Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: stickit2theman on August 15, 2023, 02:24:19 pm
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just paid it, probs not worth it for the sake of 25 beans thanks anyway tho :)
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If we'd been able to craft the formal representations we could have done something creative, but in the circumstances the only arguable ground is that the PCN gives the timelines from the date of service rather than the date of the contravention, see the decision in Branislav Baca v Portsmouth City Council (PO00033-2309, 17 November 2023) (https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1HLgXkoFeKSPDT1k09A_jPyaybFvP98ac) on this point.
However we've only got one TPT case decided on that point, and I'm not sure I'd risk the extra £25 on that alone as another adjudicator could take a different view.
It's down to you whether you want to risk double or nothing at the tribunal, if you want to carry on I'm happy to represent you.
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I haven't got a copy of the response I sent Cause I did it on a work computer and wev moved offices.. the basic points I argued tho are mentioned earlier
here's the rest of the Rejection
https://ibb.co/dkkCdJs
https://ibb.co/M63bznJ
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Please post up a copy of your representation, and all pages of the notice of rejection.
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oops yeah should have probably done that.. will post the rest when i get home
you can now see the sign picture as well as in my last post as it hadn't posted..
is there any grounds for culling this on the fact that "parked beyond" is written on the PCN ticket and the sign says nothing of the sort??
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Why did you make representations before posting the NTO here? we could have checked it for errors
Still we are where we are, The council in their rejection defend parked in a restricted area not parked beyond bay markings post it all and lest see what we can offer
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update: rejected appeal, I based my appeal on 2 points stating that - "wholly" is not synonymous with "beyond" and the PCN should have been code 81 parked in a restricted area of the car park
They have ignored my point on code 81 completely... also called where i was parked a hatched bay with white markings?? looks like a restricted area of the car park to me and its yellow.
the sign says (86) not parked correctly within a bay or space
link to pic of rejection letter
https://ibb.co/SN30HfK
link to pic of the sign as requested
https://ibb.co/wd36gyc
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The deadline for the NTO is 6 months from the date of service of the PCN.
Indeed it is, but the Statutory Guidance has something to say on this: -
Issuing the notice to owner
If the penalty charge is not paid the enforcement authority may issue a notice to owner (NtO). The purpose of this is to ensure that the PCN was received by the vehicle owner and to remind the vehicle owner that the payment in full is now due and, if it is not paid within a further 28 days, it may be increased.
The NtO may be issued 28 days after serving the penalty charge, and we expect authorities to send them within 56 days. The ultimate time limit, in exceptional circumstances, is 6 months [footnote 33] from the ‘relevant date’. There should be a very good reason for waiting that long to serve an NtO. The regulations set out the information that the NtO must [footnote 34] give.
There are different requirements when the penalty charge notice acts as the NtO - see the section in this guidance on ‘Enforcement using approved devices’).
Authorities must [footnote 35] specify on the NtO (or the PCN when served by post) the statutory grounds on which representations may be made. Where a photograph or other camera evidence shows that the parking contravention took place, authorities should send this with the NtO as it should help to prevent unfounded representations.
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For later: The South Gloucestershire Council (Off Street Parking Places) Order 2022 (https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1xWZGtpRqbvXGtX6hrsT3Vrc_IcEyY2Kj).
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The deadline for the NTO is 6 months from the date of service of the PCN.
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Hi yes I will do that... I did fire in an unofficial challenge through the site but didnt hear anything or even get a conformation email. Does the NTO have to come within a certain time frame?? its been just over a month now since the ticket
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The images of the signage on the council website are in too low a resolution, are you able to go back and get us some photos of the signage?
As the discount is gone it' now a no-brainer to wait for the Notice to Owner.
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any joy??
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sure LN59YCA
GS50553106
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Please give us the PCN number and the number plate, there's a couple of things I'd like to check.
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bump. any other views from anyone or how i could word a challenge to this??
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thanks for your reply :) so the crux of this is the TRO says "wholly" and the ticket in contrast says "beyond" and i should challenge based on this??
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Parked beyond...is perfectly OK as grounds for how you were parked.
But whether the traffic order specifies that vehicles must be parked wholly with bay markings would only be revealed once the order has been checked.
Articles 3(1) and 7(1) and column 3 of page 6 would suggest vehicles must..
https://tro.trafficpenaltytribunal.gov.uk/TRO/South%20Gloucestershire/X2221CopyOrderpdf-V1-carparks.pdf
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my bad, thought its Sunday and there wont be any ticket men around and I wouldn't be causing any harm for an hr... got pinched.
but shouldn't it be code 81: parked in a restricted area in carpark?? or are 86 and 81 interchangeable and it can be either
(https://i.ibb.co/fCjbFtQ/parking-1.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/SwYBsgD/20230814-122854.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/VDBDbPN/20230814-122909.jpg)
cheers for any help