Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: nim on June 13, 2024, 10:45:49 pm
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The traffic order is The Tower Hamlets (Parking Places) (Map Based) Order 2019 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/18h1pfNIANxEuxkrIUf3q6tPky0pCyhUe/view) and the map tile is AJ13 (https://store.traffweb.app/towerhamlets/documents/parkmap/msched/AJ13_rv2_1.pdf).
The PCN's state after 4 weeks is usually irrelevant, it's the PCN at the time of service that counts. We see all manner of things happens to PCNs: a PCN could have been left it in direct sunlight, it could have been chewed by the dog, set on fire, it is not required to be indestructible. If you could show that even under controlled lighting, humidity and temperature conditions the PCN will self-destruct that might be different, but simply saying the PCN has faded after a few weeks is not, on its own, grounds for anything at all.
That being said, if you carry on to the notice to owner stage then although the NTO will demand the full penalty, the discount will be reoffered again as long as you challenge the NTO within 14 days of the date of issue.
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Hi cp8759
Enclosed is a Google street view link.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/uJ8SViqfsxP4ePDo7. Are you able to view the traffic order online?
The PCN has to be paid or appealed by tomorrow.
Am right to say that you think the Notice of Rejection is OK and the PCN being unreadable after 4 weeks is OK? Thanks for your help.
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As is often the case, you've sort of shot yourself in the foot with the representations you've made. The CEO's photos do not show any restrictions, so on this evidence alone the PCN could not have been enforced:
(https://i.imgur.com/A5puQUF.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/ArVVbBB.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/peqybVz.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/lqFj1EE.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/y4MqSad.png)
Unfortunately by bringing up the issue of payment in your representation you've basically admitted it's a pay by phone bay, it would have been better to say nothing at all.
Anyway, we are where we are. Please give us a link to the exact location on Google street view, so that we can check the traffic order.
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Hi all
Thank you for your help so far.
Enclosed is a link to the PCN and the Ringo receipt.
(https://i.imgur.com/hpPjQDj.png)
I assume the contravention was 12:19 (at the end of the observation period?
I paid for parking at 12:08 but for the wrong vehicle
Is there anything which allows for an exemption if payment was made for the wrong vehicle or is it just for minor discrepancies?
The NOR doesn't look right with the terminology that has been used.
Is the PCN valid?
The PCN has faded since the PCN was received and for large parts is unreadable. I'm surprised councils can get away with issuing PCN's like this.
Can they say this "you may do so by completing a Notice to Owner (NTO), which will be sent to you in
approximately 28 days."
Thank you for your help.
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The title of your topic says "Newham". The rejection letter you posted up says Tower Hamlets.
So is Newham a mistake or is there another PCN?
I have fixed the thread title to avoid confusion.
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Thank you all for your replies. I will repost all of the info later.
Enceladus. Yes it is Tower Hamlets
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@nim please read the guidance here: https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/
Once you've read that in full, please re-post the paperwork leaving the PCN number and number plate visible.
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The title of your topic says "Newham". The rejection letter you posted up says Tower Hamlets.
So is Newham a mistake or is there another PCN?
Please only redact your name and address where present. Please leave the PCN number, the vehicle reg, all dates and times, location and all other Council info visible.
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We need the PCN and VRM details.
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Is there an exemption or a lesser penalty if I have paid for the wrong vehicle registration?
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Any help would be appreciated.
I parked and paid using Ringo but in error I paid for another vehicle. Completely different registration.
I cant find the PCN but I have posted the informal Notice of Rejection
(https://i.imgur.com/56mYbGj.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/xAmRKme.jpeg)
Is there some sort of mitigation for paying but for the wrong vehicle?
The terminology used in the NOR does not look quite right. Is this worth going to the adjudicator on?
Its not called a Notice of Rejection (although I appreciate it is an informal NOR)
The NOR states:
I refer to your challenge about the above Penalty Charge Notice (PCN), which has now been
considered in accordance with the Traffic Management Act 2004. The PCN was issued as the
vehicle was parked in a resident shared use parking place without a valid virtual permit and
without clearly displaying a valid physical permit or voucher or pay and display ticket or without
payment of the parking charge.
In your letter you state you had paid to park using RingGo app and the app had a different
registration number stored and you have paid for the wrong vehicle..
I have noted your comments and whilst this may have been a genuine error, it does not warrant
cancellation of the PCN.
It remains the driver’s responsibility to ensure the correct details are provided when using the
RingGo payment service.
I must therefore still request payment of £65.00 before the end of the period of 14 days
beginning with the date of service of this letter. If payment is not received within this time the
full amount of £130.00 will be due.
If you are the owner or registered keeper of the vehicle and still wish to appeal against the
PCN, you may do so by completing a Notice to Owner (NTO), which will be sent to you in
approximately 28 days.
The Notice to Owner will state:
- How a formal representation (appeal) against the PCN may be made
- The grounds on which a representation may be made
- The sum outstanding
I must advise you that if you make a representation and we reject it then you will be liable for
the full charge of £130.00.
Thank you in advance for your help.