ah, thank you for helping me understand! Gosh it sounds all a bit dubious! A minefield! There are cameras going up everywhere!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: G6PRK on March 25, 2025, 09:51:00 am
Thank you for that, I shall have a look. I am sorry - it is because I am interested and curious as to how things work. I don’t want to stray away from the parking topic.

Thank you very much for that thread, I shall have a look. I am so glad I found this website!

Please can I just ask - why do the DVLA sell our data, when it is so protected by various things such as GDPR, to private companies without our permission? I am sure many people would be concerned about this, and would like to know how this is possible and legal.

Best wishes!

They don't sell data in the strictest of senses - they have a process, KADOE 'Keeper at date of event' that allows operators to access data in order to pursue legally issued parking charges.

The problem is that they don't follow the rules (in order to maximise profits) and the government are practicing wilful ignorance to this issue (potentially in part due to the revenues generated through the process).

I think most people would agree that private parking schemes can be fair and effective, thus the KADOE process could be fair and effective, but alas they rarely are.

GDPR doesn't offer blanket protection against sharing of individuals' private data - it simply lays a framework of legal reasons for doing so.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 25, 2025, 09:24:23 am
Thank you for that, I shall have a look. I am sorry - it is because I am interested and curious as to how things work. I don’t want to stray away from the parking topic.

Thank you very much for that thread, I shall have a look. I am so glad I found this website!

Please can I just ask - why do the DVLA sell our data, when it is so protected by various things such as GDPR, to private companies without our permission? Especially when camera doorbells have come under scrutiny and yet the DVLA are happy to pass on the info (I know they get paid) but it seems nefarious nevertheless.

Best wishes!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: DWMB2 on March 25, 2025, 08:32:21 am
I am mindful that the purpose of this thread is to help you fight a specific parking charge, and I don't want this topic to stray too far from that, but I noticed this:

Quote
I have joined the Sovereign Project
From a quick glance, they seem to be a 'Sovereign Citizen' / Freeman on the Land type group. Many of their arguments are legal bollox - and following them can cause you all kinds of issues.

We have a pinned thread on such arguments: FOTL and Other Misguided Folk (https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/fotl-and-other-misguided-folk/)

Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 25, 2025, 07:57:26 am
Gosh that is terrible that they can get away with it. I don’t think governments work for us. They just tax us, and work against us.

I don’t remember signing anything saying the DVLA could share my data - so how does that work?

There has recently been a huge ‘experimental’ facial recognition roll out in Cardiff (I saw on Big Brother Watch) at a recent rugby game by the police. Clearly, the end goal is a digital database. They’re also talking about being able to revoke people’s driving licences!

I am not sure why we have to ask permission from the government to drive our own cars, but it seems anything registered to the government is owned by it. This government over-reach of control is getting out of hand.

I have joined the Sovereign Project because I don’t see any other way out of how things are progressing in the UK. They can seemingly grab anything they want. We have to take back control of our things, because the way this is heading reminds me of historic events!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 24, 2025, 08:33:12 pm
When you consider that most of the unregulated private parking companies stated out as clampers and all the thuggery and illegality that was associated with that, you get an idea of why the industry is what it is.

The trough that these swine now have their snouts firmly ensconced in is deep and, when you think about it, they don't even have to pay VAT on the actual charges they recover. A series of incompetent governments and ministers who conveniently bow to the well funded lobby that these parking operators have in place and a refusal to give a date for implementation the Private Parking (Code of Practice) Act 2019 (yes, it received royal assent 6 years ago) but has not yet been introduced, the DVLA raking in £2.50 per DVLA KADOE data request at a rate that I will leave you to work out but consider that these rogue companies issue over 40,000 PCNs a DAY, is all evidence of a malaise within government to actually act and, although I do not have evidence, but this suggests to me that with the amounts of money being taken about (£billions) you can see why it is not changing for the better (for the consumer).
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 24, 2025, 08:09:50 pm
Dear b789,

I have edited as per your suggestions and sent it.

Goodness me - it sounds like the industry sails close to the legal wind - how is it legal? Sounds a bit dodgy!

Best wishes!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 24, 2025, 12:58:09 pm

 XXXXXXXXX
 XXXXXXXXX
 XXXXXXXXX
 XXXXXXXXX
 XXXX XXX

 24th March, 2025

3-1-5 Health Club
Mannin Way
Lancaster
LA1 3PE

Dear Ms Sarah Dack McGuniess,

Thank you for your response dated 18th March 2025. I note its contents and your attempt to deflect responsibility for the discriminatory treatment I experienced as a disabled visitor to 3-1-5 Health Club on 18th December 2024. Unfortunately, your letter only confirms that 3-1-5’s current policies place disabled visitors at a clear disadvantage compared to able-bodied visitors and fails to offer any lawful justification for doing so.

You expressly admit that able-bodied visitors are permitted to park for up to three hours with no registration requirement, while disabled visitors are not permitted to park for up to three hours unless they undertake an additional process involving the manual registration of a Blue Badge.

This process is not only unnecessary but your assertion that the parking terminal is “in reception” is plainly misleading. In reality, it is located behind access-controlled barriers within the members-only area of the building. The fact remains that it is not visible, accessible, or intuitive to anyone not attending the health club facilities themselves.

For visitors parking outside and attending partner services such as Biomed, the terminal is definitely not visible, not accessible, and not reasonably discoverable unless someone happens to inform them. You also accept that signage may be unclear, which reinforces the fact that the system was not designed with the needs of disabled visitors in mind.

Your response also dismisses entirely the need for seating at reception, despite my condition requiring it. Whether or not queues are “rare” is irrelevant. The duty to make reasonable adjustments under the Equality Act 2010 is not conditional on your perception of frequency but triggered by the actual impact on disabled individuals. That is the legal test.

For completeness, I should also note that the original Notice to Keeper (NtK) was never received, and the first correspondence I received was a so-called “Reminder Notice” dated just 15 days after the parking event. Given that the statutory period to make payment is 28 days, this early reminder raises legitimate suspicion that the original NtK may never have been sent at all. When ParkingEye finally sent what they claimed was the original NtK via email attachment (only after my complaint), it attempted to rely on the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. However, under Schedule 4 of PoFA, where no Notice to Driver was issued at the time of the event, a Notice to Keeper must be actually delivered within 14 days of the alleged contravention in order to create Keeper liability. If the original was not served within that period—and I maintain that it was not—then ParkingEye cannot rely on PoFA, and no Keeper liability arises. This further undermines the basis of the PCN and should have been sufficient reason for it to be cancelled outright, even before the Equality Act breach was considered.

Now to your most absurd contention—the suggestion that 3-1-5 is “not legally able” to cancel PCNs issued for disabled bays because ParkingEye, your agent, will not permit it. This is legally nonsensical. You are the principal. ParkingEye acts on your behalf, under your authority, on your land. You are jointly and severally liable for the actions of your agent. If your position is that your own appointed agent has forbidden you from intervening even in cases where a PCN has been issued unlawfully or discriminatorily, then I require strict proof. You will be expected to disclose, in full, the unredacted contract between 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd, showing where such an extraordinary and preposterous restriction on your authority is stated.

Further, your own letter reveals the discriminatory nature of your current arrangement in plain terms. You state: “We do not have the facility to cancel PCNs for the disabled bays”—a statement which, when read in full context, only serves to embarrass your position. I have already been informed that cancellations are possible for other visitors—namely able-bodied ones—but not for disabled users. If that isn’t direct discrimination under the Equality Act 2010, then what is?

You appear to be operating a two-tier system where one group of visitors can expect discretion and flexibility, while another—disabled people—are subjected to rigid enforcement, without exception or appeal through the principal. This unequal treatment, based solely on disability status, is indefensible in law and will be central to any claim brought against you.

It is astonishing that 3-1-5 Health Club continues to assert that it lacks the authority to cancel PCNs for disabled bays, when in fact your own marketing materials—jointly produced with ParkingEye—state the opposite. In ParkingEye’s published case study for your site, you are quoted as saying: “We like being able to cancel PCNs for genuine mistakes.” You also confirm the club has full control of enforcement measures, including the ability to whitelist vehicles and instruct ParkingEye to suspend monitoring for events. This completely undermines your claim that you have no say in the matter. The reality is that you have simply chosen not to assist disabled visitors, despite having the clear capacity to do so.

This supports the wider evidence that you operate a two-tier enforcement system, one in which able-bodied visitors can expect cancellation for errors, while disabled people are treated with inflexibility and subjected to PCNs based on inaccessible procedures. That is not only discriminatory—it is indefensible.

The idea that you would enter into a contract that strips you of any ability to ensure lawful and non-discriminatory treatment of your disabled visitors is almost too ridiculous to contemplate, and if you were to be so imbecilic as to let this matter reach trial, this excuse will be prised apart in open court. Passing the buck to your agent is not a defence. The Equality Act does not allow a principal to delegate away its legal responsibilities, and any attempt to do so will only reinforce your liability.

Let me be absolutely clear: this is your final opportunity to resolve this matter. If the PCN is not cancelled and written confirmation of this provided within 14 days of this letter, I will issue a claim against both 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd under the Equality Act 2010. I will seek compensation for unlawful disability discrimination, failure to make reasonable adjustments, and the distress and inconvenience caused. My claim will include an award of damages in the region of £3,000 to £5,000, assessed in line with Vento band guidance.

I expect your next correspondence to be a full and unequivocal confirmation that the PCN has been cancelled and that you are reviewing your policies to ensure no further discrimination occurs against disabled visitors.

Yours sincerely,

XXXXXXXX

I would not include the section you have added about the NtK. You are not corresponding with ParkingEye and your assertion is wrong. A "reminder" is not debt recovery or enforcement.

The "reminder" is simply informing the Keeper that any discount period has expired and that the full amount of the charge will be due by the expiry of the "relevant period". The statutory period of 28 days you refer to is the number of days counting from the day after the date the notice is given, before the creditor can attempt to recover the charge from the Keeper, subject to all the requirements of PoFA being fulfilled.

The original NtK may or may not have actually been sent and ParkingEye have provided no evidence to prove the date the notice entered the postal system as required by the PPSCoP and therefore cannot establish service according to the requirements of the Interpretation Act 1978.

The requirements of PoFA only need to be established on the original NtK. Any reminder is irrelevant. As you saw on the copy of the original NtK, ParkingEye do include reference to PoFA. However, their NtK is flawed and is not fully compliant with all the requirements and can be argued should it ever get to a court hearing.

You are correct in your assertion that these PCNs, reminders and all debt recovery correspondence is designed to make the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree pay up out of ignorance and fear. Consider that over 40,000 private PCNs are issued EVERY DAY!!!! These parasitic, unregulated private parking companies are raking in well over a £billion a year in profits, never mind actual revenue. Between them, they overwhelm the county courts with automated claims and they ruin many peoples finances without a care.

Anyway, I suggest you remove the highlighted section from your response to 3-1-5 Gym as it is not relevant to the main point you are making. You are requiring them to get their agent to have the PCN cancelled and to respond to your discrimination complaint.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 24, 2025, 09:25:58 am
Sorry - the formatting has moved my address. It appears (normally) top right!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 24, 2025, 09:17:38 am

                           XXXXXXXXX
                           XXXXXXXXX
                           XXXXXXXXX
                           XXXXXXXXX
                           XXXX XXX

                           24th March, 2025

3-1-5 Health Club
Mannin Way
Lancaster
LA1 3PE

Dear Ms Sarah Dack McGuniess,

Thank you for your response dated 18th March 2025. I note its contents and your attempt to deflect responsibility for the discriminatory treatment I experienced as a disabled visitor to 3-1-5 Health Club on 18th December 2024. Unfortunately, your letter only confirms that 3-1-5’s current policies place disabled visitors at a clear disadvantage compared to able-bodied visitors and fails to offer any lawful justification for doing so.

You expressly admit that able-bodied visitors are permitted to park for up to three hours with no registration requirement, while disabled visitors are not permitted to park for up to three hours unless they undertake an additional process involving the manual registration of a Blue Badge.

This process is not only unnecessary but your assertion that the parking terminal is “in reception” is plainly misleading. In reality, it is located behind access-controlled barriers within the members-only area of the building. The fact remains that it is not visible, accessible, or intuitive to anyone not attending the health club facilities themselves.

For visitors parking outside and attending partner services such as Biomed, the terminal is definitely not visible, not accessible, and not reasonably discoverable unless someone happens to inform them. You also accept that signage may be unclear, which reinforces the fact that the system was not designed with the needs of disabled visitors in mind.

Your response also dismisses entirely the need for seating at reception, despite my condition requiring it. Whether or not queues are “rare” is irrelevant. The duty to make reasonable adjustments under the Equality Act 2010 is not conditional on your perception of frequency but triggered by the actual impact on disabled individuals. That is the legal test.

For completeness, I should also note that the original Notice to Keeper (NtK) was never received, and the first correspondence I received was a so-called “Reminder Notice” dated just 15 days after the parking event. Given that the statutory period to make payment is 28 days, this early reminder raises legitimate suspicion that the original NtK may never have been sent at all. When ParkingEye finally sent what they claimed was the original NtK via email attachment (only after my complaint), it attempted to rely on the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. However, under Schedule 4 of PoFA, where no Notice to Driver was issued at the time of the event, a Notice to Keeper must be actually delivered within 14 days of the alleged contravention in order to create Keeper liability. If the original was not served within that period—and I maintain that it was not—then ParkingEye cannot rely on PoFA, and no Keeper liability arises. This further undermines the basis of the PCN and should have been sufficient reason for it to be cancelled outright, even before the Equality Act breach was considered.

Now to your most absurd contention—the suggestion that 3-1-5 is “not legally able” to cancel PCNs issued for disabled bays because ParkingEye, your agent, will not permit it. This is legally nonsensical. You are the principal. ParkingEye acts on your behalf, under your authority, on your land. You are jointly and severally liable for the actions of your agent. If your position is that your own appointed agent has forbidden you from intervening even in cases where a PCN has been issued unlawfully or discriminatorily, then I require strict proof. You will be expected to disclose, in full, the unredacted contract between 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd, showing where such an extraordinary and preposterous restriction on your authority is stated.

Further, your own letter reveals the discriminatory nature of your current arrangement in plain terms. You state: “We do not have the facility to cancel PCNs for the disabled bays”—a statement which, when read in full context, only serves to embarrass your position. I have already been informed that cancellations are possible for other visitors—namely able-bodied ones—but not for disabled users. If that isn’t direct discrimination under the Equality Act 2010, then what is?

You appear to be operating a two-tier system where one group of visitors can expect discretion and flexibility, while another—disabled people—are subjected to rigid enforcement, without exception or appeal through the principal. This unequal treatment, based solely on disability status, is indefensible in law and will be central to any claim brought against you.

It is astonishing that 3-1-5 Health Club continues to assert that it lacks the authority to cancel PCNs for disabled bays, when in fact your own marketing materials—jointly produced with ParkingEye—state the opposite. In ParkingEye’s published case study for your site, you are quoted as saying: “We like being able to cancel PCNs for genuine mistakes.” You also confirm the club has full control of enforcement measures, including the ability to whitelist vehicles and instruct ParkingEye to suspend monitoring for events. This completely undermines your claim that you have no say in the matter. The reality is that you have simply chosen not to assist disabled visitors, despite having the clear capacity to do so.

This supports the wider evidence that you operate a two-tier enforcement system, one in which able-bodied visitors can expect cancellation for errors, while disabled people are treated with inflexibility and subjected to PCNs based on inaccessible procedures. That is not only discriminatory—it is indefensible.

The idea that you would enter into a contract that strips you of any ability to ensure lawful and non-discriminatory treatment of your disabled visitors is almost too ridiculous to contemplate, and if you were to be so imbecilic as to let this matter reach trial, this excuse will be prised apart in open court. Passing the buck to your agent is not a defence. The Equality Act does not allow a principal to delegate away its legal responsibilities, and any attempt to do so will only reinforce your liability.

Let me be absolutely clear: this is your final opportunity to resolve this matter. If the PCN is not cancelled and written confirmation of this provided within 14 days of this letter, I will issue a claim against both 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd under the Equality Act 2010. I will seek compensation for unlawful disability discrimination, failure to make reasonable adjustments, and the distress and inconvenience caused. My claim will include an award of damages in the region of £3,000 to £5,000, assessed in line with Vento band guidance.

I expect your next correspondence to be a full and unequivocal confirmation that the PCN has been cancelled and that you are reviewing your policies to ensure no further discrimination occurs against disabled visitors.

Yours sincerely,

XXXXXXXX

Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 24, 2025, 09:16:20 am
Dear DWMB2,

Ah, thank you for clearing that up for me - I was wondering why this parking company, if they have no regards for the guidelines and rules, are generating so much money. I am guessing that people are frightened into thinking they have to pay it and they do just pay it?

Hence the removal of the POFA section on the reminder that I received, and when I later received by email the original, it was on there! Instead on the reminder, they insert a paragraph on Case Law, which has nothing to do with anyone except the people concerned - but it must frighten people into paying! These companies make such a lot of money, I was wondering how if they’re operating in a dubious manner.

I am going to copy and paste my response letter onto here now so you can all see it and then I need to go out, and will be back this afternoon to continue. I win’t send anything until it has been approved.

Many thanks again for all your help!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: DWMB2 on March 24, 2025, 07:26:45 am
Dear b789,

Also, what is the situation with the landowner and Parkingeye - essentially, do the club ultimately have the power force PE to cancel the tickets? Or, as the respondent said, can this power be removed from them?

Best wishes
Just to cover this minor point that you asked earlier in the thread... The short answer is 'possibly' - it depends on the contract between ParkingEye and the landowner. I have seen some that levy a fee on cancellations or otherwise purport to limit cancellations.

However, I'd say that's not your problem. Any contract they may have signed with ParkingEye does not absolve them of any obligations relating to disabled people and fair treatment of customers. If they've signed a contract that leaves them out of pocket in such cases, that's their problem.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 10:52:59 pm
Dear b789,

Thank you ever so much! I shall get back on it first thing, then I’ll copy it up here so you can have a look before it goes! It beggars belief - and on page two of the case study, under the ‘Unparalled Flexibility’ bit. Yes!

Well well well...Fancy that!

Perhaps they’ve forgotten. That figure of speech springs to mind; 'There’s always a [Tweet]'

Best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 08:59:24 pm
Amended response, which now includes Ms Sarah Dack McGuniess's name as she is in the public domain with the mention of her name in the case study:

Quote
Dear Ms Sarah Dack McGuniess,

Thank you for your response dated [insert date]. I note its contents and your attempt to deflect responsibility for the discriminatory treatment I experienced as a disabled visitor to 3-1-5 Health Club on 18th December 2024. Unfortunately, your letter only confirms that 3-1-5’s current policies place disabled visitors at a clear disadvantage compared to able-bodied visitors and fails to offer any lawful justification for doing so.

You expressly admit that able-bodied visitors are permitted to park for up to three hours with no registration requirement, while disabled visitors are not permitted to park for up to three hours unless they undertake an additional process involving the manual registration of a Blue Badge.

This process is not only unnecessary but your assertion that the parking terminal is “in reception” is plainly misleading. In reality, it is located behind access-controlled barriers within the members-only area of the building. The fact remains that it is not visible, accessible, or intuitive to anyone not attending the gym itself.

For visitors parking outside and attending partner services such as Biomed, the terminal is definitely not visible, not accessible, and not reasonably discoverable unless someone happens to inform them. You also accept that signage may be unclear, which reinforces the fact that the system was not designed with the needs of disabled visitors in mind.

Your response also dismisses entirely the need for seating at reception, despite my condition requiring it. Whether or not queues are “rare” is irrelevant. The duty to make reasonable adjustments under the Equality Act 2010 is not conditional on your perception of frequency but triggered by the actual impact on disabled individuals. That is the legal test.

Now to your most absurd contention—the suggestion that 3-1-5 is “not legally able” to cancel PCNs issued for disabled bays because ParkingEye, your agent, will not permit it. This is legally nonsensical. You are the principal. ParkingEye acts on your behalf, under your authority, on your land. You are jointly and severally liable for the actions of your agent. If your position is that your own appointed agent has forbidden you from intervening even in cases where a PCN has been issued unlawfully or discriminatorily, then I require strict proof. You will be expected to disclose, in full, the unredacted contract between 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd, showing where such an extraordinary and preposterous restriction on your authority is stated.

Further, your own letter reveals the discriminatory nature of your current arrangement in plain terms. You state: “We do not have the facility to cancel PCNs for the disabled bays”—a statement which, when read in full context, only serves to embarrass your position. It implies that cancellations are possible for other visitors—namely able-bodied ones—but not for disabled users. If that isn’t direct discrimination under the Equality Act 2010, then what is?

You appear to be operating a two-tier system where one group of visitors can expect discretion and flexibility, while another—disabled people—are subjected to rigid enforcement, without exception or appeal through the principal. This unequal treatment, based solely on disability status, is indefensible in law and will be central to any claim brought against you.

It is astonishing that 3-1-5 Health Club continues to assert that it lacks the authority to cancel PCNs for disabled bays, when in fact your own marketing materials—jointly produced with ParkingEye—state the opposite. In ParkingEye’s published case study for your site, your staff are quoted as saying: “We like being able to cancel PCNs for genuine mistakes.” You also confirm the club has full control of enforcement measures, including the ability to whitelist vehicles and instruct ParkingEye to suspend monitoring for events. This completely undermines your claim that you have no say in the matter. The reality is that you have simply chosen not to assist disabled visitors, despite having the clear capacity to do so.

This supports the wider evidence that you operate a two-tier enforcement system, one in which able-bodied visitors can expect cancellation for errors, while disabled people are treated with inflexibility and subjected to PCNs based on inaccessible procedures. That is not only discriminatory—it is indefensible.

The idea that you would enter into a contract that strips you of any ability to ensure lawful and non-discriminatory treatment of your disabled visitors is almost too ridiculous to contemplate, and if you were to be so imbecilic as to let this matter reach trial, this excuse will be prised apart in open court. Passing the buck to your agent is not a defence. The Equality Act does not allow a principal to delegate away its legal responsibilities, and any attempt to do so will only reinforce your liability.

Let me be absolutely clear: this is your final opportunity to resolve this matter. If the PCN is not cancelled and written confirmation of this provided within 14 days of this letter, I will issue a claim against both 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd under the Equality Act 2010. I will seek compensation for unlawful disability discrimination, failure to make reasonable adjustments, and the distress and inconvenience caused. My claim will include an award of damages in the region of £3,000 to £5,000, assessed in line with Vento band guidance.

I expect your next correspondence to be a full and unequivocal confirmation that the PCN has been cancelled and that you are reviewing your policies to ensure no further discrimination occurs against disabled visitors.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Name]
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 08:54:28 pm
That "case study" significantly undercuts the claims made in 3-1-5 Health Club’s formal response to your complaint and directly supports your argument that they do have the ability to cancel PCNs, including for disabled bays, when they choose to.

Here's the key quote from the case study:

“We like being able to cancel PCNs for genuine mistakes. Being a private health club, our Customer Service has to be second to none.” — Sarah Dack McGuiness, 3-1-5 Health Club

This directly contradicts what Ms Dack McGuiness stated in her response to your complaint—namely, that the club "does not have the authority" to cancel PCNs issued for disabled bays. The case study also confirms that ParkingEye’s system is fully customisable, allows exceptions, and gives the client (3-1-5) “total control” over how and when enforcement is applied, including the ability to pause cameras, add whitelists, and cancel PCNs.

This contradiction raises serious points:

• Their claim of helplessness is demonstrably false.
• They say they "cannot cancel" tickets for the disabled bays, yet boast in a ParkingEye-endorsed document that they cancel PCNs for genuine mistakes.
• Selective enforcement is being practiced.
• The club appears to retain the discretion to cancel PCNs—just not for disabled users, which is blatantly discriminatory.

The system is not fit for purpose.

ANPR cannot detect Blue Badges, and they know it. You’ve pointed out that Blue Badges aren’t visible in many of the vehicles parked in disabled bays, yet enforcement doesn’t apply consistently. This inconsistency only reinforces the irrationality of their system.

Their initial phone conversation with you supports this. A receptionist initially confirmed they could cancel your PCN and even asked you to send over your Blue Badge. It was only when "management" intervened the next day that you were told otherwise. That admission is telling—they used to cancel them, but allegedly stopped because ParkingEye didn’t like it. That’s not a legal defence.

I will amend the response letter accordingly.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 08:44:40 pm
Well, this is a damning bit of evidence:

(https://i.imgur.com/wmTG8nM.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/dWFLdrB.jpeg)

Will need to think about this a bit more.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 08:42:10 pm
Dear b789,

Just to add, (sorry if I have already told you but I think it is relevant in this context). At the beginning of all this, when I rang the club to ask if they could help me with the cancellation of the ticket (at first this was agreed to by a receptionist and I emailed my disabled badges over to her) the following morning a lady, (management, I think) called me back and said 'sorry this would not be possible as Parkingeye had stopped them from doing it because they were cancelling so many'.

Which begs the question - why can they still cancel the normal car park tickets and not the disabled then? Why would they be OK with that set-up? Sounds a bit odd!

Best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 08:28:51 pm
Dear B789,

Oh wow - what a brilliant response the edited one is awesome, and of course, I shall make sure we are ready to go before sending anything.

Yes, that is what I meant when I asked about the defence being to solve a problem and I understand now regarding direct and indirect, thank you for clarifying this for me and helping me to understand, I am very grateful.

I suppose I thought they were confident because of their defensive responses, when clearly in the wrong, one would have thought they may have let it go and just cancelled the ticket.

You're not going to believe what I have just found. When looking for the Parkingeye 3-1-5 Case Study, to which I will provide a link below, one of the quotations from a staff member, states they are proud to be able to cancel the tickets in event of error - or words to that effect. I shall provide the link:

https://www.parkingeye.co.uk/car-park-management/wp-content/uploads/sites/5/2023/07/Case-Study-315.pdf

Best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 08:05:49 pm
I am sure the NtoK they sent out was not compliant and I wrote to Parkingeye telling them this - I never received the original and it is mighty suspicious that a reminder was sent out 15 days after the parking event, when you are given 28 days to pay! Why would they send out a 'reminder' 15 days after the parking event if they had sent the original? They clearly forgot (over Xmas) to send it out in the first place then tried to rectify their mistake with this one! Something doesn't add up. When they finally they sent out the 'original' on an email attachment (this month, I think) - it mentioned the POFA! Which states they have only 14 days! Which means this is not allowed and they have broken the rules (I think).

This issue is secondary at this stage, since your formal complaint to 3-1-5 Health Club squarely puts the onus on them—as the principal—to instruct their agent to cancel the PCN on grounds of unlawful discrimination.

However, it may be worth briefly capturing the concern as part of the wider context, without muddying the central Equality Act claim. Here's how you might include it, if you want to reference it in the background section of your response:

Quote
For completeness, I should also note that the original Notice to Keeper (NtK) was never received, and the first correspondence I received was a so-called “Reminder Notice” dated just 15 days after the parking event. Given that the statutory period to make payment is 28 days, this early reminder raises legitimate suspicion that the original NtK may never have been sent at all. When ParkingEye finally sent what they claimed was the original NtK via email attachment (only after my complaint), it attempted to rely on the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. However, under Schedule 4 of PoFA, where no Notice to Driver was issued at the time of the event, a Notice to Keeper must be actually delivered within 14 days of the alleged contravention in order to create Keeper liability. If the original was not served within that period—and I maintain that it was not—then ParkingEye cannot rely on PoFA, and no Keeper liability arises. This further undermines the basis of the PCN and should have been sufficient reason for it to be cancelled outright, even before the Equality Act breach was considered.

But I repeat, this is not the main issue at this stage. The focus is squarely on 3-1-5’s discriminatory policy, and they are fully empowered and legally obligated to put things right, regardless of PoFA arguments.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 07:59:27 pm
I did wonder with this response whether they were relying on the defence (within The Equalities Act 2010) that discriminating against people in order to solve a genuine problem (abuse of the disabled spaces) is therefore not discrimination? I am curious as to what it means in the Act - is that what it means? So if a company claims it was done to get rid of one problem and therefore discrimination is collateral damage, can people defend themselves with that argument? Because they have a case study (Parkingeye at 3-1-5) online which clearly explains why they have done it. NB - I am just checking because I am curious about the mechanisms, and how they go about all of this, what makes them so confident?

I don't think that they are confident at all. I don't know what you makes you think that they are.

Your question is insightful—and yes, it sounds like they may be trying (consciously or not) to rely on what’s known as a justification defence under the Equality Act 2010, which applies only to indirect discrimination, not direct discrimination.

Direct discrimination is where a person is treated less favourably because of a protected characteristic, like disability. There is no legal defence to direct discrimination, except in very limited cases involving age.

Indirect discrimination is where a policy or rule applies to everyone, but disproportionately disadvantages people with a protected characteristic. This can be defended if the policy is a “proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim.”

Is that what you’re referring to—the so-called “greater good” or collateral damage justification?

Their explanation—that disabled visitors must register because others were abusing the disabled bays—suggests they are attempting to justify indirect discrimination, not realising that their policy might also be direct discrimination (which has no such defence).

So, they might argue: “We require Blue Badge holders to register because of previous misuse. That’s our legitimate aim—to ensure those bays are kept for genuine users.” But here’s the problem: The policy only applies to disabled people—not everyone. That strongly suggests it’s direct discrimination, since you’re being treated worse because you are disabled. They can’t justify that.

Even if it’s treated as indirect discrimination, they still have to show that the measure is proportionate. That means the problem was real and evidenced; The measure was likely to solve it; There was no less discriminatory way to solve it and the impact on disabled visitors was minimal.

Their system clearly fails this test because it requires extra steps from disabled people that aren’t required of anyone else. It relies on inaccessible terminals and unclear signage. It offers no safeguard for those with non-visible disabilities. They refuse to cancel PCNs, even when a person can prove eligibility to use the space.

That’s unlikely to be considered proportionate by any court.

They may be over-relying on advice from ParkingEye, whose commercial interest is to maximise enforceable PCNs, not to protect 3-1-5 from discrimination claims. They may believe the “abuse of disabled bays” story sounds reasonable to the average person and might bluff through it if unchallenged. They may believe that most people won’t sue or know the law well enough to challenge them.

I have no idea what this "case study with ParkingEye" you refer to is. Could this possible be a story made up by ParkingEye and is likely framed as a success story, focusing on reduced bay misuse and not on whether the system is legally compliant or discriminatory? Practical success doesn’t override legal obligations under the Equality Act.

So, they might think their policy is lawful because it aims to solve a genuine problem, but in reality:

• If the policy causes direct discrimination, it’s indefensible.
• If it causes indirect discrimination, they must justify it—and the system as it stands is unlikely to pass that test.

So their confidence (that you think they have) may rest more on habit and lack of legal challenge than on any solid legal footing.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 07:47:44 pm
I have edited the response to 3-1-5 slightly based on your explanation about the terminal being behind barriers. Please check if you are using the draft I propose you send to 3-1-5.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 06:26:20 pm
Dear b789,

Also, what is the situation with the landowner and Parkingeye - essentially, do the club ultimately have the power force PE to cancel the tickets? Or, as the respondent said, can this power be removed from them?

Best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 06:23:15 pm
Dear b789,

Thank you very much; I am actually preparing this letter right now. I cannot understand is why they're saying the terminal is located in reception when it is behind barriers in the private membership area. The fact is, when you have parked the car, it could already be too late if the machine has noted the registration, if one of the partners fails to mention it to a person. And, not all people may have a visible disability, in which case, how would they know to mention it? Would it just not be easier to treat everyone the same and save the hassle of having to mention it to every single customer?

I did wonder with this response whether they were relying on the defence (within The Equalities Act 2010) that discriminating against people in order to solve a genuine problem (abuse of the disabled spaces) is therefore not discrimination? I am curious as to what it means in the Act - is that what it means? So if a company claims it was done to get rid of one problem and therefore discrimination is collateral damage, can people defend themselves with that argument? Because they have a case study (Parkingeye at 3-1-5) online which clearly explains why they have done it. NB - I am just checking because I am curious about the mechanisms, and how they go about all of this, what makes them so confident?

I am sure the NtoK they sent out was not compliant and I wrote to Parkingeye telling them this - I never received the original and it is mighty suspicious that a reminder was sent out 15 days after the parking event, when you are given 28 days to pay! Why would they send out a 'reminder' 15 days after the parking event if they had sent the original? They clearly forgot (over Xmas) to send it out in the first place then tried to rectify their mistake with this one! Something doesn't add up. When they finally they sent out the 'original' on an email attachment (this month, I think) - it mentioned the POFA! Which states they have only 14 days! Which means this is not allowed and they have broken the rules (I think).

I cannot understand why they turned down the original appeal (twice) on these grounds - which made me wonder are they going for breach of contract? I read the Single Sector Code and also the BPA guidelines and one of them (can't just remember which) refers to the parking company having to inform them by what method they will use to pursue. These guidelines also made significant reference to the use of POFA and non-reliance of POFA. What is all that about? I cannot understand why they're still pursuing after I have explained to them etc. They clearly must think they can win?

A friend who frequents the gym regularly walked past the disabled bays the other night and said not one of them had a Blue Badge displayed - even though it is a requirement on the sign! I bet they didn't all get parking tickets - Parkingeye's camera's cannot see the Blue Badges, that is clear. They couldn't see mine!

Anyway, I shall continue with the letter - thank you once again!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 01:33:40 pm
So, for clarification, this was the response from 3-1-5 to the formal complaint:

Quote
Dear MX XXXXXXX,
 
We sincerely apologise that you have felt the need to send such a detailed complaint regarding your experience at 3-1-5 Health Club. Please be assured that we take all concerns seriously and strive to ensure fair and accessible policies for all our visitors.
 
I am responding on behalf of Sean Thornton, as he is currently undergoing medical treatment at XXXXXXXXXX and is unable to reply personally. However, he has been made aware of your complaint. We appreciate your concerns and would like to clarify our position and the reasoning behind our parking policies.
 
1. Summary of Events

We acknowledge that you received a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) after attending a medical appointment at Biomed on 18th December 2024. However, as stated in our last communication, any appeal must be directed to Parking Eye. From your letter, we assume your appeal has been declined. Please can you confirm this, our Front of house team confirm they explained the procedure to you but were unsure of the outcome as they had not heard since that discussion.
 
Regarding your concerns:

Three-hour free parking for able-bodied visitors: This applies to all standard parking spaces. The disabled bays require registration due to past abuse by non-disabled users, which resulted in numerous complaints and cancellations. The policy was implemented to ensure that disabled bays remain available for those who need them. That was and is always our priority.

Location of the parking terminal: The registration system is kept at reception in line with our general visitor sign-in process. We recognise that Biomed’s location means some visitors have no requirement to pass by reception, and we have since taken steps to improve communication with all our resident partners to ensure visitors are made aware of the need to register blue badges.

Accessibility issues: We understand that your condition makes standing at reception difficult. Any member of our team, including XXXXXX from Biomed, can assist in registering your Blue Badge and car registration without requiring you to stand at reception.
 
2. Direct Discrimination Allegations

We strongly refute the claim that our parking policy is discriminatory.

(a) Direct Discrimination

We do not have the authority to cancel PCNs for disabled users; this ability was removed by Parking Eye due to misuse of the system. We physically do not have access to a cancellation portal. Appeals must go through Parking Eye directly.

The requirement to register Blue Badges is not to discriminate but to ensure that disabled bays are used appropriately. This system has significantly reduced misuse and has been effective in ensuring availability for genuine Blue Badge holders.

(b) Indirect Discrimination

The parking terminal is not located behind a swipe barrier but is in reception. We acknowledge that Biomed visitors may not automatically pass through or by reception, and we are working to improve communication about this requirement.

We appreciate the concern regarding seating at reception and will review options to enhance accessibility, however, we very rarely have queue’s, so this has never been an issue or a requirement. We have multiple receptionists on duty at all times, so queuing has not been an issue on a day to day basis. In the meantime, any staff member can assist in registering a Blue Badge without requiring visitors to stand at reception.
 
3. 3-1-5 Health Club’s Liability

While Parking Eye manages our parking enforcement, we acknowledge our responsibility to ensure fair access. However, we are not legally able to cancel Disabled Bay PCNs ourselves.
The registration system was introduced as a proactive measure to prevent abuse of disabled spaces, ensuring they remain available for those who need them. Again always our priority.
 
4. Misleading Signage

The sign states that the parking terminal is in reception, which is correct. However, we recognize that better clarity may be required, particularly for visitors to Biomed.
 
5. Requested Actions

Cancellation of PCN: As previously stated, 3-1-5 Health Club does not have the authority to cancel PCN’s for disabled bays, this is a separate system and as explained, any appeals must be directed to Parking Eye. Since receiving your letter on 12th March, we have contacted Parking Eye to ask for an update on your situation as you have not communicated with us as to whether your PCN was appealed successfully or not.

Future Prevention of Unfair Penalties: We have reinforced communication with our partners to ensure that all disabled visitors are made aware of the need to register their Blue Badge upon arrival and that we do not have the facility to cancel PCN’s for the disabled bays.

Review of the Parking System:

We have forwarded your letter to Parking Eye who will deal with your complaint directly.
Staff training is paramount to us and always a priority, we always ensure all visitors, especially those with disabilities, are treated with fairness and respect.
 
6. Legal Considerations

We take accusations of discrimination very seriously and are disappointed that you feel this way. Our parking policy was implemented to protect disabled parking spaces, not to discriminate. We strive to be an inclusive facility and have a large number of disabled members and visitors who use our facilities due to our accessibility and the services we provide for non able bodied users.
 
7. Resolution

If you have not yet registered your Blue Badge and registration with us, we encourage you to do so to avoid future issues. Please do let us know should you require assistance, XXXXXX or another team member can register your badge on your behalf. Please just ask. As stated earlier, Parking Eye who both issue and have the ability to cancel disabled bay PCN’s will be in contact with you directly.
 
We hope this clarifies our position and reassures you of our commitment to accessibility and fairness.
 
Yours sincerely,

XXXXXXXX
On behalf of Sean Thornton
3-1-5 Health Club

That response received from 3-1-5 Gym actually strengthens your position. They’ve admitted that disabled visitors are treated differently from able-bodied visitors. Able-bodied people can use the car park for three hours without registering, but disabled visitors are required to go out of their way to register at reception just to avoid a penalty. That’s a clear example of discrimination, since it places a burden on disabled people that doesn’t apply to others.

They’ve also admitted that visitors attending businesses like Biomed might not pass through reception at all, meaning they won’t even see the parking terminal. While they claim the terminal is technically located in reception and not behind swipe barriers, that doesn’t change the fact that it’s not visible or accessible to people who don’t go through reception. They even acknowledge that the signage may not be clear enough. These are direct admissions that the system in place is not suitable for all visitors, particularly disabled ones.

Their claim that they cannot cancel PCNs for disabled bays because ParkingEye won’t allow it is absurd and is irrelevant in law. They are the principal party, and ParkingEye is acting as their agent. That means 3-1-5 remains legally responsible for any discriminatory consequences arising from the parking enforcement system they’ve chosen to use. Passing the buck to ParkingEye doesn’t change that.

They also dismiss your concerns about accessibility and standing at reception by saying they don’t usually have queues. That misses the point entirely. The duty to make reasonable adjustments under the Equality Act is based on your needs as a disabled visitor, not on what they consider “normal” or how busy they think reception usually is.

You now have solid grounds to escalate this to a formal Letter Before Claim. You can claim for unlawful discrimination under the Equality Act 2010 and seek compensation for distress, inconvenience, and the impact this has had on you. A reasonable amount to claim would be in the region of £3,000 to £5,000, based on comparable cases. You would also require them to cancel the PCN and review their parking system to stop this happening to others. If they don’t resolve it within 14 days, you would then have the option to begin court proceedings.

I suggest the following response to that letter:

Quote
Dear XXXXXXXX,

Thank you for your response dated [insert date]. I note its contents and your attempt to deflect responsibility for the discriminatory treatment I experienced as a disabled visitor to 3-1-5 Health Club on 18th December 2024. Unfortunately, your letter only confirms that 3-1-5’s current policies place disabled visitors at a clear disadvantage compared to able-bodied visitors and fails to offer any lawful justification for doing so.

You expressly admit that able-bodied visitors are permitted to park for up to three hours with no registration requirement, while disabled visitors are not permitted to park for up to three hours unless they undertake an additional process involving the manual registration of a Blue Badge.

This process is not only unnecessary but your assertion that the parking terminal is “in reception” is plainly misleading. In reality, it is located behind access-controlled barriers within the members-only area of the building. The fact remains that it is not visible, accessible, or intuitive to anyone not attending the gym itself.

For visitors parking outside and attending partner services such as Biomed, the terminal is definitely not visible, not accessible, and not reasonably discoverable unless someone happens to inform them. You also accept that signage may be unclear, which reinforces the fact that the system was not designed with the needs of disabled visitors in mind.

Your response also dismisses entirely the need for seating at reception, despite my condition requiring it. Whether or not queues are “rare” is irrelevant. The duty to make reasonable adjustments under the Equality Act 2010 is not conditional on your perception of frequency but triggered by the actual impact on disabled individuals. That is the legal test.

Now to your most absurd contention—the suggestion that 3-1-5 is “not legally able” to cancel PCNs issued for disabled bays because ParkingEye, your agent, will not permit it. This is legally nonsensical. You are the principal. ParkingEye acts on your behalf, under your authority, on your land. You are jointly and severally liable for the actions of your agent. If your position is that your own appointed agent has forbidden you from intervening even in cases where a PCN has been issued unlawfully or discriminatorily, then I require strict proof. You will be expected to disclose, in full, the unredacted contract between 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd, showing where such an extraordinary and preposterous restriction on your authority is stated.

Further, your own letter reveals the discriminatory nature of your current arrangement in plain terms. You state: “We do not have the facility to cancel PCNs for the disabled bays”—a statement which, when read in full context, only serves to embarrass your position. It implies that cancellations are possible for other visitors—namely able-bodied ones—but not for disabled users. If that isn’t direct discrimination under the Equality Act 2010, then what is?

You appear to be operating a two-tier system where one group of visitors can expect discretion and flexibility, while another—disabled people—are subjected to rigid enforcement, without exception or appeal through the principal. This unequal treatment, based solely on disability status, is indefensible in law and will be central to any claim brought against you.

The idea that you would enter into a contract that strips you of any ability to ensure lawful and non-discriminatory treatment of your disabled visitors is almost too ridiculous to contemplate, and if you were to be so imbecilic as to let this matter reach trial, this excuse will be prised apart in open court. Passing the buck to your agent is not a defence. The Equality Act does not allow a principal to delegate away its legal responsibilities, and any attempt to do so will only reinforce your liability.

Let me be absolutely clear: this is your final opportunity to resolve this matter. If the PCN is not cancelled and written confirmation of this provided within 14 days of this letter, I will issue a claim against both 3-1-5 Health Club and ParkingEye Ltd under the Equality Act 2010. I will seek compensation for unlawful disability discrimination, failure to make reasonable adjustments, and the distress and inconvenience caused. My claim will include an award of damages in the region of £3,000 to £5,000, assessed in line with Vento band guidance.

I expect your next correspondence to be a full and unequivocal confirmation that the PCN has been cancelled and that you are reviewing your policies to ensure no further discrimination occurs against disabled visitors.

Yours sincerely,

[Your Name]
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 01:11:49 pm
Dear b789,

Yes that is fine. Thank you once again for all your help!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 12:55:36 pm
I have responded to your PM and advised on how you should publish a suitable redacted version of the response. I have also PMd you why their response not only doesn't answer your points but further exposes their admission to discrimination against you and all other disable d customers.

lease let me know ASAP so that I can also provide you with the required next step in responding to 3-1-5 Gym and ParkingEye.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 11:53:30 am
Dear b789,

I have PM'd it to you - I hope you have received it - please let me know if not

Best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 23, 2025, 11:00:17 am
I would need to see the response from 3-1-5 Gym. Interesting that you are feeling sympathy for the landowner that has contracted the scammers that are trying to fleece you.

Please PM me the responses you’ve had. I will let you know what can or should be made public and then you can decide on how you want to deal with this.

Your POPLA appeal is not likely to be responded to for several months. However, if the operator does not withdraw, you should receive an operators evidence pack from POPLA which you will be able to respond to. If/when you receive that, upload it somewhere such as DropBox or Google Files and provide a link.

Make sure that the copy you upload for us to review is suitable redacted of you personal information.

In the meantime, please PM the 3-1-5 Gym response to your formal complaint so that I can advise on how you respond.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: jfollows on March 23, 2025, 10:53:57 am
Please don’t try and do things away from the forum, if you need to “redact” personal correspondence then by all means do, but it’s only by having discussion in public that the rest of us get to learn and offer better advice to people like you in future.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 23, 2025, 10:46:56 am
Dear B789,

Thank you for getting back to me, no worries! I did appeal to POPLA at the eleventh hour (on the 14/03/2025), I haven't heard back as yet. I did however hear back from 3-1-5 last Wednesday and I haven't currently replied. I feel a bit uncertain as to whether to post it on here because it is a bit personal and defensive - is there a chance I may send it to you privately? Also, with it being a privately-owned small business and not a big corporate, I was unsure where I would stand by doing this and whether I could get myself or anyone else into trouble.

Your help is very much appreciated, and I cannot thank you enough on this matter. It has made me, on occasion, sad and anxious.

My very best wishes
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 22, 2025, 03:11:50 pm
Apologies, I didn't get back to you in time to put together a POPLA appeal. I have been travelling and your response slipped down the list.

However, that should have no bearing on anything going forwards. POPLA is not a truly independent appeals service, even though they claim to be. They are funded by the BPA members and so, do not like to bite the hand that feeds them.

Have you have any response or acknowledgement to your formal complaint from 3-1-5 Gym? You gave them 14 days to respond. If you've heard nothing back from them by then, let us know and we can progress this to the next stage.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 13, 2025, 09:44:19 pm
If I were to do the POPLA appeal tomorrow, now the letter has been sent, the PCN I would be responding to is the Reminder (because the original never came) - is it on that basis that they have no claim - doesn't it have to be after a certain amount of days that they send the NtoK? They rejected it twice, and now I have sent the letter, does that mean any action will be frozen, or should I still appeal just incase?

Thank you once again!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 12, 2025, 08:19:36 pm
Dear b789,

I have done it! It has been sent now, as you recommended. I will let you know when I hear back. Just out of interest, what should I do about POPLA now?

Best wishes, and thank you so much :)
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 11, 2025, 04:39:08 pm
Thank you I will do, I am still working on it, had to go out earlier but back on it now. Thank you so much for all this help!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 11, 2025, 01:27:53 pm
Send the letter as a PDF attachment in an email to memberservices@3-1-5.co.uk and CC sean@x-force.co.uk and yourself. Sean Thornton is the director/owner of 3-1-5 Health Club which is wholly owned by X-Force UK Ltd.
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 11, 2025, 08:14:28 am
Dear b789,

Thank you very much. I am going to do the letter this morning. In the meantime then, should I just get on with that and forget about the appeal for now? Parkingeye's last email to me was on the 5th March, giving me until the 14th March, this Friday.

My thoughts are: when I send the letter today, (and and attachments by email), they will have to once again freeze their pursuit against me?

Thank you again - your help is so much appreciated, I felt I was getting out of my depth!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 11, 2025, 02:44:00 am
Yes, you can mention the signs.

You shouldn't be talking with ParkingEye or anyone for that matter. All communication should be by email or letters sent as attachments by email.

I'll try and get a POPLA appeal set up tomorrow or Wednesday. The POPLA appeal deadline is actually 33 days from the date of the appeal rejection. The POPLA code will be valid until then,
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 10, 2025, 10:37:40 pm
Dear b789,

Thank you every so much for your brilliant letter. I shall get on with it first thing, and I will let you know how I get on.

Please may I just ask a couple of questions? The first being, should I mention that the signs are misleading/incorrect by stating the Parking Terminal is situated in reception, when it is not?

And also, what should I do regarding POPLA? Parkingeye wanted me to pay the reduced rate fine of £60.00 or go to POPLA - the deadline is this Friday, the 14th March? I am uncertain as of what to do?

To be honest, Parkingeye gave me a bit of a roasting when I complained and mentioned it was unfair the disabled. They said they took it all very seriously and are compliant, etc - arguing with me.

Once again, I cannot thank you enough for you help. I must have spent in total well over a fortnight altogether of my time, researching and looking for answers and to be quite honest, panicking as well! Thank you so much - and I shall keep you posted!
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 10, 2025, 10:11:46 pm
I suggest you send the following formal complaint to 3-1-5 Gym as they are jointly and severally liable for the actions of their agent, ParkingEye. Also, read up on this:

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/equality/equality-act-2010/your-rights-under-equality-act-2010/disability-discrimination

You could even send the formal complaint to 3-1-5 as a Letter Before Claim (LBC).  Given the clear direct and indirect discrimination under the Equality Act 2010, you could seek damages for distress, inconvenience, and injury to feelings.

How Much in Damages? The Vento Guidelines set out compensation levels for discrimination claims. Based on your experience, including:

• Distress and inconvenience caused by the PCN and ParkingEye’s enforcement.
• Humiliation and indignity from being treated differently than able-bodied visitors.
• Impact on your health (i.e., your disability means you risk collapse if forced to stand, and their inaccessible system put you at that risk).

You would likely fall into the Lower Band of Vento (2023 figures, adjusted for inflation in 2025):

• £1,100 – £11,200 (lower band) for one-off or less serious cases of discrimination.
• £11,200 – £33,700 (middle band) for more serious cases of discrimination with ongoing effects.

A reasonable starting figure would be around £3,000–£5,000, given the stress, inconvenience, and breach of your rights. This would reflect:

• The burden of having to challenge the PCN.
• The discriminatory treatment.
• The emotional and practical impact of an inaccessible system.

You could go higher if you feel the discrimination was particularly egregious.

Anyway, here is a simple formal complaint you should send immediately to 3-1-5 Gym:

Quote
The Management
3-1-5 Health Club
Lancaster Business Park, Caton Road
Lancaster, LA1 3PE

Subject: Formal Complaint – ParkingEye’s Discriminatory Practices & 3-1-5 Gym’s Own Direct Disability Discrimination

Dear Sir/Madam,

I am writing to formally raise a complaint regarding the unlawful discrimination that I have suffered as a disabled visitor to 3-1-5 Gym on 18th December 2024, as a result of both ParkingEye’s actions as your agent and 3-1-5 Gym’s own discriminatory policies.

1. Summary of Events

On 18th December 2024, I attended a medical appointment at a business that leases an office within your premises but is located outside the gym’s swipe-barrier-controlled area. As a Blue Badge holder, I was legally entitled to park in a disabled space. However, I have since received an unfair Parking Charge Notice (PCN) from ParkingEye.

Your parking policy discriminates against disabled visitors because:

• Able-bodied visitors can park for three hours for free, without any action required.
• Disabled visitors must register their vehicle using a parking terminal that is not accessible unless they first obtain permission to pass through the gym's swipe barriers.
• The parking terminal is hidden from public view, making it impossible for disabled visitors attending businesses outside the gym to access it.
• There is no seating in Reception, and my disability means I am unable to stand for prolonged periods without risking collapse, dizziness, and nausea.

Your staff have confirmed that PCNs for able-bodied visitors can be cancelled, but that disabled visitors are denied this option because ParkingEye allegedly will not allow it.

2. Direct Discrimination by 3-1-5 Gym (Not Just ParkingEye)

Under the Equality Act 2010, 3-1-5 Gym is legally responsible for ensuring that disabled people are not treated less favourably. Your current parking policy is discriminatory in two key ways:

(a) Direct Discrimination

• Your staff have explicitly confirmed that disabled visitors are treated differently from able-bodied visitors regarding PCN cancellations.
• You provide automatic free parking for able-bodied visitors, but disabled visitors must undertake an extra, unnecessary, and inaccessible process just to park.

(b) Indirect Discrimination

• The requirement for disabled visitors to register their vehicle in an inaccessible area (beyond swipe barriers) is an unreasonable and avoidable burden.
• The lack of seating in Reception means that disabled visitors cannot queue safely.

3. 3-1-5 Gym’s Liability – Joint and Several Responsibility for ParkingEye’s Conduct

• ParkingEye is acting as your agent, and you remain jointly and severally liable for their actions.
• You have chosen to implement a system that disproportionately affects disabled visitors.
• You cannot delegate your legal obligations under the Equality Act 2010 to a third party.[/indnet]

4. Required Action – Immediate Cancellation of the PCN and Policy Reform

To resolve this matter, I require the following actions within 14 days:

1. Immediate cancellation of the PCN issued by ParkingEye.
2. Written confirmation that disabled visitors will not be unfairly penalised in the future.
3. A formal review of your parking system to ensure compliance with the Equality Act 2010, including:

• Relocating the parking terminal to an accessible area.
• Ensuring all disabled visitors are exempt from unfair enforcement measures.
• Staff training on disability rights and legal obligations.

5. Notice of Legal Consequences if Unresolved

If this matter is not resolved within 14 days, I will:

• Include 3-1-5 Gym as a co-defendant in any counterclaim against ParkingEye should they pursue litigation.
• Seek damages under the Equality Act 2010 for distress and inconvenience caused by your unlawful discrimination.

6. Final Opportunity to Resolve This Amicably

I trust that 3-1-5 Gym will take this final opportunity to rectify the discrimination and cancel the PCN. If you wish to discuss this matter further, I am open to dialogue within the response period.

I look forward to your urgent response.

Yours faithfully,

[Your Name]
[Your Contact Information]
Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 10, 2025, 09:28:42 pm
Hello there b789,

Thank you ever so much for responding! Yes I am registered-disabled, I was in the car that day with the disabled badges - they can't see them on the camera - that's no good is it? I can now upload the pictures at the scene - I couldn't earlier as needed to convert them to JPEG.

Yes, unfortunately that is 100% true. The able-bodied only have to enter their details if they stay over 3 hours (and 3-1-5 have told me they can cancel those tickets but that Parkingeye have taken over the disabled spaces and owing to this, cancelling disabled ones are impossible. The parking terminal is inaccessible, it is not in reception at all. It cannot be seen. It is behind swipe-barriers and there is no seating. I can pass out if I stand too long owing to my condition. And I have a receipt saying I spent £450.00 (and a further £200 in cash) at 11.30am that day!

I was worried because I have appealed twice to Parkingeye and complained once by post, been knocked back twice and was concerned that because I had filled in their online forms, that the driver may have contracted with them! I am prepared to fight, and even though I have explained this in my complaint letter, they're having none of it!

In their response (which they emailed) they sent a copy of the original PCN which I never received - why would they send out a Reminder only, 15 days after the parking incident? They're supposed to give 28 days - which is suspicious! I wondered why they would email me the original because it is so obvious that foul play has taken place!

Thank you once again - I have attached the photos of the signs. On entering the carpark, I didn't see any signs either, I was looking specifically for them upon returning, but nothing that I could see on entry.

Many thanks for helping me, I really appreciate this so much!

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Title: Re: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: b789 on March 10, 2025, 08:49:32 pm
The reminder notice has no bearing on anything and you should ignore anything to do with that. Also, sending anything by "registered post" is a complete waste of money. If future, all you have to do is send anything first class and get a free "Proof of Posting" certificate from any post office. The letter is then deemed delivered two working days later according to the Interpretation Act 1978.

The 3-1-5 Gym can get a PCN cancelled. They fobbed you off.

Do you or anyone in the vehicle have a blue badge? The set top at the location appears to be set up to catch people out if they cannot access the terminal to be able to input their VRM. Is there any mention on the signs within the car par park, especially by the disabled bays that are readable without having to get out of the vehicle that state that the vehicle VRM must be entered into a terminal?

You state that able bodied visitors to the Gym do not have to enter their VRM for stays of under 3 hours but disabled drivers do have to? That is blatant discrimination under the Equality Act 2010. Are you sure?
Title: NO ORIGINAL PARKINGEYE PCN RECEIVED, REMINDER ONLY, 15 DAYS AFTER PARKING EVENT
Post by: Layrex9 on March 10, 2025, 04:58:40 pm
Hello there, I was hoping please, for some guidance on a Parkingeye Parking Charge Notice Reminder situation.

On the 18th December 2024, the driver attended an appointment at 3-1-5 Lancaster gym complex. The appointment booked was not in the gym itself, but for a medical appointment in the porch of the building where the medical person rents the room from 3-1-5.

Contrary to the sign, there is no parking terminal in Reception – the parking terminal is inaccessible to non-members – it is beyond the member card-swipe barriers, it cannot be seen from the reception area at all. There was a huge queue and no seating within Reception. The disability can cause collapse, dizziness and nausea, if not seated, so standing in queues is not an option – seating is essential.

Parking requirements: Disabled are required to show the badges to the receptionists, who let them through the barriers into the main body of the building to access the Parking Terminal.

The non-disabled are NOT required to see receptionists, type in reg details or display anything and they can park free for three hours. Only if they are going to be longer than three hours, do they need to use the Parking Terminal.

The Gym complex have said they can cancel tickets on their main carpark but not disabled spaces, as PARKINGEYE have allegedly stopped the 3-1-5 from doing so.

On the 6th January a ‘PCN Reminder’ was received, dated 02/01/2025 (15 days after the parking event), the original PCN was never received. This was the first contact. It said the parking event was on the 18/12/2024 and the Ticket Issued 24/12/2024 – Christmas Eve.

The ticket was appealed on PARKINGEYE’s website, on the basis that it was dated 15 days after the parking event on the 18/12/2024 and asked them to remove the data from their system. At this stage nobody had realised it was a PCN REMINDER and not a PCN Notice. It was appealed on this basis on their website, and rejected. This was the appeal:

"You are therefore, in law, unable to hold the registered keeper of the vehicle liable for the parking charge, as the Notice wasn’t sent within 14 days of the alleged contravention. I suggest that you therefore contact the driver. 

As there is no legal requirement placed on the registered keeper to identify the driver, I will not be doing so."

I respectfully request that this parking charge notice be cancelled and that you remove my personal information from your database(s).  I await your confirmation

They came back and asked for the images of the Disabled Badges, having not addressed the fact that they were late sending out the PCN Reminder - it seemed a bit suspicious. On the 14th February, they rejected it again and referred it to POPLA. I then wrote a letter of complaint and sent it registered post, to both sites, Chorley and Blythe.

They emailed me back, once again swerving the issue but this time they sent a copy of the original PCN, which made reference to the POFA on the back! They gave me until 14/03/2025 to either: Pay £60.00 or go to POPLA. I don't know what to do. I still think it is fishy that they would send out a reminder so early - literally they must have sent it during the first 14 days - is this normal? I thought people normally got 28 days and then a reminder and that is why I think it is odd going after the Keeper when the original PCN was never sent. Seems very odd.

Any help would be so graciously received, I feel like just paying but it seems so very wrong! Thank you




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