Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: Mr H on December 09, 2024, 10:48:55 pm
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Thanks for clarifying where the two bus lane signs are, I thought I was just being dense. Unfortunately, I saw them at the time and indicated to move into the right hand lane but there was another car there, so couldn't do it safely which then meant that I caught by the camera. I suppose I thought that if there had been a sign indicating a bus lane (as there is at those crossroads from the other direction) I would have been forewarned and not gone into the bus lane in the first place. I still think I have a case but it's very slim and just not worth the risk.
Oh well, you live and learn.
Thanks for your time in helping me and others, really appreciate it.
Best wishes
Ian
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But there are two bus lane signs, and here they are: -
https://maps.app.goo.gl/NHzWBiM2ejv6EBbm8
The camera is beyond those two signs, so you passed both of them without apparently noticing. This is why I didn't think your case was strong. Of course you have the legal right to test the matter at adjudication with the full PCN penalty in play.
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Hi Incandescant and RoytheBus
FYI - Here is the outcome of my appeal.
I received a rejection of my appeal from Brighton & Hove CC, see letter below
https://imgur.com/sTHYWmC
https://imgur.com/8lJxN4B
Are you able to explain this as I don't really understand it, as they seem to be saying that it is correctly signed with 2 blue signs whereas the photos I gave as evidence have none. I also added a photo (to my appeal) approaching the crossroads from the opposite direction where there is a bus lane sign https://maps.app.goo.gl/gjghE41YNTxfk4v78
As much as I would like to appeal further, I think I will have to pay now as I don't want to risk the fine doubling.
Thanking you both and anyone else in advance.
Best wishes
Ian
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Best if you submit a challenge based on no sign at the traffic lights indicating a bus lane. They will normally re-offer the discount if you submit within the discount period. Post-up their response when you get it.
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Thanks roythebus. I was distracted because I was driving somewhere unfamiliar so didn’t know I was turning into a bus lane and felt I couldn’t move out because of the white car on my right hand side.
How long does it take for an appeal to be considered? I don’t want to have to pay double if it takes ages and I lose.
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Hve a look at TSRGD (traffic signs regulations and directions) it would appear the lines just beyond the junction don't comply and despite there being a bus lane sign close to the junction a lot of drivers could easily miss it just after turning. But as Incandescent says, you had gone quite a distance long the bus lane. What distracted you?
I reckon it's worth a challenge.
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Thank you to both roythebus and Incandescant for your comments.
Please find the video of the road layout and drive that I recorded at the weekend.
(https://i.imgur.com/HtOcQ3W.mp4)
Here is the video evidence recorded by the camera as well.
(https://i.imgur.com/pM5DLID.mp4)
Thank you to anyone who can advise/help, much appreciated.
Mr H
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To be fair, the council camera is positioned some distance along the bus lane, not at its start. There is a clear Bus Lane sign, (two in fact), yet you carried on in the bus lane for the whole distance seen in the video.
So whilst I agree, there should really be a sign at the right turn by the last set of traffic lights, an adjudicator could consider there to be sufficient signage. On the other hand, he could agree with you that not having and advance sign means they have not met their duties under LATOR Regulation 18, but it would not be a slam-dunk win in my opinion.
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Well there seems to be no statutory signs informing anybody they are truning right onto a bus lane until they have actually done so. Noting before you turn right to inform you. No doubt someone will be along soon with further information, but this I reckon is easily winnable for lack of signage.
If you could post the video it would be helpful.
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Hi FTLA team
Travelling West along the A27 in error, I took the slip road A270 Lewes Road as I needed to go East along the A27. This enabled me to turn right along Stony Mere Way very briefly (under the A27) and then right again onto the slip road leading back on to the A27.
Having gone under the A27 and turning right, I kept to the left hand side not realising that it was a bus lane. As soon as I realised that it was a bus lane, I looked in my mirror to see if it was safe to move into the right hand lane but there was a car there, so I couldn't. This is captured on video.
I admit that I was in the bus lane but it seems unfair there was no advance notice of this until I was actually in the lane, so I wondered if this was grounds for challenge/appeal.
PNC
(https://i.imgur.com/7PqUBK9.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ag10wMb.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/gFhoHFj.jpg)
Maps
https://maps.app.goo.gl/RB6QSEbtQEK5q6ar5 (traffic lights at end of slip road off A27)
https://maps.app.goo.gl/gbP3x6snh2AUK7Cc9 (turning right onto Stony Mere Way going under A27)
https://maps.app.goo.gl/i73GfwRRuUN3byhe8 (traffic lights showing one lane, about to turn right)
https://maps.app.goo.gl/UawmXjAM4FsDrKhJA (turning right onto slip road from one lane into two, showing bus lane)
I also have a video illustrating the journey if needs be.
Thank you for any help or advice.
Mr H