Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: gge12 on December 10, 2024, 10:53:02 am
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Quashing order here (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fRD1dJx-UU_fMluGwH6Gu75e0YchvWlG/view).
As the outcome was unknown at the time of the council's submissions, their hand was weak but I don't think we can say it was wholly unreasonable.
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29th May :(
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The quashing order was made on 4 June, so you need to contact the Administrative Court Officer and get a copy of that. If the council response came before 4 June you can't really blame them for arguing the point, if their response to the tribunal came after 4 June then it's Wednesbury unreasonable and you can go after them for costs.
But you really must get a copy of the quashing order, you wouldn't want to just use a press clipping.
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@Hippocrates it would be really entertaining to see the council's response to the adjournment notice.
@cp8759 Indeed. I will phone the member to get permission. It was rubbish, actually, and shows they were not in touch with reality.
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@Hippocrates it would be really entertaining to see the council's response to the adjournment notice.
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The Lord Brown references (mentioned at least twice) also featured in the ETA Chief Adjudicator's Annual Report 2023-2024 and bear out the clear message in the SoS's Stat Guidance: c**p NORs by incompetent staff which simply recite received wisdom which might have at best tangential bearing on an owner's substantive argument (AKA 'Principal Important Controversial Issues')are simply not acceptable.
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Outcome (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1BgdzAF_eChsWK0SrLXw1W3VD6HSEJ-5C/view).
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Allowed. ;D 2250132285
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Adjourned because of this:
https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/West-Dulwich-Action-Group-v-London-Borough-of-Lambeth.pdf
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4ge92xldrjo
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Just accessed the site today. Appeal already filed and threat to increase to £195 very soon!
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Sorry only just seen your reply. The appeal process was delayed because my wife is the registered keeper and had to provide permission for me to appeal. Finally received the rejection today:
https://imgur.com/a/Jy92CT8
They didn't address the points in my appeal regarding the incorrect dates provided for paying the discount charge. Am planning to appeal to the E&TA if anyone could assist please?
Yes. I will be more than happy to do so. I will PM you my details shortly. Do nothing please until we speak.
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They didn't address the points in my appeal regarding the incorrect dates provided for paying the discount charge. Am planning to appeal to the E&TA if anyone could assist please?
Did you appeal using exactly @Hippocrates draft in Reply#10 ?
If so there is a total (but not unexpected) failure to consider.
Yes, to the letter.
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They didn't address the points in my appeal regarding the incorrect dates provided for paying the discount charge. Am planning to appeal to the E&TA if anyone could assist please?
Did you appeal using exactly @Hippocrates draft in Reply#10 ?
If so there is a total (but not unexpected) failure to consider.
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Sorry only just seen your reply. The appeal process was delayed because my wife is the registered keeper and had to provide permission for me to appeal. Finally received the rejection today:
https://imgur.com/a/Jy92CT8
They didn't address the points in my appeal regarding the incorrect dates provided for paying the discount charge. Am planning to appeal to the E&TA if anyone could assist please?
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Hi again, are Lambeth allowed to still request payment when representation has been submitted?
After initially being warned that I had until Dec 29th to pay the discounted rate, I am now being told it will increase to the higher rate 'very soon' despite still not receiving a response to my representation submitted nearly a month ago!
https://imgur.com/a/Y9IcR3i
How did you get on with this? Successful appeal?
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Nope. Just keep everything with screenshots of the dates.
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Hi again, are Lambeth allowed to still request payment when representation has been submitted?
After initially being warned that I had until Dec 29th to pay the discounted rate, I am now being told it will increase to the higher rate 'very soon' despite still not receiving a response to my representation submitted nearly a month ago!
https://imgur.com/a/Y9IcR3i
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Update. Despite having submitted representation, I am still being urged to 'pay £65 now'!
https://imgur.com/a/MulNUXM
Urged? Threatened rather. Save it for later.
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Update. Despite having submitted representation, I am still being urged to 'pay £65 now'!
https://imgur.com/a/MulNUXM
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Thank you, however the date of the notice was definitely December 2nd:
https://imgur.com/a/W4LELWg
Have now submitted reps as advised above.
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Or is this standard practice across all the London boroughs?
No it is not. Your comments re the dates are in general ok. But:
1. 14 days discount starts with the date so expired on 4th December.
2. They can only serve a charge certificate 28 days from the date of service ( 25th November) = 22nd December.
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Choose penalty exceeded amount and put this in a pdf.
Dear Lambeth
Please cancel the PCN as your website is not fit for purpose due to the clear disconnects between the law and what is stated therein. All your dates are wrong in terms of payment and the enclosed screenshot is an example of bullying.
In light of this collateral challenge, the PCN must be cancelled. It is incumbent upon an authority to give clear and precise states re payments etc and these must be according to the statutory process.
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The amount outstanding on the Charge Notice will increase to £130.00 on Sun, 29 Dec 2024.
"will" is a clear fettering of discretion.
as Incandescent says, @Hippocrates delights in these cases.
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Or is this standard practice across all the London boroughs?
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There is a discrepancy between what is stated on the PCN I received in the post and and what is stated online. According to the letter, I have 14 days from the date of the notice (02.12.24) to pay the discounted rate of £65. Furthermore, the penalty charge must be paid before the end of the period of 28 days from this date. This suggests that after 14 days you pay the full charge of £130 but either way you must pay before the period of 28 days. It does not state which, if any, penalties exist for not paying during this time frame.
When you view the PCN on Lambeth's website, it says The amount outstanding on the Charge Notice will increase to £130.00 on Sun, 29 Dec 2024. Please pay £65.00 now. This is different as it suggests you have 28 days to pay the discounted rate and an undeterminable period in which to pay the full charge. This is confusing and misleading, especially as the PCN letter directs you to the website to view, challenge or pay the charge.
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Thanks, in the fifth and final picture I uploaded there is a screenshot from the Lambeth website which states that I have until Dec 29th to pay the discounted rate.
Ah, right, an error on their website, so carry on with your case ! If anybody can win this for you it'll be Hippocrates. I suspect when they see him on the case their hearts (of stone) get even heavier !
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https://imgur.com/a/BWsUMRd
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Please show the screenshot. I won a case on this a few months ago for a fellow member.
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Thanks, in the fifth and final picture I uploaded there is a screenshot from the Lambeth website which states that I have until Dec 29th to pay the discounted rate.
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anyone?
So which dates do you think are wrong, because there are no dates which I can see apart from the PCN date and date of alleged contravention ?
Anyway, here is the controlling legislation under which the PCN has been issued, so have a read
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/contents/enacted
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anyone?
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Don't have much defence for the fact I drove through here but suspect the dates of increased charges may be wrong if anyone could clarify:
https://imgur.com/a/W4LELWg