Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: EagerBeaver on June 05, 2024, 03:48:35 pm
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Just phoned the Tribunal. They have issued a DNC request.
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Bonkers:
14 days have passed already.
The outstanding balance is £65.00
You can view details to pay for your PCN.
The period when you could contest this PCN has expired.
Penalty Charge Notice: AF98632710
Vehicle registration:
Contravention date: Tuesday, 21 May 2024 16:28
Contravention: Entering and stopping in a box junction when prohibited
Street: BARLEY LANE
Location:
Status: Representation Rejected
The outstanding balance is £65.00
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Usual advice: Contravention did not occur and my representative will file full submissions upon receipt of the council's evidence pack. Left you a whats app message. If they are daft enough, we may be looking at costs as per your other one!
2240194118
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Molon lave.
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Total bolleaux. Drop me a PM to start the ball rolling. This is Tribunal time.
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https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/redbridge-george-lane-31j-stopping-in-a-box-junction-when-prohibited/
Okay, let's not muck about here! No point in even pursuing vague locus as per the OP's first post. The YBJ was known.
Dear Redbridge
Ref: PCN VRM
The contravention did not occur because the video does not show my vehicle at the point of entry.
Should you not cancel the PCN forthwith, I shall take the matter to the Tribunal and be seeking costs.
Please take the eminently sensible decision to cancel the said PCN.
Yours faithfully
Registered keeper
Address
If they resist, I am happy to take charge of this one for you at the Tribunal having won one v Kingston a few months ago on the same issue.
ETA Register of Appeals
Register kept under Regulation 20 of the Road Traffic (Parking Adjudicators) (London) Regulations 1993, as amended and Regulation 17 of the Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Representations and Appeals) (England) Regulations 2022.
Case Details
Case reference 2240040646
Appellant Louisa Symons
Authority Royal Borough of Kingston Upon Thames
VRM BL130NX
PCN Details
PCN QT08478867
Contravention date 12 Nov 2023
Contravention time 17:28:00
Contravention location Richmond Rd (Junction with Sopwith Way D5)
Penalty amount GBP 130.00
Contravention Entering and stopping in a box junction
Referral date
Decision Date 25 Mar 2024
Adjudicator John Lane
Appeal decision Appeal allowed
Direction
cancel the Penalty Charge Notice.
Reasons
Mr Morgan attended. Ms Symons attended by telephone.
It is a contravention if a person causes their vehicle to enter a box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of stationary vehicles.
The evidence does not show the appellant’s vehicle “enter” the box junction.
The footage starts with the vehicle already on the box junction.
I will therefore allow the appeal.
Have now had a response,
Please see below:
(https://i.ibb.co/0f9fTvB/IMG-1657-Medium-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0f9fTvB) (https://i.ibb.co/8Dx8sW8/IMG-1658-Medium-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/8Dx8sW8) (https://i.ibb.co/9Zkgh1j/IMG-1659-Medium-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9Zkgh1j) (https://i.ibb.co/BnCfKmV/IMG-1660-Medium-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BnCfKmV) (https://i.ibb.co/6JPTwh3/IMG-1661-Medium-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6JPTwh3) (https://i.ibb.co/3Nkq4TD/IMG-1662-Medium-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3Nkq4TD)
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@EagerBeaver just go with Hippocrates's draft and let us know when you get a response.
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https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/redbridge-george-lane-31j-stopping-in-a-box-junction-when-prohibited/
Okay, let's not muck about here! No point in even pursuing vague locus as per the OP's first post. The YBJ was known.
Dear Redbridge
Ref: PCN VRM
The contravention did not occur because the video does not show my vehicle at the point of entry.
Should you not cancel the PCN forthwith, I shall take the matter to the Tribunal and be seeking costs.
Please take the eminently sensible decision to cancel the said PCN.
Yours faithfully
Registered keeper
Address
If they resist, I am happy to take charge of this one for you at the Tribunal having won one v Kingston a few months ago on the same issue.
ETA Register of Appeals
Register kept under Regulation 20 of the Road Traffic (Parking Adjudicators) (London) Regulations 1993, as amended and Regulation 17 of the Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Representations and Appeals) (England) Regulations 2022.
Case Details
Case reference 2240040646
Appellant Louisa Symons
Authority Royal Borough of Kingston Upon Thames
VRM BL130NX
PCN Details
PCN QT08478867
Contravention date 12 Nov 2023
Contravention time 17:28:00
Contravention location Richmond Rd (Junction with Sopwith Way D5)
Penalty amount GBP 130.00
Contravention Entering and stopping in a box junction
Referral date
Decision Date 25 Mar 2024
Adjudicator John Lane
Appeal decision Appeal allowed
Direction
cancel the Penalty Charge Notice.
Reasons
Mr Morgan attended. Ms Symons attended by telephone.
It is a contravention if a person causes their vehicle to enter a box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of stationary vehicles.
The evidence does not show the appellant’s vehicle “enter” the box junction.
The footage starts with the vehicle already on the box junction.
I will therefore allow the appeal.
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Definitely major on the video not showing the entry into the box. Another appeal point is the PCN stating only 'Barley Lane' as the location. That's over 1 mile long with more than one box junction along it so it's not specific enough as to where they allege the contravention to have taken place.
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The video starts with your car already fully in the box, so that is a clear point for any appeal argument.
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You need to set the video to sharing/public.
Apologies, should be visible now!
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You need to set the video to sharing/public.
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Hi all,
Unfortunately I fell prey to a box junction outside work the other day, wasn't concentrating and got caught out.
However, have done some reading around the topic and can see that similar cases have been won at tribunal on the grounds that the video does not show 'point of entry' to the box junction. As you can see from my video the car is already inside the box junction at the time the video starts recording, and as such does not establish the point of entry.
Furthermore the surname is spelled incorrectly on the PCN - not sure if this is relevant?
Would be eternally grateful for advice and appropriate wording of a representation.
(https://i.ibb.co/Kb1dZX8/IMG-1325.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Kb1dZX8) (https://i.ibb.co/y6Gb9CM/IMG-1326.jpg) (https://ibb.co/y6Gb9CM)
VIDEO:
https://youtu.be/TqPljRJ891g
Streetview:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/TjJ5sz9mXFUwivBj9
(might not be that helpful, as street view shows when road was previously marked as Keep Clear not a box junction)
Kindest regards,
Ryan.