Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: neverpaying on August 21, 2023, 02:41:13 pm

Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on February 12, 2024, 09:58:32 am
Outcome (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1sNMXTXDU79DbHX41ugCoA9Ei844QtvhY/view).
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on December 19, 2023, 02:15:12 pm
@neverpaying yes, they've not opened the link so we've got them on that.

Honestly I wouldn't faff about with the whole Traffic Enforcement Centre thingy, if you want to send me a letter of authority I can just file an out of time appeal with the tribunal and I can't imagine it would be refused.

I've sent you a PM.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on December 19, 2023, 01:16:42 pm
What a nuisance that is. The council provides an online portal and are able to parrot back to me, by email, the representation I've submitted, but somehow can't email out the NoR as well.

@cp8759 Did we at least catch them with the tracked link in the representation?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: Incandescent on December 18, 2023, 10:41:12 pm
Quote
How should I proceed as the online portal is also warning me that the fee is about to increase to £195.00
Worry not ! Letters from councils are going astray more and more often.

ALl you do is now wait for the Charge Certificate to arrive, (the £195), but do not pay it, and at the end of the period given in it to make payment, after about a week, you phone the Traffic Enforcement Centre, and ask whether the PCN has been registered. When the council register the debt, they will send out an Order for Recovery. However, as you have had one document fail to arrive, you mustn't miss this final OfR stage, so by contacting TEC at weekly intervals, until the PCN is registered, you can then, even if the OfR has not arrived, submit a Statutory Declaration (Form PE3) and the matter will be reset to the Notice to Owner stage, (reps submitted). On the PE3 you tick the box for "submitted reps but got no reply".
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe3-challenge-an-unpaid-penalty-charge-notice

I can hear you saying, "but what if I don't get the Charge Certificate ?". Answer to that is you'll have to contact the council, but if the amount is now showing £195 it would seem they are about to send it out, or have already done so.

It is now plainly obvious that the process relying on Royal Mail 1st Class post is no longer viable with the chaos in Royal Mail. The law needs to be changed urgently to mandate tracked delivery. This would cost the councils slightly more money, but they're making millions already so could afford it.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on December 18, 2023, 02:38:45 pm
I've just now checked the online status and was highly surprised to learn that the council allegedly replied on the 14th of November:

Quote
You have already challenged this PCN and we replied on Tue, 12 Sep 2023. You cannot challenge twice
You have already made representations for this PCN and we replied on Tue, 14 Nov 2023. You cannot make representations twice

I obviously haven't received anything in the post and I haven't received an email either in that time.

How should I proceed as the online portal is also warning me that the fee is about to increase to £195.00
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: Incandescent on December 15, 2023, 07:24:53 pm
+1
Be aware that the 56 days is from when they receive your representations, not the date you send them off.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: John U.K. on December 15, 2023, 07:02:25 pm
What is the online status of the PCN?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on December 15, 2023, 06:24:30 pm
Date of notice (NtO): 17/10/2023
Formal representations submitted: 19/10/2023

56 day period ended on 14/12/2023, which was yesterday and I have still not received a reply from the council.

Are councils still bound by the 56 day rule for parking penalty charges?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on October 19, 2023, 01:24:15 am
I have received the NtO and just now submitted the representations against it.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 25, 2023, 06:46:34 pm
You'll have to wait for the Notice to Owner and then use my draft to make formal representations against that.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 25, 2023, 12:09:27 pm
Where do I submit the representations? I have not received an NtO in the mail and the original site (https://pcnpayment.westminster.gov.uk/pcnonline/step2.php) does not let me challenge twice.

Additionally, it is saying that the penalty is at full rate £130 now. Which would be incorrect based  on "Payment at the reduced rate can be made within 14 days from the date of this letter (12/09/2023)" - so I should have still had until tomorrow to pay the reduced rate for what it's worth.

Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 23, 2023, 04:42:44 pm
Thank you for the draft representation.

If this representation is rejected, do they re-offer the discount? I'm just curious because if they do not re-offer the discount, then proceeding now will be a commital decision and I'd like to know how you would assess the likelihood of the appeal succeeding.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 23, 2023, 11:38:22 am
Draft reps:

Dear City of Westminster,

I challenge liability for PCN WE51358534 on the ground that the alleged contravention did not occur.

I understand why the CEO would have issued the penalty charge, what the CEO could not have known is that at the time I was assisting my mother in alighting the vehicle to a nearby restaurant. Unfortunately my mother suffered a fracture to her foot as a result of a vehicle hitting her in a recent accident, I attach medical evidence of this. Because of this she requires assistance to walk and I could not have left her to make her way to her destination on her own.

I had originally hoped to park next to the restaurant, and before stopping on Litchfield Street I did enter adjacent roads to try and find a parking spot but I didn't find any available parking spaces so I expanded my search further out, turning into any road I could until I gave up and stopped on the double yellow lines on Litchfield Street.

The intention had originally been to go to the Barshu restaurant, but as we were walking there my mother realised that she had forgotten to make a booking. On the spur of the moment a decision was made to go to the Rasa Sayang restaurant instead, which I was familiar with because I had eaten there once before. I quickly escorted her down the road and left her in the restaurant where a friend of hers would join her, and I returned back to my car.

I have uploaded a map illustrating the journey from the car to the restaurant at (link) and as you might imagine my mother was not able to walk at a brisk pace.

In light of the above, at the time my vehicle was stopped for the purposes of assisted alighting which is permitted at this location, it follows that the alleged contravention did not occur and the PCN should be cancelled.

Yours faithfully,

I will PM you a link to put in the representation, it will redirect to imgur.com/nKEeQlu but if you give them the link I'll PM you, we can use the click count to confirm whether they've looked at it or not (obviously do not click on that link yourself as we want the click count to remain at zero). If they don't click on it, we can then prove they've failed to consider all of the evidence. If they say in the rejection that they've considered all the evidence, we've got them for lying as well.

Obviously don't upload the picture to the council website or that would deny us the potential failure to consider.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 22, 2023, 04:54:39 pm
I have created one here: https://i.imgur.com/nKEeQlu.jpg

I have until the 26th to decide what to do with this case [attachimg=1]

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 21, 2023, 12:05:14 am
So that we can get a clear picture of what happened (and bearing in mind we might need to make everything crystal clear to an adjudicator), could you annotate a map showing were you parked and all the various movements up to the point where you returned to the car?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 20, 2023, 12:06:00 pm
"could not be achieved in 6 minutes."

I realise I have made a mistake. The 6 minutes was the difference between the time I took the picture of the road sign and the time the ticket was issued. I came back and saw the ticket very shortly afterwards because I remember thinking I just missed it so probably < 5 minutes. I thought it was time between picture and me seeing the ticket.

Her friend joined her inside the restaurant, my mother called her and I can get a screenshot of that call log if it helps. (Although, my mother is not one for all this fuss and she's already suggested many times that she can just pay the fine herself...)

And to clarify, I didn't wait for her friend to show. I just escorted her inside and she waited at the table and her friend joined her. I'd left them long before and made a, maybe too casual, stroll back to the car.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 18, 2023, 10:09:25 pm
Quickly escorted her down the road and she was joined by her friend and I left them and returned back to my car.
How was this coordinated with the friend? She can't have known in advance to go to Rasa Sayang because it was a spur of the moment decision. On the other hand if the friend just happened to be in the area and there was an exchange of texts / whatsapp messages, you should be able to get screenshots.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: H C Andersen on September 18, 2023, 12:27:03 pm


According to your account, you knew where you were going and everything hangs on why Litchfield, which was over 200m from Barshu(and the other side of Charing Cross Road), when, because of the 24/7 loading restriction in the road outside Barshu, in all probability it would have been clear and you could have parked there.

IMO, the distance belies your concern with and your passenger's claimed physical condition i.e. someone who needs assistance is made to walk at least 200m instead of 5m.

This comes into play again with your claim regarding being away for no longer than 6 minutes. Litchfield-Barshu-Rasa-Litchfield(the first two elements accompanying a person who needed assistance to walk) could not be achieved in 6 minutes. It's simply not credible IMO.

Frankly, I think you need to fess up to misunderstanding the meaning of the signs but perhaps obliquely e.g. after looking for an on-street parking place without success, I parked in Litchfield because it was the nearest street I could find without loading restrictions and escorted *** to Barshu from there.etc...

Then there's the separate strand regarding the lawfulness of the DYL as discussed earlier.








Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 18, 2023, 10:44:21 am
I have found the original restaurant "Barshu Restaurant". My mother had forgotten the name but I think it's this one.

I probably did enter the adjacent roads to this restaurant initially and didn't find any open parking spaces that I could pay to use or use for free so I expanded out further turning into any road I could until I gave up basically and put it in a side road that I thought would be safe enough from parking attendants. It was only on the walk to Barshu that I asked about the reservation and she said they had forgot to make one so we walked over to "Rasa Sayang" instead, which I was familiar with because I had eaten there once before. Quickly escorted her down the road and she was joined by her friend and I left them and returned back to my car.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 18, 2023, 12:38:53 am
IMO, the weakness in your account is that you parked, presumably to go to the adjacent restaurant, but in fact went to a restaurant which was unknown, out of sight, in a different street, not the closest alternative and at least 400m from where you parked. You therefore left the car in contravention for longer than necessary.
Well, we don't really know that.

@neverpaying, why didn't you park closer to the restaurant you were going to?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: H C Andersen on September 17, 2023, 03:09:57 pm
Yes, it is limited.

IMO, the weakness in your account is that you parked, presumably to go to the adjacent restaurant, but in fact went to a restaurant which was unknown, out of sight, in a different street, not the closest alternative and at least 400m from where you parked. You therefore left the car in contravention for longer than necessary.

This is anything but a straightforward assisted alighting case IMO.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 16, 2023, 03:20:10 pm
What should I submit now, even if I intend to take this all the way to the tribunal. And was "H C Andersen" accurate when they said that assisted alighting is a limited exemption? How difficult would it be to convince Westminster Council and/or the adjudicators?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 15, 2023, 11:47:10 pm
As you have a defence in law, the discount is largely irrelevant. I can't think of a single case where someone has claimed the boarding / alighting exemption with credible evidence and has lost.

If it helps, I'd be happy to represent you at the tribunal.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 14, 2023, 02:33:44 pm
No, I wasn't aware of the loading blips until creating this thread.

Regarding appealing this, when do I lose access to the discount? edit: 14 days from letter date so 26/09
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: H C Andersen on September 13, 2023, 03:48:02 pm
Thanks, that's clearer.

You have a receipt which is good.

Another question: do you know that as regards assisted alighting a DYL with loading blips is the same as one without, the loading restrictions only affect loading and those displaying an applicable disabled parking badge, they do not affect assisted alighting or boarding and their presence doesn't affect consideration of an assisted alighting defence.

I say this because there were numerous lengths of street with DYL and loading restrictions which you could have accessed, if you know what the markings mean.

Please try and remember where your target restaurant was, it's important. Assisted alighting is a limited exemption and parking as close as you could and finding the premises unaccessible does not IMO entitle a driver to then wander, I hope I'm not putting this too strong, the streets looking for somewhere else. The car must be moved out of contravention as soon as the permitted purpose has ceased. But this can be examined in closer detail as more of the events unfold.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 13, 2023, 02:22:36 pm

OP, are you the registered keeper of the vehicle with current DVLA keeper details.

As you are claiming an exemption the burden lies with you to prove. But from what I can see you did not provide the authority with any evidence, you simply
claimed the exemption by reference to escorting someone who needed your assistance to a restaurant. To be honest, if all that was needed to escape a PCN for parking on DYL in Westminster was to claim to be assisting a person alight then the city would be awash with them.

We need to see what proof you can provide. To start with, you referred to Rasa Sayang, but GSV shows the nearest one is more than 400m away by foot in Macclesfield St. /Dansey Pl*, were you referring to somewhere else? Also, do you have a receipt from the restaurant for this period and anything to link you to a passenger requiring assistance?

*- and elsewhere in the thread you say that where she finally went was not your first target restaurant which was 'too busy and for which she did not have a reservation'.

I am the registered keeper of the vehicle.

To my representation, I also attached a screenshot of a discharge letter from the doctors that state their findings "a fracture" with the patient's name (sharing surname of mine).

I have forgotten what the first restuarant was but I can find out. I already have a receipt from the restaurant from this period. You're right, it is the one that is a 4 minute walk away from the parking site but as I mentioned, I was circling for some time to find somewhere appropriate to place the car (even paid spots - but those were all taken up as well) as the place is so close to Chinatown, which was incredibly busy at this time. I may have also mentioned but I almost never drive in to central london but the train situation warranted it on this occasion.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: H C Andersen on September 13, 2023, 02:00:43 pm

OP, are you the registered keeper of the vehicle with current DVLA keeper details.

As you are claiming an exemption the burden lies with you to prove. But from what I can see you did not provide the authority with any evidence, you simply
claimed the exemption by reference to escorting someone who needed your assistance to a restaurant. To be honest, if all that was needed to escape a PCN for parking on DYL in Westminster was to claim to be assisting a person alight then the city would be awash with them.

We need to see what proof you can provide. To start with, you referred to Rasa Sayang, but GSV shows the nearest one is more than 400m away by foot in Macclesfield St. /Dansey Pl*, were you referring to somewhere else? Also, do you have a receipt from the restaurant for this period and anything to link you to a passenger requiring assistance?

*- and elsewhere in the thread you say that where she finally went was not your first target restaurant which was 'too busy and for which she did not have a reservation'.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 13, 2023, 01:28:11 pm
Received this email today. Doesn't look like they even considered the representation.

Thank you for your correspondence regarding the above Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) we apologise for the delay in our response.

I have carried out a review of your case and considered all of the information you provided but, on this occasion, I am unable to cancel the PCN.

The following 2 options are now available:
Option 1 - Payment at the reduced rate can be made within 14 days from the date of this letter:
... [payment options listed]

Option 2 - Make a Formal Representation
If you have not paid before the end of the period of 28 days, beginning with the date of service of the PCN, we will issue a Notice to Owner (NtO) to the registered keeper of the vehicle. The NtO will allow the registered keeper to make fullpayment or a Formal Representation, appealing against the issue of the PCN; the procedure for doing so will be explained on the NtO. Any new evidence can be presented with the formal Representation.

We will consider any representations, even where we have previously concluded that the evidence does not merit cancellation of the PCN. If we reject the formal representation, the keeper will be able to appeal to an independent parking adjudicator, who will be able to consider whether the motorist's case falls within any of the statutory grounds for appeal. It is not possible to appeal to a parking adjudicator without going through the process of making a formal representation to the local authority.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on September 04, 2023, 11:51:23 pm
Well the parking rules explicitly allow parking in these circumstances, so you're not asking them to make any sort of exception, but you've put in the key facts so even if they reject, we can sort this out later on.

In the meantime, make sure to keep hold of any medical evidence about the injury please.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on September 01, 2023, 01:47:19 pm
I will submit this end of day. My 14 day period runs out on Sunday and I will not be available over the weekend
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 31, 2023, 01:33:16 pm
Draft:

I am writing to formally appeal against the Parking Charge Notice issued to my vehicle on the 20/08/2023 with PCN Number WE51358534. I believe that there are extenuating circumstances that should be taken into consideration in this case.

On the aforementioned date, I found myself in a situation where I needed to park my vehicle temporarily on a double yellow line on Litchfield Street. The reason for this was to provide assistance in escorting an injured person, who was traveling in my vehicle, to a nearby restaurant "Rasa Sayang". The injured individual has a fractured foot as a result of a recent collision with a vehicle as a pedestrian.

Given the lack of available parking spaces in close proximity, and after circling for some time to find a free parking spot, I made the decision to park on the double yellow lines to ensure the injured person's safety and well-being whilst walking to this restaurant, otherwise aided only by crutches. Once I had assisted the injured person, I immediately returned to my vehicle, after no longer than 6 minutes had passed (based on the date of a photo I took of the road sign to remember where I had parked).

I understand the importance of adhering to parking regulations, but I firmly believe that the circumstances in this case warrant an exception.

I kindly request that you review my representation and take these exceptional circumstances into account when considering this appeal. I am more than willing to provide any additional information or documentation that may be required to substantiate my claim. Moreover, I am fully committed to complying with parking regulations under normal circumstances and will continue to do so in the future.

I trust in your understanding and fairness in evaluating this appeal. I look forward to your response regarding the outcome of this representation. Please notify me of your decision at your earliest convenience.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on August 30, 2023, 11:28:36 pm
Ok then, I will just try to give them the truth and hope for the best.
No, type up a draft and put it on here first please.

This is a legal argument, you're not appealing to their goodwill.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 30, 2023, 11:42:52 am
Ok then, I will just try to give them the truth and hope for the best.

The restaurant was one nearby but she did not have a reservation and it was too busy so we went a little further out, but still within 3 mins walk from the car.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on August 29, 2023, 11:52:37 pm
Well the signage is inadequate because the yellow lines extend too far, but given that your car was also parked in the restricted area that is probably a moot point.

Any medical evidence to support the claim will suffice, as long as it was reasonably necessary for the person who was alighting being assisted to the nearby premises. Which restaurant were you taking her to?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 29, 2023, 09:57:51 pm
She is not a blue badge holder but she has been using crutches due to a personal injury some months ago. I would be able to source doctor's notes or other proofs of the injury if it would be useful. I looked up the eligibility of a BB and I'm not sure that a fractured foot will suffice.

Which signage are we claiming is inadequate? I assume if we go with the assisted alighting route (apologies I didn't know what this was earlier) we aren't also bundling in the other defences.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on August 29, 2023, 07:43:28 pm
We can still claim the signage is inadequate, which is true.

Does your mother have a blue badge, or would she be eligible for one if she applied? Although blue badges are not valid in Westminster, being a BB holder can support the need for assisted alighting, which frankly sounds like your strongest ground.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: Incandescent on August 29, 2023, 11:29:06 am
Quote
As for why I parked there, there were severe delays on the underground at the time so I drove to drop my mother off at a restaurant. I quickly escorted her there because she was using crutches to walk.
Pity you didn't tell us this earlier, because you could have claimed the board/alight passengers exemption - assisted exemption.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 29, 2023, 11:14:36 am
That's a great find

I checked it and I think my car was parked in the section I've marked below:

(https://i.imgur.com/M3x8Dt1.jpeg)

Which I think would put me at least partially in the restricted area of the traffic order even if we were to subtract 2 metres west of the boundary wall (dashed line). Can we still proceed with this line of defence? I would be happy to get measurements if so.

As for why I parked there, there were severe delays on the underground at the time so I drove to drop my mother off at a restaurant. I quickly escorted her there because she was using crutches to walk.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on August 28, 2023, 05:52:03 pm
On the photographic evidence the contravention appears made out:

(https://i.imgur.com/dDSyMn7.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/cwAczVt.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/VaA5bvu.jpg)

However there is something very strange going on with the traffic orders. The City of Westminster (Waiting and Loading Restriction) (Consolidation No. 1) Order 2011 (https://www.westminstertransportationservices.co.uk/limey/common/pages/download.php?file=SnVzdFMwbWVUM3h0TDJodmJXVXZkek56ZEcxcGJuTjBaWEowY3k5d2RXSnNhV05mYUhSdGJDOTBiVzh2Wm1sc1pYTXZZMjl1YzI5c2FXUmhkR1ZrTDNkaGFYUnBibWRmYkc5aFpHbHVaeTV3WkdZPQ%3D%3D) creates a restriction on page 300 (item 271) which is replaced by item 271 on pages 7 and 8 of The City of Westminster (Waiting and Loading Restriction) (Amendment No. 282) Order 2017 (https://www.westminstertransportationservices.co.uk/limey/common/pages/download.php?file=SnVzdFMwbWVUM3h0TDJodmJXVXZkek56ZEcxcGJuTjBaWEowY3k5d2RXSnNhV05mYUhSdGJDOTBiVzh2Wm1sc1pYTXZWME5ESURJd01UY2dUbTh1SURFMk9TNXdaR1k9):

(https://i.imgur.com/6PqyxvA.png)

Number 26 is Adelphoi Music (https://goo.gl/maps/hHasS7eBD9dMxu8e8) and number 27 is Souk (https://goo.gl/maps/kK8XYiFTUceae8b98), so it seems reasonable to assume that number 28 is the property to the east of Souk (google suggests number 28 is on the other side of the road, but I think that's just wrong). This means there is a length of yellow line not backed by a waiting restriction:

(https://i.imgur.com/6dwPndQ.png)

I think you car was parked within this section, so it appears that no contravention occurred. Would you be able to go back and get us some more accurate measurements? Ideally we'd want the distance from the party wall of numbers 27 and 28, up to the "meter" manhole cover seen behind your car.

Also, why did you park there?
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 28, 2023, 04:54:28 pm
I've scanned it in now and uploaded the unredacted picture here:

(https://i.imgur.com/ln3ED7Q.jpeg)

I apologise about the faded text on the PCN, that's how it was given to me and the scanner has had a hard time picking up all the words. Though, I have copied the text into the original post.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: cp8759 on August 27, 2023, 01:23:06 pm
As per the guidance here https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/ please post the PCN with no redactions, or just give us the PCN number and number plate.
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: John U.K. on August 22, 2023, 04:35:04 pm
Quote
There was no dropped kerb on that street if this is what you meant by kerb blips.

Kerb blips indicate restrictions on loading. Double blips = No loading 24/7
Single blips = No Loading in times on signs.

These are kerb blips
https://goo.gl/maps/t2zLMfHH4gq3L7pTA

And as they are single, rather than double, here is the sign that governs them
https://goo.gl/maps/CgbV8iiJv8iwkRPBA

ON the other side the single blips stop just east of this sign outside Sushimania
https://goo.gl/maps/rrtAuQMyqAU42nkA6
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 22, 2023, 04:24:18 pm
As an ex resident of Westminster I can assure you that their CEOs hunt in packs.

On the face of it you are bang to rights.

The only exemption would be for loading or assisted alighting (if there are no kerb blips to go with the double yellow lines).

Mike

There was no dropped kerb on that street if this is what you meant by kerb blips.

Regarding the exemption for loading, what would that entail?

Also, here's the Google Street View of the road: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5127672,-0.1283898,3a,75y,85.82h,83.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sGKKX8ca9WhmjQJRYfo3osQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
Title: Re: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: guest17 on August 21, 2023, 03:07:52 pm
As an ex resident of Westminster I can assure you that their CEOs hunt in packs.

On the face of it you are bang to rights.

The only exemption would be for loading or assisted alighting (if there are no kerb blips to go with the double yellow lines).

Mike
Title: Litchfield Street, parked on double yellow - City of Westminster
Post by: neverpaying on August 21, 2023, 02:41:13 pm
I was given a gift yesterday under my windshield wiper for being parked on Litchfield Street on a double yellow line. Quite unfortunate given I was only gone for 6 minutes after having thought "They don't really check every street every time do they?", I guess they do.

PCN is attached to this post but the important, hopefully prejudicial, parts of the text are also below. Thank you for reading.

Quote

City of Westminster
Penalty Charge Notice Traffie Management Act 2004
PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE NUMBER: ...
Date of service of this notice: 20/08/2023
Vehicle Registration Number: ...
Was seen at location:
Litchfield Street [61]
At: 20:30 on: 20/08/2023
By Civil Enforcement officer WS6697 who believed that the following parking contravention had been committed and that a penalty charge is therefore payable: Code 01
Parked in restricted street during prescribed hours

Full Amount of the Penalty Charge : £130
The penalty charge must be paid not later than the last day of the period of 28 days beginning with the date on which this penalty charge notice was served ('the 28 day period )

A reduced charge of £65 is payable
If the penalty charge is paid not later than the last day of the period of 14 Days beginning with the date on which this notice is served ('the reduced charge period'), the penalty charge will be reduced by 50%. If the penalty charge is not paid within the reduced charge period, the full amount of the penalty charge is payable

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PLEASE DO NOT MAKE PAYMENT IF YOU WANT TO CHALLENGE THIS PCN

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Overleaf:
Quote
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If the penality charge is not paid within the period of 28 days beginning with the date on which the alleged contravention occurred, the City of Westminster, the enforcement authority, may serve a Notice to to Owner on the owner of the vehicle. A person on whom a Notice to Owner is served will be entitled to make representations to the enforcement authority against the penalty charge and may appeal to an independent adjudicator if those representations are rejected.
If we receive representations before a Notice to Owner is served, those representations will be considered. If however a Notice to Owner is served notwithstanding those representation, then representations against the penalty charge must be made in the form and manner and at the time specified in the Notice to Owner.
If we receive representations against the penalty charge not later than the last day of the period of 14 days beginning with the date on which the Penalty Charge Notice is served but do not accept the challenge, we will issue a rejection letter to the person who made the representations and in will allow a further 14 days from the date the rejection letter is issued which to pay the reduced penalty charge.
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Off-topic: I've posted it here on these forums because while looking for similar PCNs on Pepipoo, I saw someone mention that the forum is shutting down in November. That's quite sad but is the reason I've posted this thread here. If I should post on both, please let me know and I will do so. Thank you.

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