Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: booyaka on November 03, 2024, 04:07:53 pm
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OP, you were there, we weren't.
Loading is an exemption, not a request for a favour or mitigation or extenuating circumstances. It's as if the yellow line was not there.
IMO, you need to convey your conviction that you qualify for this exemption to us, in this way we can find the right short, sharp form of words and legal references that would apply.
Their references to location and other places to park etc. are b******s, but you do need to consider their point regarding 10 minutes' continuous observation. Setting aside whether this is true(as observed by other posters) how did the process work when you were moving the furniture?
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I live around the corner from Langdale Road.
FYI Greenwich issue visitor's permits online, on the same website as you got your residents permit. [Although in this instance loading is an exempt activity]
The letter from your flatmate is a bit weak and too verbose to my mind. It simply needed to confirm he was assisting you load heavy or unwieldly furniture and, importantly, specifying the date and time. These details are missing.
Also there is no such road as Ashburnham Road. There is an Ashburnham Grove & Ashburnham Place. Neither are realistic alternatives to the place parked, due to distance and as both would have been subject to the same parking restrictions. So why mention it at all?
However, usefully, there IS free parking on Greenwich South St. in front of St Mark's Church on Sunday. [Keep that quiet!]
The next challenge & appeal needs to be done by the Keeper not OP.
Include in the formal challenge/appeal that there was no benefit in parking illegally given the availability of free parking nearby; adding weight to the defence that you were parked in contravention only whilst - and because of - loading. Which took no more than 15-20 minutes.
Others may disagree, but I would get another version of the supporting letter, with date and time. Keeping the details of the furniture and flights of stairs.
Ask for the CEO's notes, to put the 10 minute observation to the test.
I note, from address of rejection, that Greenwich have out-sourced parking to Northampton. No doubt to to a PCN churning facility, so expect to have to take this to the tribunal.
I would suggest that this is a probable win at Tribunal, as it is a he said/she said situation, and you have evidence of moving.
But await other advice.
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Yes I did include a letter from my housemate. https://imgur.com/VNvkvi0
Here is my challenge:
I am writing to appeal a parking ticket issued to my vehicle on 13/10/2024 while it was temporarily parked on a single yellow line outside my home at 4a Langdale Road. I am a resident permit holder for the CPZ and typically park within the designated bays on this road.
On this occasion, I was in the process of moving house and parked briefly on the single yellow line to load a wardrobe and other heavy items into my van. The wardrobe had to be carried down three flights of stairs, which required the assistance of my housemate. We completed the loading as quickly as possible. I have attached a statement from my housemate confirming this.
I have also included a copy of my rental contract to verify that I was indeed moving house.
Given the extenuating circumstances and my commitment to usually parking in permitted bays, I kindly request that you consider canceling this penalty. I resumed standard parking arrangements as soon as the loading was finished.
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Yes I did include a letter from my housemate. I have attached a copy of it.
This was my challenge:
I am writing to appeal a parking ticket issued to my vehicle on 13/10/2024 while it was temporarily parked on a single yellow line outside my home at [removed]. I am a resident permit holder for the CPZ and typically park within the designated bays on this road.
On this occasion, I was in the process of moving house and parked briefly on the single yellow line to load a wardrobe and other heavy items into my van. The wardrobe had to be carried down three flights of stairs, which required the assistance of my housemate. We completed the loading as quickly as possible. I have attached a statement from my housemate confirming this.
I have also included a copy of my rental contract to verify that I was indeed moving house.
Given the extenuating circumstances and my commitment to usually parking in permitted bays, I kindly request that you consider canceling this penalty. I resumed standard parking arrangements as soon as the loading was finished.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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You need to post your challenge.
Did you include a note from housemate?
As I said they claiming you left the van for 10 mins unattended.
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It says there is no action for me to take until the owner receives a Notice to Owner.
How likely do you think it is that this will be discontinued? I am considering just paying up.
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Have you got your challenge?
They have dredged up 10 mins continuous observation from the CEO which seems unlikely as few would wait that long before issuing.
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Greenwich council have come back with this. What would you advise I do next? Thanks
(https://i.imgur.com/nyhw1Th.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Z1yROf6.jpeg)
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.
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Ok great, I will draft a challenge tomorrow. I have not already challenged it.
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That the van is in the family is good news as you may get a rejection at informal stage.
Get a brief signed statement from your housemate about assistance and draft a challenge to put to Greenwich that details how you were in the process of loading from leaving the van to returning.
Note you are/were a permit holder. I presume you had to park near and no spaces were available.
But the PCN is dated 13 October - have you already challenged?
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The registered keeper is a family member. I am a named driver. My housemate was helping me move the wardrobe.
The registered keeper has full responsibility for paying or appealing a PCN; who was driving the vehicle at the time is irrelevant. However, the registered keeper can authorise a person to act for them in submitting representations or attending at an adjudication, (personally or by phone). If, however, the case is lost, the registered keeper is responsible for payment.
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The registered keeper is a family member. I am a named driver. My housemate was helping me move the wardrobe.
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Who is the registered keeper of the van?
Your only chance is to claim the loading exemption. A rental contract is good evidence.
Were you carrying the wardrobe on your own?
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It's not a hire van. I can provide proof of moving house with my renting contract. The rental start date is the same date as the PCN.
Or could I contest saying the vehicle was not parked for more than 10 minutes?
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Is it a hire van?
To challenge this on loading you'll need to get evidence of moving, hire etc. to try and get cancellation at first stage.
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I was carrying a wardrobe down two flights of stairs when the when the CEO saw nothing going on.
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Loading is an exemption but you have to be in the process of loading.
No observation time on PCN which helps you.
So what was going on when the CEO saw nothing going on?
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The driver was parked on a single yellow line outside their house. They were parked there so they could load into the van as they were moving house. They have a permit and would usually park in one of the bays on the road.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/pGex6YevdQuivifa8
(https://i.imgur.com/ekeBF7A.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/3SGbUK0.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/zUikYWT.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/dpxbEFB.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/EX0sYNZ.png)
Thank you.