Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: student.223 on December 15, 2024, 01:14:17 pm
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Their response
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Thank you 😊
I have sent them the email. I've had to send it to the council's parking department because the email address that the response came from - although a standard address - doesn't accept incoming mail.
I will update if there's anything noteworthy.
Many thanks for your and everyone else's help and support. I truly appreciate it - as does the driver in question.
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Well done.
Perhaps..
Thank you for your letter confirming that PCN ******* has been cancelled.
However, I am compelled to write to you because of your comment that my Blue Badge is not valid on double yellow lines because:
'You were given a PCN for parking on a double yellow line; you cannot park here at any time.'
Setting aside for one moment the fact that I was actually parked on a single yellow line, I know of know lawful reason why I should be prevented from parking on DYL provided I display a valid Blue Badge. If the council have received an exemption from the Local Authorities' Traffic Orders (Exemptions for Disabled Persons) (England) Regulations 2000 (not that even the Secretary of State has this power), then please confirm and provide me with a copy or legal reference. Otherwise, please confirm that this comment is without merit and that I and every other BB holder in your jurisdiction am safe to follow the guidance given in the BB booklet, see attached:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-blue-badge-scheme-rights-and-responsibilities-in-england/the-blue-badge-scheme-rights-and-responsibilities-in-england
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They know the law. The letter is just all too typical rushed nonsense we often see and in any case they rarely concede they've got certain things wrong.
But if you want to reply say something like you were puzzled by the letter and for clarification, you were on a single yellow using your blue badge, which is an exemption, and this also applies to double yellows.
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The 3 hour blue badge exemption applies to double and single yellow lines provided there are no loading restrictions.
They obviously haven't looked at this properly and maybe just thought the PCN hadn't been served.
You can write to them pointing out their error but I wouldn't worry unless it happens again - it would likely be a CEO who needs training.
Should she reply to the email with a photo of the single yellow, and a link to the relevant legislation that states a blue badge holder can park on a single and double yellow?
Or just ignore it now and keep parking there as normal.
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The 3 hour blue badge exemption applies to double and single yellow lines provided there are no loading restrictions.
They obviously haven't looked at this properly and maybe just thought the PCN hadn't been served.
You can write to them pointing out their error but I wouldn't worry unless it happens again - it would likely be a CEO who needs training.
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She has received an email response to the representation.
They've cancelled the PCN but I'm not happy with their response. It states that she was given a PCN for parking on a double yellow. But where she parked/parks is a single yellow.
Just wondering if she should reply and get clarification because that's where she parks every day. So she needs to know for sure if she can or cannot park there with the blue badge.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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This is what was sent to the council:
"Firstly, the Notice to Owner is the first I have heard of the alleged contravention because there was no PCN attached to my vehicle.
Secondly, I am making representations against the PCN as the contravention did not occur owing to the exemption of displaying a Blue Badge. I have uploaded a picture of the Blue Badge.
On the day of the alleged contravention, I displayed my Blue Badge and Clock in the prescribed position as required, from 11:30 to 13:30. As per my daily routine, I did not park before or after these times on the day at this location.
As I did not find a PCN on my car when I returned, I had no reason to photograph the position of my Blue Badge, and therefore have no photos of this.
Referring to your photos, there are none of the dashboard showing the presence or absence of my Blue Badge and Clock, just as there are none of a PCN attached to my vehicle.
In light of my Blue Badge exemption and my displaying of it, it appears the PCN has been served in error.
I therefore kindly request you to cancel the PCN."
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Attach unredacted pictures/PDF scans of both sides of the Blue Badge to any representations and/or appeal to the Adjudicator. Not just the front.
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It's rather long, I would cut it down. It's not an appeal - it's representations at this stage and do it online.
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I am making representations against the PCN as the contravention did not occur owing to the exemption of displaying a Blue Badge.
I displayed my Blue Badge [picture attached] and clock in the prescribed position as required, from 11:30 to 13:30 when I returned to the car. As per my daily routine, I did not park before or after before these times on the day at this location.
Please note the Notice to Owner is the first time I have heard of this alleged contravention because I did not find a PCN on the car when I returned to it.
Referring to your pictures, there are none of the dashboard showing the Blue Badge and clock, and none of a PCN served on my car.
As it appears this PCN was issued in error, I look forward to its early cancellation.
Kind Regards
Thank you
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Put the PCN Number after "PCN" in the first sentence. Otherwise it looks OK.
Thank you
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It's rather long, I would cut it down. It's not an appeal - it's representations at this stage and do it online.
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I am making representations against the PCN as the contravention did not occur owing to the exemption of displaying a Blue Badge.
I displayed my Blue Badge [picture attached] and clock in the prescribed position as required, from 11:30 to 13:30 when I returned to the car. As per my daily routine, I did not park before or after before these times on the day at this location.
Please note the Notice to Owner is the first time I have heard of this alleged contravention because I did not find a PCN on the car when I returned to it.
Referring to your pictures, there are none of the dashboard showing the Blue Badge and clock, and none of a PCN served on my car.
As it appears this PCN was issued in error, I look forward to its early cancellation.
Kind Regards
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Put the PCN Number after "PCN" in the first sentence. Otherwise it looks OK.
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She was not parked during the 'No Loading' times.
This is accepted by the council because otherwise the contravention would have been given as 'parked or loading/unloading where waiting.....'.
So let's shoot this hare even before it gets out of the traps.
The driver says they displayed a BB and 'parking disc' AKA clock which was set to the quarter-hour time of 11.30 which means the driver is declaring that they parked on or after 11.30 but before 11.45.
However, there isn't any objective evidence of this. Neither does there appear to be a photo of a PCN.
Perhaps...
I refer to the NTO dated *** in respect of a PCN allegedly served on my vehicle at ** on ** alleging a contravention of 'parked....'.
The contravention did not occur because at the time I was displaying my BB and clock in the prescribed position as required for no more than 3 hours*. I enclose a copy for your records.
As I did not find a PCN on my car when I returned, I had no reason to photograph its position and therefore have no objective evidence on this point, just as the authority do not have objective evidence in the form of photos that such a PCN was even served or disproving the display of a BB. However, as I have held a BB for ** years, park at this location regularly- indeed my car car be seen in the enclosed GSV dated ***- and would assert at adjudication that my BB was displayed you've got to ask yourself one question. Do you feel lucky? Well, do ya ****.
obviously the ending is optional!
*- there are two parts to the exemption granted to BB holders. The 3-hour limit AND no return within 1 hour. Could the contravention possibly be linked to the second limb?
Are you ok to review the appeal draft please?
Dear Manchester City Council,
I refer to the Notice to Owner dated 11/12/2024 in respect of a PCN allegedly served on my vehicle at 13:12 hours on 05/11/2024, alleging a contravention of 'Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours'.
Firstly, I would like to inform you that the Notice to Owner is the first I have heard of the alleged contravention because I did not receive a PCN. There was no documentation attached to my vehicle at any time [as can also be seen in the photos taken by the authority], and I also did not receive a PCN via post.
Secondly, I would like to appeal the Notice to Owner as the contravention did not occur. The reason for this is, at the time of the alleged contravention:
1] I was displaying my Blue Badge [picture attached] and Clock in the prescribed position as required, from 11:30 to 13:30 on the day of the alleged contravention. As per my daily routine, I did not park again at that place until the morning of the following day.
2] As I did not find a PCN on my car when I returned, I had no reason to photograph the position of my Blue Badge, and therefore have no objective evidence on this point.
3] The photographs provided by the authority, do not have any evidence that my Blue Badge was not displayed, or that a PCN was served.
4] I have held a Blue Badge for many years and I am therefore well acquainted with the rules surrounding the use and display of it. I also park at this location daily, and coincidentally the Google Street View link provided at the end of this message shows my car parked at the location of the alleged contravention. Even in the Google Street View images of my car, my Blue Badge and Clock are clearly visible which shows that I do display my Badge and Clock.
In light of all of the above raised points, I request you to cancel the PCN and subsequent Notice to Owner.
Kind Regards
Google Street View Link: https://www.instantstreetview.com/@53.454472,-2.197896,277.34h,-15.53p,1.78z,V9TxSQP9UC1k3_Qib0XWTA
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Yes, if a BB and parking disc are displayed as required.
Thank you
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Yes, if a BB and parking disc are displayed as required.
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She was not parked during the 'No Loading' times.
This is accepted by the council because otherwise the contravention would have been given as 'parked or loading/unloading where waiting.....'.
So let's shoot this hare even before it gets out of the traps.
The driver says they displayed a BB and 'parking disc' AKA clock which was set to the quarter-hour time of 11.30 which means the driver is declaring that they parked on or after 11.30 but before 11.45.
However, there isn't any objective evidence of this. Neither does there appear to be a photo of a PCN.
Perhaps...
I refer to the NTO dated *** in respect of a PCN allegedly served on my vehicle at ** on ** alleging a contravention of 'parked....'.
The contravention did not occur because at the time I was displaying my BB and clock in the prescribed position as required for no more than 3 hours*. I enclose a copy for your records.
As I did not find a PCN on my car when I returned, I had no reason to photograph its position and therefore have no objective evidence on this point, just as the authority do not have objective evidence in the form of photos that such a PCN was even served or disproving the display of a BB. However, as I have held a BB for ** years, park at this location regularly- indeed my car car be seen in the enclosed GSV dated ***- and would assert at adjudication that my BB was displayed you've got to ask yourself one question. Do you feel lucky? Well, do ya ****.
obviously the ending is optional!
*- there are two parts to the exemption granted to BB holders. The 3-hour limit AND no return within 1 hour. Could the contravention possibly be linked to the second limb?
Thank you for your reply.
She normally parks there between that time [11:30-1:30]and then once she goes, she does not come back until the next day. That's her daily routine.
Can I just confirm, the council have sent the PCN/NTO because of the first 'no waiting' part of the sign isn't it? As a disabled badge holder she can park in 'No Waiting' for up to three hours? Is that right?
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She was not parked during the 'No Loading' times.
This is accepted by the council because otherwise the contravention would have been given as 'parked or loading/unloading where waiting.....'.
So let's shoot this hare even before it gets out of the traps.
The driver says they displayed a BB and 'parking disc' AKA clock which was set to the quarter-hour time of 11.30 which means the driver is declaring that they parked on or after 11.30 but before 11.45.
However, there isn't any objective evidence of this. Neither does there appear to be a photo of a PCN.
Perhaps...
I refer to the NTO dated *** in respect of a PCN allegedly served on my vehicle at ** on ** alleging a contravention of 'parked....'.
The contravention did not occur because at the time I was displaying my BB and clock in the prescribed position as required for no more than 3 hours*. I enclose a copy for your records.
As I did not find a PCN on my car when I returned, I had no reason to photograph its position and therefore have no objective evidence on this point, just as the authority do not have objective evidence in the form of photos that such a PCN was even served or disproving the display of a BB. However, as I have held a BB for ** years, park at this location regularly- indeed my car car be seen in the enclosed GSV dated ***- and would assert at adjudication that my BB was displayed you've got to ask yourself one question. Do you feel lucky? Well, do ya ****.
obviously the ending is optional!
*- there are two parts to the exemption granted to BB holders. The 3-hour limit AND no return within 1 hour. Could the contravention possibly be linked to the second limb?
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Yes sorry have modified my post. Looks like a solid case to make reps with evidence of blue badge and no evidence of PCN served.
I truly appreciate the time you've taken to check and give advice.
Thank you very much
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Yes sorry have modified my post. Looks like a solid case to make reps with evidence of blue badge and no evidence of PCN served.
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These are all the council's pics - no shot of dash so it seems the CEO probably didn't check for a BB, which would have given exemption.
What time did she park there?
(https://i.ibb.co/G7jhbHQ/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-40-06.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/Jr30DbN/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-38-58.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/f4GtkX9/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-38-51.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/DYKcyGH/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-38-38.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/KNsC5tg/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-39-07.png)
She parked from 11:30 am to 1:30 pm
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Please give us a GSV link to the location.
https://www.instantstreetview.com/@53.454472,-2.197896,271.9h,-11p,1.78z,V9TxSQP9UC1k3_Qib0XWTA
The black KIA that's parked there on GSV is her car and that's where she usually parks.
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These are all the council's pics - no shot of dash so it seems the CEO probably didn't check for a BB, which would have given exemption.
No shot of PCN served either and the timing of 13:12 doesn't suggest driveaway if parked til 13:30.
(https://i.ibb.co/G7jhbHQ/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-40-06.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/Jr30DbN/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-38-58.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/f4GtkX9/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-38-51.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/DYKcyGH/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-38-38.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/KNsC5tg/Screenshot-2024-12-15-at-13-39-07.png)
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Please give us a GSV link to the location.
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Hi,
Someone I know has received a Notice to Owner for failing to respond to a PCN for 'Parked in a Restricted Street during Prescribed Hours'.
I am going to help her write an appeal and am wondering if someone can please provide some guidance on this? I would be grateful for any help.
There are a few things:
1] This is the first she is hearing of this as she did not receive the PCN. It wasn't attached to her vehicle. She also did not receive anything in the post.
2] She is a disabled badge holder and:
A] Her disability badge was clearly displayed [as it always is] with her time of arrival [11:30 am] set on the badge clock.
B] She was not parked during the 'No Loading' times.
C] She did not exceed the 3 hour parking time. She parked from 11:30 am to 1:30 pm.
I'm only a bit confused about the 'No Waiting' restriction on the sign. Whether or not it applies to disabled badge holders.
I/she would like that they've made a mistake and they cancel the fine altogether.
But if not then if they can at least re offer the discount because she did not receive the PCN.
Images:
1] NTO. It's unclear. And she's only sent me the first page. I've told her to send me the actual letter. I'll reupload once I have it.
https://imgur.com/a/IDHP4b7
2] A photo of the sign where she had parked.
https://imgur.com/a/pWbEH4M
3] A picture of her disability badge
https://imgur.com/a/DnugARA
Many thanks in advance :)