Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: sledge1uk on October 15, 2024, 12:28:25 am

Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: cp8759 on November 29, 2024, 11:27:15 pm: For future reference:

The Borough of Slough (Various Roads) Bus Lane Order 2020 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/14Od8Z_u8xvlpaAHIEfDcbvnOPt-JSiJe/view)
The Borough of Slough (A4 Section 3 Cippenham Lane to Twinches Lane) Bus Lane Order 2022 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/19X_pYQ2_JclyPcQ0x1-VrhPV7gzciRVI/view)
The Borough of Slough (A4 Section 4 Twinches Lane to Farnham Road) Bus Lane Order 2022 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ulv08gMxX_co1liSss2MjnnTAtpYED3H/view)
The Borough of Slough (A4 Section 5 Farnham Road to High Street Slough) Bus Lane Order 2022 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hE9NaAoIDX2uOAPoDLgDJmrDaKXpUoZ3/view)
The Borough of Slough (A4 Section 6 Wellington Street to Sussex Place) Bus Lane Order 2022 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Irqg_Mv23gI4-kJW050770hnS1j_JOXP/view)
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: Hippocrates on November 24, 2024, 11:30:05 pm: Sound move. Take it on the chin and add it to life's tapestry.
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 24, 2024, 07:39:14 pm: Sadly I paid the £35 which may have been a mistake as maybe misunderstood the process as I have no real defence for going into the bus lane as its clearly signed.

On Pepepoo I won at Tribunal a bus lane PCN on Wellington Road at the Sainsburys approach as I copied somebodies temolate who had won based on a lot of research he did on camera distances and positioning from the traffic light so it was clear cut. I can no longer access Peepepoo site to check and cant find anything on this site for a similar case so its a Gamble.

if I go through the tribunal appeal process I pay £25+ Vat and am £5 up if I win

If I loose the Tribunal appeal TPT states "The PCN will need to be paid in full if your appeal to us is unsuccessful." so assume that's £70 and out of pocket by £35
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: John U.K. on November 18, 2024, 02:56:45 pm: As per post Reply#2 above, attachments are not advised.

Please, have a read of
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/

and use Imgur or ibb.co. to post images here.
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 18, 2024, 02:47:37 pm: page 1 and 5

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 18, 2024, 02:26:05 pm: Re earlier post in case their wording is flawed on the Slough Notice of rejection

Here are all 6 pages based on my challenge one liner "The alleged bus lane contravention did not occur." where item 2 cont and item 5 will be sent separately as not sure if I can post all 3 and dont understand that URL method.

Where is the link to delete attachments and edit posts?

Cheers P

Review ADD on to post
have just sent it but only I attachment shows (191KB) but states 2 attachments send ????? at the bottom and this post and has a review option which I have just hit and the attachments are gone. Just added attachment 1 191KB and 2 141KB again[attach=1]

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 17, 2024, 06:43:08 pm: Just received the Slough Notice of Rejection of representation and appears I can only sent 1 attachment so here is the info provided
Notice of rejection date 13/11/2024
PCN Number SB41783836
Vehicle Registration Mark SE07XKX
PIN Code 87K424
Car

Logged onto the TPT site as a test case to familiar my self with the process and selected "The alleged bus lane contravention did not occur." and got as far as the second attachment and need guidance on the input.

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 10, 2024, 09:57:36 am: Remembered and Done

Appeal complete
Thank you for submitting an appeal. A member of the parking team will review your appeal and contact you with the outcome shortly
An email containing a summary of your appeal has been sent to the address you provided
Thank you for this information. We will look at the details you have given us and will contact you shortly
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 05, 2024, 11:32:23 am: just looked at Slough form to use NONE OF THE ABOVE and use the last Option "Any Other Reason" and insert "The Cointervention did not exist"

" Being in a bus lane

We will consider your challenge / representation according to our parking policy. If your reason for appeal is not listed in the policy, we are unlikely to accept it. However we will still consider your case individually.

Bus lane reasons
These are the common reasons relating to bus lanes which we receive queries for

Select a reason:
I am a Blue Badge holder and I was looking for disabled parking
I did not realise I was in a bus lane
I entered the bus lane to avoid congestion
I stopped in the bus lane due to my medical condition
I was avoiding an accident
I was following a diversion / was directed into the bus lane
I was following my sat-nav / I was lost / I'm not from the area
I was in the bus lane, but it wasn't in operation at the time
I was in the bus lane, but not for a substantial distance
I was making way for an emergency vehicle
I was picking up / dropping off a passenger
I was taking advice from others
I was unaware of the rules
I was unaware that couriers were not permitted in the bus lane
I was unfamiliar with the term "Bus Gate"
My vehicle is a taxi
My vehicle type is permitted to drive in bus lanes
There was a road closure so the bus lane was not in operation
There was nowhere to turn around and avoid the bus gate
There were no buses in the bus lane at the time
Other reasons
Non bus lane specific reasons that will appear in Bus Lane context

Select a reason:
A friend / family member recently passed away
I didn't see / understand the signage
I have already paid the PCN
I was not at the location on the day
I was not the driver
I was not the owner / keeper of the vehicle
I was unaware that a PCN had been issued as I've been away
My vehicle had broken down
My vehicle was cloned
My vehicle was stolen
The owner of the vehicle has passed away
The vehicle was on hire to someone else
None of the above
If none of the above reasons apply, and you wish to challenge your PCN, please select below:

Select a reason:
Any other reasonn ANY OTHER REASON
"
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: Hippocrates on November 04, 2024, 08:46:42 pm: 10th
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on November 04, 2024, 11:57:13 am: ]The make and model of the bus lane enforcement camera on Wellington Street as shown in your Google maps link is:

Make - TES Small Blue Enforcement CCTV Camera

Model - Blue Gen2

Thanks for that and does that mean the camera is non Compliant as a challenge if it gets to the tribunal stage?

Can you please clarify the day I have to make representation.

Date of Notice sent 10/10/2024 which was a Thursday+2 working days =14 Oct +28days = 11 Nov deadline.

Any reason not to do it now with " The contravention did not exist" before I forget.

Thanks Sledge
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: cp8759 on November 02, 2024, 10:02:22 am: For later, I've just got this back from the council:

The make and model of the bus lane enforcement camera on Wellington Street as shown in your Google maps link is:

Make - TES Small Blue Enforcement CCTV Camera

Model - Blue Gen2
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: Hippocrates on November 01, 2024, 10:34:13 am: +1. There is no 20 metre rule. It is a myth - and one London adjudicator and I had a discussion about this some months ago.
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: Incandescent on October 31, 2024, 10:52:17 pm: Quote from: sledge1uk on October 31, 2024, 08:22:40 pm
Hi I just came across this and need to measure back and assume this 20m starts as soon as the passenger wheel crosses the outer bus lane line .

"Given that the most common complaint among drivers is that they moved to the left slightly too early in order to turn left, the most significant ground for appealing a bus lane fine is that drivers are permitted 20 metres of grace – approximately five car lengths. So if the supplied photographic and (in some cases) video evidence does not show the car travelling more than 20 metres in the bus lane, there are good grounds for an adjudicator to throw out the PCN."

Anybody used this and won.
I've seen this 20 metre "rule" quoted a few times, but it is not in any regulations, and just an indication of what could be an appeal based on de minimis. No adjudicator is bound by any 20 metre rule, as there isn't one.
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on October 31, 2024, 08:22:40 pm: Hi I just came across this and need to measure back and assume this 20m starts as soon as the passenger wheel crosses the outer bus lane line .

"Given that the most common complaint among drivers is that they moved to the left slightly too early in order to turn left, the most significant ground for appealing a bus lane fine is that drivers are permitted 20 metres of grace – approximately five car lengths. So if the supplied photographic and (in some cases) video evidence does not show the car travelling more than 20 metres in the bus lane, there are good grounds for an adjudicator to throw out the PCN."

Anybody used this and won.

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on October 30, 2024, 08:49:19 pm: Not familiar with this site.

Has anybody got a challenge template similar to this PCN wording /signage etc which I can use to edit and submit and what day do I need to submit it
Cheers Paul
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: Hippocrates on October 30, 2024, 08:04:25 pm: sledge: I have sent you a PM.
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: cp8759 on October 29, 2024, 07:19:42 pm: (https://i.imgur.com/6mLvvKs.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7gPf3Iq.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/wLyDvcH.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/n6Pizyv.jpeg)

Video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVR5d9jZENU

@sledge1uk any particular reason you cut into the bus lane?

The original TRO is The Borough of Slough (Various Roads) Bus Lane Order 2020 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/14Od8Z_u8xvlpaAHIEfDcbvnOPt-JSiJe/view) but it's obviously been amended to reduce the hours of operation of the bus lane to peak times only.
Title: Re: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: Incandescent on October 15, 2024, 12:44:56 am: Please read this and update your thread as necessary: -
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/
If you're posting documents, redact only name and address, and use a hosting site to post them, because space on this forum is very limited.

We will need to see the video, their sole evidence of the allegation.
Title: Slough Wellington St Bus lane PCN
Post by: sledge1uk on October 15, 2024, 12:28:25 am: Just received a Slough Wellington St bus Lane PCN. The PCN video link shows me entering the bus lane just before the bus lane ends where the road marking arrow points left. Need to get both sides of the original PCN to screen shoot it to reduce its size then post it here as the one I had forwarded to me is too large to post here.

I am the registered Keeper but the log book address given is about 8 miles away as spend a lot of time overseas and have got back to the UK for a few nasty surprises like PCNs