Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Speeding and other criminal offences => Topic started by: Milky Way1 on October 22, 2024, 10:24:19 pm
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Hello, I received 1, yes, cannot remember when...
Can you remember at all if you would have received it within 14 days of the original speeding offence?
If you can't remember, do you know or recall when you responed to it?
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"...with the evidence etc.."
Evidence of what?
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BY the way I got another NIP yesterday..1.4 sec Red camera at New X! I was just on the amber probably...well another one to deal with ..BIG SIGH
Sorry, the cameras don't activate on amber. If you were captured 1.4 seconds into the red, that would have been about 4.4 seconds after the lights changed to amber.
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Hello, I received 1, yes, cannot remember when...He received 2 so total between us 3..
But we have sent the plea by post yesterday, with the evidence etc..
BY the way I got another NIP yesterday..1.4 sec Red camera at New X! I was just on the amber probably...well another one to deal with ..BIG SIGH
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No, I am Reg keeper
So when you suggested earlier that your husband had received and had responded to two NIPs, was the first one actually addressed to you?
I'm trying to understand whether the two of you received a total of three NIPs or just one each.
And as RichardW has asked, if you are the RK, what date did you receive your NIP?
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OK, did you receive original NIP dated within 14 days?
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No, I am Reg keeper
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If husband is the reg keeper then he has a defence as 1st NIP apparently not served within 14 days.
Possibly.
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If husband is the reg keeper then he has a defence as 1st NIP apparently not served within 14 days.
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Pleased (VERY) but also shocking u-turn after all the grief caused to many people, safety, flooding, FoIs, risk assessment, publicity, whatnot...just revert to the original limit?! Cynical at best, in my view.
You missed out a couple of bits:
- There had been a number of serious accidents on the eastbound carriageway (one involving a fatality) which were almost certainly caused by vehicles aquaplaning on standing water that had accumulated due to serious drainage defects.
- The road has experienced two complete weekend closures (the latest being August Bank Holiday) and two or three overnight closures to effect the modifications that were necessary to cure the flooding problem.
But back to your husband's problem. He should respond to the SJPN by pleading guilty. In the "mitigating circumstances" section he should respectfully ask the court to consider sentencing him at the fixed penalty level. He might want to mention why he responded so late to the NIP - or he might not. If he is not the Registered Keeper and his NIP arrived after a delay it would be certainly worth mentioning. If his response was late simply because of his own negligence it might not (though in that case the court would be less likely to accede to his request).
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He may be pleased to learn that the stretch is reverting to National Speed Limit (70mph) at the end of this month.
Pleased (VERY) but also shocking u-turn after all the grief caused to many people, safety, flooding, FoIs, risk assessment, publicity, whatnot...just revert to the original limit?! Cynical at best, in my view.
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Dear all, thank you for all your invaluable advice and help:-) I am truly grateful.
I never knew about this gold mine of citizen solidarity and brain power. I might become a frequent question contributor:-), or volunteer for such a role.
We called the called police - the sjp is because all was received late, they said just reply and seek foxed penalty consideration, and any other mitigating circumstances.
Thank you again!
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PS> I tried to attach the file but sayss the folder is full
Presumably you’ve not read this (https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/posting-images/).
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Does the SJPN list just speeding?
Yes, just 1 offence ' speed exceeding 40mphr'.
Where I find the ticket office number?
PS> I tried to attach the file but sayss the folder is full
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The offence was 22/4/24 so around 3 months after the 1st NIP received.
1st NIP 09/07 = replied 18/07 - they sent the copy in the documents. We keep the copy too.
2nd NIP (final reminder) 16/08 = replied 26/08, stamped as received by the met 10/09/24
Charged 14/10/2024
In the witness statement of the Camera Processing Caseworker says: 'I am unable to provide any technical evidence concerning the original offence. In the event you wish to challenge you should request the attendance of a police officer.'
They included a couple of photographs from Safe Zone Siemens citing relevant info, speed, distance etc. Hence I thought of calibration, but I think you very kindly answered it.
I'm unsure of the best approach here.
Thank you
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Does the SJPN list just speeding?
As far as your questions go:
- Is 46 mph within the allowable threshold, given the 10% + 2 mph tolerance rule?
Dealt with above.
- Should we request the calibration certificate to confirm the speed reading's accuracy and consider contesting it?
Does he believe it is inaccurate? Or is he just considering "fishing"? In any case he hasn't got much time to consider it as the SJPN must be responded to in 21 days.
That stretch is covered by an average speed system. There is no speed measurement as such. A camera takes a photo at the beginning and end. The elapsed time between the two is used, together with the known distance to calculate the average speed. There is little to go wrong.
- Could the decision to issue an SJP instead of a fixed penalty offer be influenced by his German driving licence, and what
would be the best way to proceed in this case?
It could be influenced by the fact that they may not have received his initial response (hence my first question). Why did he respond twice? But other than that who knows? He could try ringing the ticket office to find out why he was not offered either a course or FP (that would also answer my first question). If he finds out he could then explain that to the court if he decides to ask to be sentenced at the FP equivalent.
He may be pleased to learn that the stretch is reverting to National Speed Limit (70mph) at the end of this month.
EDIT: I've just noticed the dates thanks to the above answer. That would certainly have an influence over how the offence would be dealt with, especially if no satisfactory response was received until late August.
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Does the SJPN list just speeding?
As far as your questions go:
- Is 46 mph within the allowable threshold, given the 10% + 2 mph tolerance rule?
Dealt with above.
- Should we request the calibration certificate to confirm the speed reading's accuracy and consider contesting it?
Does he believe it is inaccurate? Or is he just considering "fishing"? In any case he hasn't got much time to consider it as the SJPN must be responded to in 21 days.
That stretch is covered by an average speed system. There is no speed measurement as such. A camera takes a photo at the beginning and end. The elapsed time between the two is used, together with the known distance to calculate the average speed. There is little to go wrong.
- Could the decision to issue an SJP instead of a fixed penalty offer be influenced by his German driving licence, and what
would be the best way to proceed in this case?
It could be influenced by the fact that they may not have received his initial response (hence my first question). Why did he respond twice? But other than that who knows? He could try ringing the ticket office to find out why he was not offered either a course or FP (that would also answer my first question).
He may be pleased to learn that the stretch is reverting to National Speed Limit (70mph) at the end of this month.
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I am still not sure why they decided to go to the Court and not offer a fixed penalty, unless they are up for a trick.
Nothing of the sort. We don't know the reason for the tardiness of the S.172 forms or why it was sent twice. But that tardiness meant it was far too late for a course, and even the offer of a fixed penalty ran the risk of timing out. So they went straight for the SJP.
Do you have any advice for us? Would the calibration certificate be useful?
As advised, ask to be sentenced at the fixed penalty rate, giving reasons. Forget calibration certificates. Are you suggesting the speed was less than 40?
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Do you have any advice for us?
Based on what?
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He is over the threshold for enforcement since it starts at 46. It would be counted as 46 even if 46.99 mph as figures are always rounded down, not to the nearest number. How long was it following the offence was the NIP sent?
He may well be able to ask for the sentencing to be in line with the fixed penalty level.
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Thank you.
He replied to NIP twice because it was received twice. It wasn't apparent to us that he sent it off twice, until they sent copies alongside SJP.
So really he is right on the threshold @46mph. I am still not sure why they decided to go to the Court and not offer a fixed penalty, unless they are up for a trick.
Do you have any advice for us? Would the calibration certificate be useful?
Thank you in advance.
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Send three and fourpence, we're going to a dance!
How/why did your husband respond to the NIP twice?
There is no 10% +2mph "tolerance". The guidelines, which are only guidelines (but are followed quite strictly) are that enforcement starts at 10% +2mph.
Since Brexit, EU licence holders can drive in the UK until they are 70 or 3 years from when they became resident, whichever is sooner. Not entirely sure when this started (Brexit seems to have been somewhat of a moveable feast) or what the transitional arrangements were (e.g. whether on day 1 all EU licence holders who had been resident for more than 3 years were no longer licensed, or what)
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Dear Forum,
I would appreciate your advice regarding my husband's SJP (received 15/10/24 for driving 46 mph in a 40 mph zone on the A20 Sidcup Bypass, where a temporary 40 mph limit was introduced in early 2024. There was a lot of controversy around fines on this road earlier in the year. This offence relates to 22/4/24. Despite responding to the NIP twice (dated 09/07/24 and 20/08/24) and accepting responsibility as the driver, he has now received an SJP. He holds a German driving licence, which he has not changed in 30 years and has no prior endorsements.
My questions are:
- Is 46 mph within the allowable threshold, given the 10% + 2 mph tolerance rule?
- Should we request the calibration certificate to confirm the speed reading's accuracy and consider contesting it?
- Could the decision to issue an SJP instead of a fixed penalty offer be influenced by his German driving licence, and what
would be the best way to proceed in this case?
Many thanks for your help and insights.