Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: privates on November 11, 2024, 10:39:21 pm

Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: b789 on February 03, 2025, 12:12:55 pm
So, are you saying that the appeal we suggested you send to Horizon was either never sent or sent to the wrong email address?

If you've missed out on your opportunity to have this appealed at POPLA, then you will just have to wait it out until a county court clam arrives and deal with it then.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: mickR on February 03, 2025, 12:25:35 am
If you were the driver of the vehicle at the time, please confirm your full name and full postal address and we can then respond to your query.

DO NOT DO THAT.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on February 03, 2025, 12:09:41 am
For heavens sake... a telephone conversation is not worth the paper it isn't written on! You must get everything in writing. You should email them and demand that they provide a copy of the email they say they sent on 9/12/24 and to include all the headers in order to prove that it was sent and to the correct email address.

In fact, just SAR Horizon. In the SAR point out that a simple copy of any email they claim to have sent to you must include the headers as evidence of having been sent.

Is this true or are you simply paraphrasing?

Quote
"She stated that it is a PoFA account and I have to name a driver. She said there is nothing I can do but speak to the enforcement agents at this point".

Their NtK is definitely NOT PoFA compliant and there is absolutely NO legal obligation on the Keeper to name the driver. I certainly hope you didn't blab the drivers identity by saying things like "I did this or that" instead of "The driver did this or that".

And have you checked your junk folder as advised a while ago?

I did check my junk folder and this is there reply to my email.. apparently I must of made a typo when appealing

Thank you for your email.

 

Please be advised the email above does not match with the email on the appeals form.

 

For your own data protection, please understand that we can only correspond with the driver or registered keeper of a vehicle concerned with a Parking Charge.

 

If it assists you, we can accept correspondence from a third party on behalf of the driver or registered keeper, but only when prior written authorisation has been provided by the driver or registered keeper of the vehicle concerned. This can be handwritten and sent to us as a PDF or an image.

 

If you were the driver of the vehicle at the time, please confirm your full name and full postal address and we can then respond to your query.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: b789 on January 28, 2025, 11:59:20 am
For heavens sake... a telephone conversation is not worth the paper it isn't written on! You must get everything in writing. You should email them and demand that they provide a copy of the email they say they sent on 9/12/24 and to include all the headers in order to prove that it was sent and to the correct email address.

In fact, just SAR Horizon. In the SAR point out that a simple copy of any email they claim to have sent to you must include the headers as evidence of having been sent.

Is this true or are you simply paraphrasing?

Quote
"She stated that it is a PoFA account and I have to name a driver. She said there is nothing I can do but speak to the enforcement agents at this point".

Their NtK is definitely NOT PoFA compliant and there is absolutely NO legal obligation on the Keeper to name the driver. I certainly hope you didn't blab the drivers identity by saying things like "I did this or that" instead of "The driver did this or that".

And have you checked your junk folder as advised a while ago?
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on January 28, 2025, 11:20:04 am
How did you appeal? Did you chase up when you didn't receive a response within the time lines indicated in the Code of Practice? If not, get in touch and ask why they have not responded.

(And a perhaps obvious point, but check your spam folder if you haven't already)

I just spoke to them on the phone and they have stated a reply was sent 09/12/2024 to my email but I haven't received any reply. She stated that it is a PoFA account and I have to name a driver. She said there is nothing I can do but speak to the enforcement agents at this point. She gave me the admin email for me to email them and ask for a copy of the rejection
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: DWMB2 on January 08, 2025, 11:03:44 pm
How did you appeal? Did you chase up when you didn't receive a response within the time lines indicated in the Code of Practice? If not, get in touch and ask why they have not responded.

(And a perhaps obvious point, but check your spam folder if you haven't already)
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on January 08, 2025, 10:15:31 pm
they'll reject anyway, but you may as well have a bit of fun at their expense whilst getting your POPLA code.

I've received a debt recovery letter but no response to the appeal. What do I need to do in this circumstance?

https://ibb.co/72xDyc2
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: b789 on December 05, 2024, 12:28:49 pm
they'll reject anyway, but you may as well have a bit of fun at their expense whilst getting your POPLA code.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on December 05, 2024, 12:10:17 pm
Here is a suggested appeal to Horizon. It is derisory because because of their intellectual malnourishment by insisting to issue PCNs that consistently fail to fully comply with ALL the requirements of PoFA:

Quote
Subject: Appeal of Parking Charge Notice (PCN) – Reference [PCN Reference Number]

Dear Horizon Parking Appeals Team,

I am writing to appeal the Parking Charge Notice issued on [Date] as the registered keeper of the vehicle [Vehicle Registration].

Your Notice to Keeper (NtK) purports to comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA), yet fails to meet its requirements. The fact that Horizon claim PoFA compliance while drafting a notice that blatantly fails to meet the basic requirements of the Act only serves to highlight a case of severe intellectual malnourishment by whoever is responsible for the wording.

Allow me to point out to you why your NtK does not meet the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(f) of Schedule 4 of PoFA:

Your NtK states Keeper liability arises 28 days from the second working day after the date of the Parking Charge. This is wrong. Paragraph 9(2)(f) of PoFA specifies:

"...the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given."

Let’s break it down into manageable chunks for you:

• Parking Charge Date: 18th October 2024.
• Notice Given Date: 25th October 2024 (two working days after the issue date, as per your own wording).
• PoFA-Compliant Start Date: 26th October 2024.
• Correct Deadline: 22nd November 2024.

By using an earlier start date of 22nd October 2024, your NtK is therefore non-compliant.

As the registered keeper, I am under no legal obligation to identify the driver to Horizon, an unregulated private parking company. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable unless strict compliance with PoFA is achieved, which, as outlined above, it is not.

Your NtK cannot hold me liable as the Keeper. As Horizon cannot hold me liable, if there was any competence in the ranks of Horizon's appeals team, you’d already know that.

If you are struggling to understand why the NtK fails to comply with PoFA, might I suggest passing this appeal to someone at Horizon who possesses the intellectual capacity to grasp basic legal requirements? Assuming such a person exists, they may be able to save you from further embarrassment by cancelling this Parking Charge now.

Horizon's non-compliance with PoFA means this charge would fail at POPLA. I strongly urge you to save us both the time and effort by cancelling this Parking Charge immediately.

If you persist in this futile attempt to hold me liable, I require a detailed response addressing these points, along with a POPLA code so that I can have this non-PoFA compliant PCN formally overturned.

Thank you for your time
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: b789 on December 04, 2024, 06:26:30 pm
Here is a suggested appeal to Horizon. It is derisory because because of their intellectual malnourishment by insisting to issue PCNs that consistently fail to fully comply with ALL the requirements of PoFA:

Quote
Subject: Appeal of Parking Charge Notice (PCN) – Reference [PCN Reference Number]

Dear Horizon Parking Appeals Team,

I am writing to appeal the Parking Charge Notice issued on [Date] as the registered keeper of the vehicle [Vehicle Registration].

Your Notice to Keeper (NtK) purports to comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA), yet fails to meet its requirements. The fact that Horizon claim PoFA compliance while drafting a notice that blatantly fails to meet the basic requirements of the Act only serves to highlight a case of severe intellectual malnourishment by whoever is responsible for the wording.

Allow me to point out to you why your NtK does not meet the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(f) of Schedule 4 of PoFA:

Your NtK states Keeper liability arises 28 days from the second working day after the date of the Parking Charge. This is wrong. Paragraph 9(2)(f) of PoFA specifies:

"...the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given."

Let’s break it down into manageable chunks for you:

• Parking Charge Date: 18th October 2024.
• Notice Given Date: 25th October 2024 (two working days after the issue date, as per your own wording).
• PoFA-Compliant Start Date: 26th October 2024.
• Correct Deadline: 22nd November 2024.

By using an earlier start date of 22nd October 2024, your NtK is therefore non-compliant.

As the registered keeper, I am under no legal obligation to identify the driver to Horizon, an unregulated private parking company. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable unless strict compliance with PoFA is achieved, which, as outlined above, it is not.

Your NtK cannot hold me liable as the Keeper. As Horizon cannot hold me liable, if there was any competence in the ranks of Horizon's appeals team, you’d already know that.

If you are struggling to understand why the NtK fails to comply with PoFA, might I suggest passing this appeal to someone at Horizon who possesses the intellectual capacity to grasp basic legal requirements? Assuming such a person exists, they may be able to save you from further embarrassment by cancelling this Parking Charge now.

Horizon's non-compliance with PoFA means this charge would fail at POPLA. I strongly urge you to save us both the time and effort by cancelling this Parking Charge immediately.

If you persist in this futile attempt to hold me liable, I require a detailed response addressing these points, along with a POPLA code so that I can have this non-PoFA compliant PCN formally overturned.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: DWMB2 on December 04, 2024, 03:24:15 pm
If nobody beats me to it I can try and draft you something up this evening.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on December 04, 2024, 02:58:25 pm
Any luck with the above?
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on November 24, 2024, 09:51:10 pm
We also need to see the back of that Notice to Keeper (NtK). Until we've see it, the most likely appeal will be as as the Keeper of the vehicle and there being no keeper liability because their NtK is not fully compliant with all the requirements of PoFA, they can go swivel on a sharp stick.

However, until we've seen the back, don't do anything else,

Here is the back of the NTO :

https://ibb.co/pQNdf8D

thank you for your time.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: b789 on November 19, 2024, 12:42:10 pm
We also need to see the back of that Notice to Keeper (NtK). Until we've see it, the most likely appeal will be as as the Keeper of the vehicle and there being no keeper liability because their NtK is not fully compliant with all the requirements of PoFA, they can go swivel on a sharp stick.

However, until we've seen the back, don't do anything else,
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on November 18, 2024, 10:52:24 pm
PCN : https://ibb.co/Cv9Kz0h

GSV : https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5279189,-0.2696171,3a,75y,160.43h,89.28t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sk0cY7ewQQF6vkg0Yow4IAA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D0.7199999999999989%26panoid%3Dk0cY7ewQQF6vkg0Yow4IAA%26yaw%3D160.43!7i13312!8i6656?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI0MTExMy4xIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

I was aware of the issue but as this is quite a industrial area there isn't much safer then here to park to check on it. I had the vehicle full valeted and unfortunately some water had caused electrical issues where the steering column wasn't fully functioning (no indicators)

Also that link isn't working unfortunately.
Title: Re: Horizon Parking
Post by: DWMB2 on November 11, 2024, 10:44:54 pm
I've removed that attachment, you left the VRM and PCN number showing.

I know this isn't your first rodeo on the forum, but do please take another look at the following thread: READ THIS FIRST - Private Parking Charges Forum guide (http://READ THIS FIRST - Private Parking Charges Forum guide) and provide as much of the information it asks for as you can. The more info you provide, the better advice we can give.

Was the driver aware of the vehicle fault when they entered the private car park?
Title: Horizon Parking
Post by: privates on November 11, 2024, 10:39:21 pm
What grounds can I appeal this PCN under?

My vehicle had a electrical issue in this area, I had parked there for a couple hours trying to figure it out. Two days after AA also visited the vehicle in this car park.

Which appeal can I put through?