Free Traffic Legal Advice

Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: CaptainToad on June 21, 2024, 06:25:59 pm

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: John U.K. on November 27, 2024, 09:38:17 am

Quote from: alanthefocusman on November 27, 2024, 08:54:00 am

Good morning,
. . .
Regards. Alan Shaw.

This post refers to this topic
https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/redbridge-pcn-pavement-parking-1-roll-gardens-ig2-6tn/msg47122/#msg47122

@alanthefocusman
Alan, you may wish to post on your own thread, cross-referencing this one.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: alanthefocusman on November 27, 2024, 08:54:00 am

Good morning,
Thank you so much for your very prompt reply to my post. I can see that this issue has been thoroughly gone into on previous occasions. I have read through the posts and there is a lot of information to consider. However as someone who has little or no legal experience I would appreciate some guidance as to what points I should use and then how I should word them in my challenge. Should I copy and paste sections of the last post? Or should I attempt to pick out sections of it that would seem to apply to  my case and then put them forward in my challenge in my own words. I don't expect a fully worded challenge from you but guidance on how I should phrase it and just how much of all of the information in the posts I should use would be helpful to me. I am sorry if that sounds a bit vague but I am not of a legal mind and unsure of how best to use all of the information that you have sent me.

Thank you once again for all of the time that you have spent on my problem.
Regards. Alan Shaw.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: CaptainToad on September 17, 2024, 11:29:28 pm

Formal representations have been accepted by Redbridge Council, and the PCN has been cancelled!

A big thank you to everyone who helped!

 :D

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: Pastmybest on August 27, 2024, 01:54:05 pm

It gets all the points in so IMO fine

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: CaptainToad on August 26, 2024, 11:43:57 pm

Here's my draft reps based on the arguments put forward by @H C Andersen.

It's a bit long, but any advice on what to remove will be much appreciated! I've tried to simplify it, but it wasn't that obvious what I should take out. 

-------------------

I am submitting a formal representation against the Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) issued to me, as I believe it was issued based on an incorrect interpretation of the relevant parking regulations.

It is not in dispute that I parked on a yellow line while displaying a valid Blue Badge in accordance with the statutory requirements. The crux of the issue lies in the interpretation of the footway parking prohibition and its interaction with the no-waiting restriction indicated by the sign.

The Civil Enforcement Officer (CEO) who issued this PCN appears to have interpreted the disapplication of the footway parking prohibition as applying solely outside the hours specified by the no-waiting sign. However, as a Blue Badge holder, I am legally exempt from the waiting restriction at all times. Consequently, the exemption should extend to footway parking as well, thereby permitting me to park with two wheels on the footway regardless of the time.

It is important to note that I have discussed this matter with several other Civil Enforcement Officers in the area, all of whom have consistently advised that, as a Blue Badge holder, I am permitted to park with two wheels on the footway and that the issuance of a PCN in such circumstances would be incorrect. They have also encouraged me to challenge the PCN, confirming that my understanding of the regulations aligns with standard enforcement practices.

Legally, once an exemption from the waiting restriction is established, it follows that footway parking should be permitted at all times for those exempted, including Blue Badge holders and those engaged in exempted activities such as loading. To interpret otherwise would render the exemption meaningless and would be contrary to both the letter and spirit of the law.

Furthermore, from a traffic management perspective, it is illogical to suggest that the council intends for disabled motorists to be forced to park entirely on the carriageway, particularly in an area where footway parking is generally permitted. Such an interpretation would expose disabled motorists to unnecessary risks by requiring them to park alongside larger vehicles, thus creating safety hazards and undermining the overarching traffic management objectives concerning carriageway width and available space.

My research into the council's policy further substantiates my position. It is evident that the prohibition on footway parking has been expressly disapplied 24/7 on this road and others. The council’s policy is clear: disapplying the prohibition does not grant carte blanche for unrestricted parking; it merely allows parking in accordance with existing restrictions. In the context of a part-time waiting restriction, this permits footway parking outside the restricted hours for those exempted, such as Blue Badge holders.

The issue, therefore, is not with the underlying policy but with the erroneous interpretation by the CEO, which has resulted in the misapplication of the footway parking regulations and the incorrect issuance of this PCN.

To summarize the legal position:
1. The prohibition on footway parking has been disapplied 24/7 at this location.
2. A part-time waiting restriction is in place.
3. As a motorist displaying a valid Blue Badge, I am legally entitled to park with two wheels on the footway at any time.

Additionally, I would like to bring to your attention the precedent set in London Tribunals Case reference 2190057621, where the adjudicator stated that "the local authority may face wasted costs order in the future if they continue to issue PCNs for footway parking to disabled badge holders". Should this PCN not be reviewed and cancelled in light of the clear legal position and consistent advice from other CEOs, I will be compelled to request that the council reimburse any costs incurred as a result of pursuing this appeal to London Tribunals.

Furthermore, I remind the council of its obligation to provide a full and detailed explanation should my representation be rejected. The council must address each of the points I have raised and explain the reasoning behind any decision to uphold the PCN.

If the CEO’s interpretation is correct, then the current footway parking signage is fundamentally flawed and should be removed. It is apparent that the signage in question does not conform to the prescribed form as required by law. Consequently, it may be argued that the signs do not adequately convey the applicable restrictions, failing to meet the legal requirement of clearly communicating the regulations to motorists. It must be replaced with standard permissive signage that excludes any timing restrictions, and loading restrictions should be implemented to align with the waiting restriction.

In light of the foregoing legal arguments, the advice I have received from other CEOs, and the potential for wasted costs orders, I respectfully request that the PCN be reviewed and cancelled.

-------------------------

Thanks in advance for any help given!

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: CaptainToad on August 13, 2024, 10:59:45 pm

Thanks for the replies @H C Andersen and @Pastmybest.
I've finally received the NTO, which you can see here (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vaUMk7t0k9eM4t80qjLeE3wZLlrWlmuw/view?usp=sharing).

I'll draft my reps based on the info you've provided, and will post it in the next couple of days.

Thanks!

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: H C Andersen on July 23, 2024, 06:48:19 pm

My post was more an aide memoir for the next stage!

OP, if you are going with the simple version then IMO you must include that if the authority dispute or disregard the resolution they must explain why in their response. Simply relying upon invalid traffic signs in any rejection would not be sufficient.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: Pastmybest on July 23, 2024, 04:14:19 pm

So much there that allows the council to say ahh we are right they are not the Resolution allows footway parking 24/7 so at no time can this be a contravention as the YL is centre of the carriageway to property line a YL contravention could occur but the BB exempts that

For me keep it simple

OP do you have the NTO yet

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: H C Andersen on July 23, 2024, 12:14:27 pm

There's a lot of info in the link, seemingly obtained with respect to a 2023 request.

Having trawled through the papers, I cannot find anything which provides for part-time footway parking.

OP, I would put forward the argument along the following lines.

The signs at the location comprise a compliant 'No Waiting' black on yellow traffic sign conveying a waiting restriction for other than for exempted purposes Mon-Sat 8.30-6.30pm and a non-compliant sign disapplying the London-wide footway parking prohibition.

The latter states 'At other times and Sunday'. This is not formatted as specified in the Traffic Signs etc. Regs. As the restriction does not involve parking places, the applicable signs are to be found in Schedule 7 of the regs which prescribe the use of 'white' on 'blue' signs i.e. all writing to be in white on a blue background(as per all parking place signage, Schedule 4 of the regs refers). Instead the council have used a 'shared use' format applicable to parking places - see Section 13 of the Traffic Signs Manual, Chapter 3.

However, the use of the words 'At other times' is permitted although the addition of 'and Sundays' is tautological and therefore questionable(a Sunday being self-evidently a time other than Mon-Sat 8.30-6.30pm).

It is clear that the signs do not in general conform to the prescribed form and therefore it may be argued that they do not adequately convey the restrictions which apply, which is the legal (i.e. Local Authority Traffic Orders etc.) requirement. However, my argument is in respect of the specific conditions which apply in my case.

That I parked on a yellow line displaying a valid disabled person's badge in the prescribed position is not at issue. The CEO issued the PCN because their interpretation of the disapplication of the footway parking prohibition was that this applied only outside of the times given in the no waiting sign i.e. at other times. My interpretation was different.

I believe that in law as I was exempted from the waiting restriction in any event, footway parking was permitted at all times for an exempted motorist or for an exempted purpose e.g. loading. I also looked at the matter intuitively and concluded that it could not have been the council's intention to force exempted motorists to park wholly on the carriageway at a location where the existence of a relaxed footway parking policy showed an overarching traffic management concern as regards the width of the carriageway and available space. If indeed the council's policy is to require disabled motorists to park in the road alongside vehicles of up to 7.5t then this would seem absurd.

I therefore carried out some research on the policy and restrictions and found what appears to be a straightforward policy which is that footway parking has been disapplied 24/7 in this road, and indeed others. The council were well advised and haven't made the mistake of thinking that lifting of the prohibition permits 24/7 parking, it doesn't: it only allows otherwise permitted parking 24/7 e.g. in the case of a part-time waiting restriction waiting on the footway outside of the restricted hours other than for exempted persons and purposes.
It therefore follows that it is not the underlying policy which is at fault, it is officers' subsequent misinterpretation which manifested itself in the design of the 'footway parking' sign.
As regards the legal position (based upon the available evidence of the council's decisions to disapply the prohibition) this is as follows:

Footway parking disapplied 24/7;
Part-time waiting restriction; which means
Motorists displaying a valid BB and other exempted motorists may park with 2 wheels on the footway 24/7.

If the CEO's interpretation is correct then the footway parking sign must be removed and replaced with the standard permissive sign, without timings, and loading restrictions (and sign) put in place which run concurrent with the waiting restriction.

Maybe a bit long, but I thought I'd put down what I consider to be the relevant issues.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: cp8759 on July 23, 2024, 01:09:55 am

The footway parking resolution documents are here (https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1nCUavAVjc2USjga76OMVcp30J_CRu9Bv).

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: Pastmybest on July 15, 2024, 07:14:09 pm

wait for the NTO that case you found supports the sensible interpretation ans IMO vastly increases your chance or winning

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: CaptainToad on July 15, 2024, 10:46:51 am

As expected, Redbridge has rejected the informal challenge.
Front of rejection letter (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rMWyZLeL04I2C9EhuGWYpfUBtY5QUqFz/view?usp=drive_link)
and
back of rejection letter (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1swNm5k59PdTdrRrXS6FtuBXiJpY423s0/view?usp=drive_link)

They've not mentioned anything about Blue Badge holders, which is disappointing, especially since I found this Case reference - 2190057621 on London Tribunals, although the decision date was from 2019, so I'm hoping it's still relevant, as it's the next street along, with the same signage on both streets since 2015.

The adjudicator said -
Roll Gardens is a very narrow road and has a single yellow line running all the way along. There is a no waiting/parking sign setting out the hours of the yellow line restriction together with a footway parking sign directing motorist to park with two wheels on the footway "At other times and Sunday" which is outside the restricted hours.

Disabled badge holders are entitled to park on the single yellow line during the restricted hours as there are no loading restrictions in force provided they have displayed a valid badge and time clock.

Although the local authority have not provided their TMO for the road in question I am satisfied that the correct interpretation of the signs in relation to disabled badge holders is that they should also park on the footway to which the yellow line restriction/parking footway exemption relates even if it is during the restricted hours.

This has been confirmed by Hannah Pearse the parking team leader at the London Borough of Redbridge in her email to Councillor Noor dated 10th December 2018 in relation to Roll Gardens where Ms Pearse states "I have fully reviewed the matter and can confirm that blue badge holders may park with two wheels on the footway during restricted hours providing they are clearly displaying their badge. I have reiterated this to our enforcement contractors to ensure no further confusion occurs surrounding those parked in this way".

And then the adjudicator goes on and says, Mr Ammar has made an application for costs which I have refused on this occasion as Ms Pearse letter post dates the date of the contravention, but with the caveat that the local authority may face wasted costs order in the future if they continue to issue PCNs for footway parking to disabled badge holders in Roll gardens who are validly parked, in disregard of Ms Pearse letter or this Adjudication.

I know the adjudication specifically says Roll Gardens, but both roads have identical road signage and are parallel to each other.
Roll Gardens - GSV (https://maps.app.goo.gl/VMr9Rcn4Euk3CvB59)
Same signage can be seen on Shere Road - GSV (https://maps.app.goo.gl/L1watkgsP9qxo1KM6) where I received the PCN.

Also, both roads have the same TMO -  LBR no.25/2021. https://redbridge.traffweb.app/traffweb/1/TrafficOrders (https://redbridge.traffweb.app/traffweb/1/TrafficOrders)

What do you guys recommend now? Is the above case relevant, and shall I wait for the NtO and make a Formal Challenge?

Thanks!

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: CaptainToad on July 01, 2024, 09:34:44 am

Thanks to everyone for the replies.

Especially to @cp8759 for drafting the challenge, which I have now posted on to the council website.
I'll update this thread once I receive a reply.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: cp8759 on June 26, 2024, 06:46:16 pm

Well at best we can say that an adjudicator could go either way on the adequacy of the signage, but with a blue badge holder a plea for discretion has to be the first port of call.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: H C Andersen on June 24, 2024, 08:48:11 am

@PMB, what is incorrect about my interpretation of the signs as regards their meaning, however ****-eyed this might be i.e. the waiting restriction relates to vehicles on the carriageway and if it has any traffic management purpose this would be undermined by exempt vehicles parking wholly on the carriageway because an exempt vehicle still represents a potential hazard?

But the signs are there.

The issue is the GP Act which doesn't exempt vehicles displaying BB so, however illogical the outcome, IMO it is the legal position - subject to the extent of the resolution aligning with the sign.

The sign itself does not comply with the regs. However, the symbol is correct. And in any event if the sign is void then surely the blanket prohibition would apply.

The draft seems appropriate for this stage.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: Pastmybest on June 24, 2024, 08:29:54 am

I do not agree with HCA, other than re the clarity of the sign which IMO would not comply with regs.

But look at the reasoning for the sign. It is a SYL that restricts parking, but when parking is allowed then it should be 2 wheels up. Well the BB allows parking and 2 up is the correct way.

Make an informal challenge to that effect (post your draft here for review first)

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: cp8759 on June 23, 2024, 04:21:16 pm

Council photos:

(https://i.imgur.com/LxLREog.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/74391Jt.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/3pr9VR7.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RiMCCmY.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/cQmu41O.jpeg)

(https://i.imgur.com/3V9ovII.jpeg)

While I don't disagree with HCA on the fact that there does appear to be a contravention, I also think the signage could be clearer and it is worth point this out, so here's my suggestion:

Dear London Borough of Redbridge,

I would like to ask that this penalty be cancelled as I was the victim of an honest misunderstanding of the signs. The signage at this location permits footway parking at certain times and indicates a waiting restriction at other times, and as a blue badge holder I am exempt from the waiting restrictions I was labouring under the misapprehension that I could park as I could have done outside of the restricted times, i.e. with two wheels on the footpath.

While I now understand that this is not the case and I should have parked fully on the carriageway during the restricted hours, I would ask that the council exercise its discretion to cancel the penalty on this occasion.

Yours faithfully,

Send this via the council website and keep a screenshot of the confirmation page. In the meantime I'll get hold of the footway parking resolution.

Title: Re: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: H C Andersen on June 21, 2024, 08:59:30 pm

As it stands IMO the vehicle was in contravention.

Forget the yellow line, the sign says* (by deduction) that motorists are permitted to park with 2 wheels on the footway without time limit between the hours of 6.30pm Sat and 8.30am Mon and 6.30pm and 8.30am Mon-Sat.

You were parked at 13.53 on a Monday.

*- strictly speaking the writing should be white on blue background, but IMO this is minor.

..but whether the sign reflects accurately a resolution made under s15(4) of this [ https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/1974/24/section/15] has yet to be determined!

Title: Redbridge PCN. Code 62. Blue Badge, parked on Single Yellow line, next to a park on the kerb sign.
Post by: CaptainToad on June 21, 2024, 06:25:59 pm

Hi all.

I received a PCN this afternoon, 21/06/24, for parking on the kerb, next to a sign saying to park on the kerb, whilst clearly displaying a Blue Badge. My question is, are Blue Badge holders not allowed to park on the kerb at the times shown, and have to park fully on the narrow road instead?

I've previously spoken to a couple of CEOs and they have said I could park on the single yellow lines for up to 3 hours whilst displaying a Blue Badge, and I have done on a few occasions, and on this kerb. But today is the first time whilst parked there that I have been given a PCN.

So, should I challenge the PCN? And if yes, any advice on what to write for my challenge would be much appreciated.
Here are the links to my PCN -
Front of PCN (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KRxhosS9oaq3AT-IsKf_fuQ5nDOjrzTe/view?usp=drive_link)
Rear of PCN (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1f_Wlxwm2YTQXHKCAImqw5wHm3fT5Mokn/view?usp=drive_link)

Google Streetview link -
Parked here, to the right of the tree (https://maps.app.goo.gl/uHqG3eYSv4MkNEaV7)

And some of the photos taken by the CEO -
photo 1 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mSYksFELfi2RTRiUMXrSwBJmfMrpZkwi/view?usp=drive_link)
photo 2 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1VVNhsfGGpNaVbgmRzylAApk3CkWTxLrb/view?usp=drive_link)
photo 3 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1gP971ud_wLm4HiiuWeumlwRGSrEe9MLG/view?usp=drive_link)

Thanks in advance for any help provided!

CT.