Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: acrylicus on August 17, 2024, 01:36:12 am
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How has identifying the driver suddenly morphed a criminal offence under those bylaws into a contractual dispute.
How can a driver enter into a contract to commit a criminal act in exchange for payment?
I must be missing something.
There is no criminal act. The keeper has not received a Penalty Notice under airport bylaws. All the keeper received was an invoice from a private company for an alleged breach of contract by the driver under civil law.
Reading between the lines here... I screwed up, its too late, bend over and pay the fine?
It is up to you. There are always reasons to dispute the invoice. Do you always simply pay invoices from any private individual or private business?
As shown above, unless the latest contract between VCS and Bristol Airport is any different from the previous contract then the driver was stopped in a location where VCS do not have any right to issue PCNs.
I am trying to source an up to date contract. The previous contract did not show authority fr
lowing from the landowner to VCS. Their contract was with the landowners agent.
The invoice is for a breach of "contract". How can there be any "contract" if there is no consideration? A prohibitive sign does not form any "contract" by conduct or otherwise.
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Were you parked beyond the area VCS have potential rights on. Your pin is beyond the roundabout where their contract stops.
It is possible of course it is included in the replacement contract.
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Reading between the lines here... I screwed up, its too late, bend over and pay the fine?
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How has identifying the driver suddenly morphed a criminal offence under those bylaws into a contractual dispute.
How can a driver enter into a contract to commit a criminal act in exchange for payment?
I must be missing something.
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But the bylaws are not being applied. Had the keeper not identified the driver, the standard appeal would have explained it to the intellectually malnourished scammers at VCS that they had no case, even though they will take it as far as a claim in the county court, in the hope that the keeper is low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree and eventually capitulate once it reached the litigation stage.
What the keeper should have appealed is as follows, simple and self explanatory, putting VCS on notice that they are not dealing with the likes of the majority of their victims who fund the scam:
I am the registered keeper. VCS cannot hold a registered keeper liable for any alleged contravention on land that is under statutory control. As a matter of fact and law, VCS will be well aware that they cannot use the PoFA provisions because Bristol Airport is not 'relevant land'.
If Bristol Airport wanted to hold owners or keepers liable under Airport Byelaws, that would be within the landowner's gift and another matter entirely. However, not only is that not pleaded, it is also not legally possible because VCS is not the Airport owner and your 'parking charge' is not and never attempts to be a penalty. It is created for VCS's own profit (as opposed to a byelaws penalty that goes to the public purse) and VCS has relied on contract law allegations of breach against the driver only.
The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation of the law of agency. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable. VCS have no hope at POPLA, so you are urged to save us both a complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
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In the bylaws:-
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6.2 Parking in time restricted areas
leave or park a vehicle or cause it to wait for a period in excess of the permitted
time in an area where the period of waiting is restricted by notice.
6.3 Parking in prohibited areas
wait leave or park a vehicle where waiting or parking is prohibited by notic
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Also under penalties:-
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3.4 any other byelaws shall not exceed level 3 on the standard scale
in each case as the standard scale has effect from time to time by virtue either
of Section 37 (2) of the Criminal Justice Act 1982 or of an order under section
143 of the Magistrates’ Courts Act 1980.
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I think this covers the offence (*bylaws)
It looks like op turned left leaving the drop off car park (that area down there used to be a staff car park). It looks covered by the VCS contract IF op was not beyond the roundabout (their pin is).
But it seems very unlikely it is not covered by the airport bylaws (easy find on line).
Unfortunately I have never been able to find a map of the area covered. It's not in the bylaws or described therein.
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Here is a page from VCSs contract with Bristol Airport that shows the area they are authorised to issue PCNs. This copy of the contract expired on 6th January 2023. They would be required to provide a copy of the latest contract if they were to try and take this to court.
(https://i.imgur.com/l4HKPeR.jpeg)
Compare that with your map location:
(https://i.imgur.com/Viuay2g.jpeg)
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Here is the exact location
https://maps.app.goo.gl/aNy7KUB6CAe6YBqm7
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Please show the exact location on a satellite map, not GSV, so that we can compare the location with VCSs contract with the airport.
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Here is the NTK (with PPI redacted)
https://imgur.com/a/ZgeVeFc
I stopped here:
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3881896,-2.715025,3a,75y,74.49h,77.83t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sYn8miUgn0RU119SlPtH0sg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DYn8miUgn0RU119SlPtH0sg%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D14.6192875%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656?coh=205409&entry=ttu
This is what they have submitted as their evidence (as-well as a bunch of PDFs of their signs)
https://imgur.com/a/a0K5lYB
I really didnt see any signs from the exit of the car-park to the location I stopped. The sign they highlighted is facing the other way (Yes I stopped on the wrong side of the road lol...)
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What a pity you had not discovered this site before you blundered into their trap. In future, the keeper must not, ever, ever, ever, EVER, identify the driver. There is no legal obligation to do so to an unregulated private parking company.
All you had to do in your initial appeal was tell VCS to go rotate on a sharp stick as the land is under statutory control which means that they cannot hold the known keeper liable for the unknown drivers alleged breach of contract.
There is no “fine” or “penalty” because no “offence” has been committed and VCS are no “authority” of any kind. They are simply a private company of ex clamper thugs. However, the known keeper has identified the unknown driver who is now known.
Your appeal to the IAS is a wasted effort. They are not going to uphold your appeal. You have identified as the driver and they will hold you liable.
The only way you are going to resolve this is at the ultimate dispute resolution service… the small claims track at the county court where the only truly independent arbiter, a judge, will decide whether you owe VCS a debt.
For now, show us on a Google map satellite view EXACTLY where the vehicle was stopped. There is a slight possibility that the location is outside of VCSs area of control. Please show us the NtK that was received. We will try and pick through it for any technical failures but having identified the driver is the equivalent of of shooting your self in both feet.
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Are you prepared to await a court claim where, if you lose, it will be a bit over £200. (There will no CCJ provided it is paid in time after judgement) ?
Arbitration is a mediation as an alternative to a hearing to try and find settlement. You are risking more than £100 by then.
The charge is against the driver, you have owned up to who the driver is so that option is gone unfortunately.
Currently I assume they are asking for £100 and haven't offered the discount again.
Will a judge, with a properly crafted defence, decide that was an adequate reason. There will be many views but is 60 or 100 V 220 or zero (and you need time to attend etc).
There is a possibility that the land is subject to airport bylaws, in which case a properly crafted defence should win because this is not an appropriate remedy.
If you are minded to pursue it then copies of the notices and details of the exact location (slightly awkward with Google maps being out of date with all the building work going on). There is a helpful thread with detail of how to post the pictures and street view link if you need a little help.
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I was issued a parking fine by VCS for stopping on an access road just outside the short-stay parking exit at Bristol Airport. I had paid for parking already, and only stopped to fetch a bottle of milk from the boot for my infant son who had just woken up as we left the car-park. I handed the bottle of milk to my wife who was sitting in the back passenger seat next to my sons car seat.
I appealed this, and this was their response:
https://imgur.com/a/RqvSTbT
Which is false, so I took it to IAS.
My initial appeal:
After going to the airport to pick up my father in law, I parked my car and paid the £8 parking fee. Upon leaving the car park, my infant son woke up and began crying as he had not had his milk due to napping on the long drive to the airport.
This incident occurred moments after me leaving the car-park. I stopped for a moment to get the milk out of the boot of the car.
I chose a road to stop on that had no 'no stopping' signs visible. It was far away from the terminal, and posed no safety issues as it was a very quiet road.
Given I have paid for the parking, and only stopped due to a crying infant, in an area with no safety concerns and far away from the terminal - I believe this is fair grounds to levy a dismissal of the fine I have been issued.
Their denial states: "A review of our CCTV evidence has confirmed that on the date in question, your vehicle stopped to collect a passenger on the access road where restrictions apply". This is wholly a lie. If they had truly reviewed the CCTV footage they would see I got out the car to get a bottle for my son.
I have attached my bank statement showing the £8 paid parking fee, which shows the payment as processed on the 15 July (The actual payment was the 13th, but as this was a weekend it shows as processed on the 15th).
The no-stopping areas surrounding the terminal are to stop people from avoiding the drop-off/pickup fees. I paid the fees.
They have outright lied on their appeal denial, I paid for parking, and I only stopped to manage my infant son.
Their response:
1. Bristol Airport and all its approach roads are private land which motorists are allowed to enter provided that they agree to the Terms and Conditions of use. There are 81 signs on site, at the entrance and throughout the roadways, which state ‘No Stopping' or ‘No Drop Off or Pick up'. The entrance signage clearly states motorists will become liable for a charge of £100 if they contravene these Terms and Conditions.
2. Site photographs supplied confirm the signs can clearly be observed and the entrances and throughout the site. The adjudicator will note that the VCS signage onsite, including its wording and positioning has been audited by the IPC, has passed audit, complies with the IPC Code of Practice and is deemed fit for purpose.
3. Airports are by their very nature, sensitive, high risk security areas, which are always on a high level security alert status. Given the sensitive security issues at airport sites it is not unusual to prohibit stopping of any kind on all the approach roads.
4. A no stopping zone has been introduced on the airport approach roads and, due to growing congestion caused by vehicles stopping and blocking lanes. The subsequent congestion has created safety risks for other motorists and potential costly delays for emergency vehicles responding to incidents at the Airport. This CN was issued in respect of a vehicle stopping on a private road running alongside a busy international airport. Any vehicles obstructing the roads, no matter for how long can cause serious problems for airport traffic, including cargo and emergency vehicles. Vehicle Control Services (VCS) Ltd patrol, manage and enforce on the access roads and bus stops, where stopping is not permitted and seek to do so by making motorists aware of the requirements with signs.
5. The CCTV stills supplied show that the vehicle stopped on an access road which is designated by the landowner as a restricted area, where stopping is prohibited at all times for unauthorised purposes.
6. A review of the footage we possess shows the appellant's vehicle stationary when first observed, remaining stationary for approx. 20 seconds before driving away. During this time, the driver is seen outside of the vehicle, the passenger door (which was open at the start of the footage) is closed and the driver then re-enters the vehicle. We are unable to supply the CCTV footage due to GDPR as other vehicles are visible, however appellant does not dispute that they stopped and exited their vehicle in this location.
7. The circumstances cited by the appellant do not warrant grounds for the cancellation of this charge. It is a motorist's sole responsibility to ensure they are prepared for their onward journey before beginning their journey, particularly if they are exiting a car park onto a restricted area where stopping for any reason is prohibited. The appellant denies that they stopped to pick up a passenger and while the footage does not show that a passenger entered the vehicle, the passenger door was open. Regardless, the charge was not issued for picking up a passenger but for stopping in the restricted area. Whether the appellant stopped to tend to their child or to pick a passenger up, they had no cause to believe they were authorised to do so.
8. The appellant states “The intention of the no-stop here i believe is to stop people from avoiding the pickup/drop-off charge”. We can confirm the signage on site clearly states “No Stopping” and makes clear that stopping for any reason, not solely for pick up/drop off purposes is prohibited.
9. The contract between the appellant and VCS was formed when the motorist entered the site. When entering this private land, a motorist freely enters into an agreement to abide by the conditions advertised in return for permission to enter. It is the motorist's responsibility to ensure that they abide by any clearly displayed terms and conditions. It is clear that the terms and conditions stated ‘No Stopping' otherwise the motorist would face liability for a Charge Notice.
10. The position of the appellant's vehicle can be observed in the supplied annotated signage map and annotated vehicle location which highlight the proximity of the appellant's vehicle to VCS signage. We would reiterate that this site and its signage have passed audit by the International Parking Community (IPC).
11. A helpline telephone number (open 24 hours per day) is clearly displayed on all VCS signage for any motorist experiencing difficulty. This was not utilised by the appellant. Had the appellant contacted us as soon as was practical and brought the matter to our attention, it is possible provision could have been made. It is not possible to make provision for motorists after the fact.
12. The pertinent point in this case is that the appellant, having been given sufficient notice of the terms and conditions in place, freely chose to stop their vehicle on this roadway where stopping for this purpose is prohibited all times. Ultimately, when entering this private land it was the sole responsibility of the motorist to fully comply with the clearly advertised contractual terms and conditions, by their failure to do so the appellant became liable for the CN, which was lawfully issued.
13. By stopping in a zone where stopping was prohibited the appellant became liable for the Charge Notice issued as per the Terms and Conditions displayed.
And in my final response:
The items uploaded in response to my appeal do not substantiate their false claim of me "stopping to collect a passenger". Further, I have submitted proof of paid parking in the form of a bank statement.
My initial appeal remains valid, and so far no evidence at all has been provided to the contrary.
I feel stupid for sending that final response now, having only learned about this website AFTER I had submitted it. As I am sure I could have crafted something a lot better than what I did.
I am waiting for arbitration now, but I fear I will 'lose'.
Do I have any further recourse?