Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Private parking tickets => Topic started by: technicaldna on May 16, 2024, 01:08:29 pm
-
Nope.
Make a list of the points you intend to appeal on, remembering that POPLA willingly consider posts of law or breaches of the BPA CoP. Things such as PoFA failures that mean only the driver can be liable (assuming you haven't "outed" yourself as the driver), signage issues such as lack of prominence or unreadable terms and so on, does the PPC have a valid contract with the landowner to issue PCNs in its own name and so on.
List those points saying you are appealing on those posts and then go through each point n detail, pointing out which paragraph of the CoP or PoFA was not complied with. There are links to the applicable CoP and PoFA in the signature of posts by @DWMB2.
You are expected to put some effort into this yourself. We will try and steer you in the right direction but don't expect everything to be handed to you on a platter. There is plenty of available information on the internet and you should use your favourite search engine to assist.
-
Grounds for Appeal:
in my case 1 and 3 or i should other points as well ?
1. Major Keying Error:
The PCN is likely due to a major keying error. I have attached a copy of my store receipt dated [date] as evidence that I was a legitimate customer at the car park around the time of the alleged offense. This demonstrates that the registration number captured by the ANPR system may not be accurate.
2.Unclear Signage: The car park lacked prominent, clear, and legible signage at the entrance and throughout. This made it difficult for drivers to understand the parking regulations and could have easily led to confusion regarding registration entry. If possible, I can provide photos or descriptions of the unclear signage to further support this claim.
3.Missing Information on Notice to Keeper (NtK): The NtK fails to comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) by not including crucial information. Specifically, it lacks evidence of the period the vehicle was allegedly parked. This omission weakens the operator's case significantly.
4. Landowner Authority: While I acknowledge this point may not be as strong as the previous ones, I would like to inquire about the operator's authority to issue parking charges at this location. If they cannot provide sufficient evidence of lawful authority from the landowner, the PCN should be cancelled.
-
Can you please help or guide me with appeal templates? Is there any example I can look at?
-
You're a bit late, Rookie. The appeal has already been sent and rejected (presumably sent without the extraneous stuff about the DPA, as b789 wisely advised removing this).
OP, your next stop is POPLA. Your appeal to them should ideally be more detailed, leading the assessor through each point explicitly.
-
I appeal as the keeper of the vehicle. The driver, on the date in question, was authorized to park at the location as they were patrons of the leisure center, as evidenced by [provide evidence].
The driver made their best endeavors to comply with the system and entered the vehicle details, and can only think the iPad/device signal/software failed, which is out of the driver’s control.
All irrelevant to your eky appeal point, delete.
Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offense, has caused significant distress to me.
I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle. I deny liability for any sum at all, and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the Data Protection Act. You are required to respond in writing to the address below within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.
Fails the common sense test, they already have the data, they are processing it and have every right to at this moment in time, not sure where you got this drivel from but that's what it is.
-
Thank you to everyone who helped. Euro Car Parks (ECP) has rejected my appeal for the following reasons and provided options and have given me the Unique POPLA Verification Code. Please advise on what to do next:
"The Site: Fullwell Cross Leisure Centre - Ilford
Breach of Terms and Conditions:
No valid pay and display/permit was
purchased
Having carefully considered the supporting evidence provided by you, Euro Car Parks (ECP) have
decided to reject your appeal for the following reasons:
The Site is operated by Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) system. ANPR
cameras have captured an image of the vehicle registration mark LK63VBZ entering and
leaving The Site and calculated the duration of stay.
When purchasing a pay and display ticket or mobile payment session, payment is required for
the full duration of your stay and for the full and correct vehicle registration mark. Signage at
the site clearly details the terms and conditions that you must adhere to.
After checking the providers mobile payment and/or pay and display machine audit reports for
your stay there are no transactions for the vehicle registration mark.
Please be advised that members must register their full name and correct vehicle registration
details via the console on site. The Parking Charge Notice was issued correctly as the driver
has failed to follow the correct procedure on this occasion. I have investigated and your VRM
is not on the console on this day and no payment has been made for parking therefore the
Parking Charge Notice was issued correctly and remains payable. Please find the
attachment.
Euro Car Parks do not need to provide evidence of who was driving the vehicle, it is the
registered keeper’s responsibility to inform of the full name and address within 28 days
beginning with the day after the notice was given. If the full amount remains unpaid, under
Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (‘the Act’), Euro Car Parks have the right
subject of the Act to recover from the keeper of the vehicle at the time it was parked so much
of that amount which remains unpaid, therefore, the notice was issued correctly and remains
payable.
If you were not the driver, please provide a UK serviceable address with full name of the
driver to col@eurocarparks.com, in order to process a change of liability on your behalf. If
C1 MB
such information will not be provided, the notice will remain payable with you as Registered
Keeper.
The parking charge notice has been issued correctly and remains payable.
Please use one of the following options below to make payment for the amount of £60.00:
1. Online: By visiting https://www.eurocarparks.com/pay-a-parking-charge/
1. Phone: Use the automated telephone service 0203 553 4559.
2. Post: Make your cheque payable to Euro Car Parks Limited (include a £2.50 handling charge
for cheque processing) and post to Euro Car Parks Ltd, 30 Dorset Square, London, NW1
6QJ, quoting the PCN number on the reverse of the cheque.
The parking charge notice will be held for 14 days from the date of this letter to allow time to make
payment.
You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure.
You can make an appeal to the Independent Appeals Service, POPLA (Parking on Private Land
Appeals) using the unique POPLA Reference code provided above. Please note, should you decide
to appeal to POPLA, or if you appeal to POPLA and your appeal is subsequently rejected, the option
to pay the discounted amount will no longer be available and the Full Amount of the PCN will be due.
Please note - if the parking charge notice was issued in Scotland and or Northern Ireland, only “The
Driver” can appeal to POPLA.
If you decide to appeal to POPLA, you will need to visit the website, www.popla.co.uk where further
details of how to appeal (either online or by downloading the relevant forms) can be found. If the
driver is unable to access the website, please use the contact us page at
https://www.popla.co.uk/contact. Please ensure that the POPLA Reference Number as noted above is
quoted on all correspondence to POPLA. You have 28 days from the date of this letter to submit an
appeal to POPLA. If you appeal to POPLA, the parking charge notice will be placed on hold.
Appeals may not be accepted if payment is made against the Parking Charge Notice, including any
appeals logged via POPLA.
If you choose to ignore this letter, we will seek to recover the outstanding amount owed to us through
the debt recovery process and procedure, this may lead to court action against you.
By law, we are also required to inform you that the Ombudsman Services (www.ombudsman-
services.org) provides an alternative dispute resolution service that would be able to assist with your
appeal. Please note, we have not chosen to participate in their dispute resolution service and as such,
should you wish to appeal then you must do so to POPLA, as detailed above.
Yours sincerely
PCN Coordinator
Parking Charge Notice Department"
-
Don’t understand why you have added the last two paragraphs. They are nothing to do with an appeal. Maybe use them as a separate complaint but I’d remove them from the appeal.
They’ve already obtained the keepers details with reasonable cause.
-
Can you please check my draft appeal? Does it look fine or should I amend it?
I appeal as the keeper of the vehicle. The driver, on the date in question, was authorized to park at the location as they were patrons of the leisure center, as evidenced by [provide evidence].
The driver made their best endeavors to comply with the system and entered the vehicle details, and can only think the iPad/device signal/software failed, which is out of the driver’s control.
Your NtK failed to fully comply with the strict requirements of PoFA because you failed to include the required invitation for the keeper to pay the charge as required in PoFA 9(2)(e)(i). There is no legal obligation for me to name the driver, and I will not be doing so. Please cancel this PCN and save us both time and money, or issue me a POPLA code where you will have it confirmed that you cannot hold me, the keeper, liable.
Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offense, has caused significant distress to me.
I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle. I deny liability for any sum at all, and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the Data Protection Act. You are required to respond in writing to the address below within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.
-
Thanks for your help. I really appreciate your time and valuable insight. I'm a little confused, so what should the keeper do to keep things simple
Should the keeper appeal as below?
"I appeal as the keeper of the vehicle. The driver, on the date in question, was authorized to park at the location as they were patrons of the leisure centre, as evidenced by [provide evidence]. Your NtK failed to fully comply with the strict requirements of PoFA because you failed to include the required invitation for the keeper to pay the charge as required in PoFA 9(2)(e)(i). There is no legal obligation for me to name the driver, and I will not be doing so. Please cancel this PCN and save us both time and money, or issue me a POPLA code where you will have it confirmed that you cannot hold me, the keeper, liable."
And if they offer a £20 discount, should the keeper take it?
That is what I would recommend you send as your appeal. They may or, more likely, won't accept it. However, they will have to issue you a POPLA code so that you can then appeal through their mendaciously titled "independent" appeals service. At least POPLA, unlike their competitor, the IAS, appear to have much higher ratio of successful appeals to refusals.
At the end of the day, even if the POPLA appeal is unsuccessful, it has no bearing on what happens next. You'd go through a spell of receiving numerous debt collector letter which you can safely ignore. Whilst appearing to be scary to the untrained eye, they are powerless to do anything and are relying on the victims gullibility and lack of knowledge to succumb and pay into their scam.
What you eventually want is a county court claim. Again, they are hoping that the sight of a county court claim will cause you to poop your pants and capitulate into paying their now much increased sum. As long as the claim is defended using the robust template defence that we provide, this will eventually lead to a discontinuation once they know that you are not that low-hanging fruit as described earlier. Anyone paying a penny to these shysters is a fool and their money when they are easily defeated.
If they offer you a £20 charge, it is up to you whether you take it or not. Personally, I wouldn't accept it out of principle and knowing that if I just let this run its course, they will discontinue and I won't have paid them a penny and they'll have incurred charges for their POPLA code and their court fees.
-
(as an aside, are ECP issuing claims again these days [albeit oft-discontinued]? They went very court shy for a period)
Yes. Whilst ECP never used to be litigious, they now use DCB Legal to try and scare their victims into funding their scam.
For single PCN claims, DCB Legal will never proceed to a hearing as long as the defendant uses a robust defence as per the template we suggest. It is a numbers game for them. Out of the tens of thousands of claims they issue every month, there are enough that result in the low-hanging fruit capitulating and even more that end up as CCJs in default for them not to bother with any that are robustly defended.
-
Thanks for your help. I really appreciate your time and valuable insight. I'm a little confused, so what should the keeper do to keep things simple
Should the keeper appeal as below?
"I appeal as the keeper of the vehicle. The driver, on the date in question, was authorized to park at the location as they were patrons of the leisure centre, as evidenced by [provide evidence]. Your NtK failed to fully comply with the strict requirements of PoFA because you failed to include the required invitation for the keeper to pay the charge as required in PoFA 9(2)(e)(i). There is no legal obligation for me to name the driver, and I will not be doing so. Please cancel this PCN and save us both time and money, or issue me a POPLA code where you will have it confirmed that you cannot hold me, the keeper, liable."
And if they offer a £20 discount, should the keeper take it?
-
I think the above is useful context, so that the OP (and others in similar situations) go into things with their eyes open, knowing there might not be a quick fix if they plan to fight it.
(as an aside, are ECP issuing claims again these days [albeit oft-discontinued]? They went very court shy for a period)
-
Of course it is not "black and white". It never will be as long as this industry remains unregulated.
I would place money on them not accepting a keying error. What I would place money on is them hoping that the victim is low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree and paying up at the first sign of pressure in the form of a POPLA refusal, debt collector letter or once they hand it to DCB Legal to issue a claim.
However, as long as the OP does not capitulate, we all know that a DCB Legal issued claim will eventually be discontinued as long as they use the robust template defence. Sadly, far too many low-hanging fruit don't have the fortitude or knowledge to hold out and end up funding these scammers.
-
OP, you posted:
but after talking to reception their view is driver might have entered the wrong number plate or it didn't go through and offered no help.
Please take us through the registration process step-by-step.
See page 11 here: https://www.britishparking.co.uk/write/Documents/AOS/NEW%20Redesigned%20Documents/Version91.2.2024Highlight.pdf
Major and minor keying errors.
Bear in mind that the 'invitation to driver to pay' defence has a chequered history at POPLA - it will be rejected by ECP, bank on it - and therefore a 'minor keying error' must result in cancellation of the PCN by ECP, and 'major' to a reduction in the charge to £20 for 14 days after ECP respond but revert to the full charge thereafter.
Let's take the latter example and depending on the specifics which gave rise to such an error, why would anyone want to risk £80 at POPLA given the less-than-certain outcome?
IMO this is not as black and white as is suggested.
-
You are appealing a the keeper. They have sent the PCN to you, the registered keeper. They have no idea who was driving.
You say that the driver, whoever it was, did this or that. No “…I parked” or “…I drove” etc.
Only the driver is liable for the alleged charge. If you want to tell them that you were the driver, then you are liable. If they don’t know who was driving, then they cannot transfer that liability to you, the keeper if they have not fully complied with the strict requirements of PoFA.
How you use the evidence from the leisure centre to show that the driver did not breach any contract with the PPC because they were authorised to park there that day is up to you. It’s not rocket science.
Here’s. A suggestion to get you started:
“I appeal as the keeper of the vehicle. The driver, on the date, was authorised to park at the location as they were patrons of the leisure centre as evidenced by blah, blah, blah. As your NtK failed to fully comply with the strict requirements of PoFA because you failed to include the required invitation for the keeper to pay the charge as required in PoFA 9(2)(e)(i) and there is no legal obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. Please cancel this PCN and save us both time and money or issue me a POPLA code where you will have it confirmed that you cannot hold me, the keeper, liable.”
-
they confirmed there's a record in the swim class on that day and time
Does that record include confirmation of the vehicle's VRM and confirmation that the driver registered the vehicle? If not, then it's unlikely to constitute evidence that the driver complied with the terms of parking. Are the leisure centre the landowner? If so, you should try to politely pressure them into intervening, rather than throwing you to the lions that they hired!
Photos of the signage might be useful for later down the track, too.
-
What should be included when appealing as the keeper? I visited the leisure center, and they confirmed there's a record in the swim class on that day and time. They suggested that if I appeal, Euro Car Parks might overturn the charge based on this evidence.
My question is, if appeal on these grounds with evidence, can i later use the argument that "ECP has not complied with all the strict requirements of PoFA 2012, namely 9(2)(e)(i), in that there is no invitation for the keeper to now pay the charge, in the NtK" when appealing to POPLA?
-
Appeal only as the keeper... it'll be refused. Appeal to POPLA, only as the keeper, to include the fact that ECP has not complied with all the strict requirements of PoFA 2012, namely 9(2)(e)(i) (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted) in that there is no invitation for the keeper to now pay the charge, in that NtK.
Add all the usual POPLA appeal points.
-
thanks new images uploaded
-
Thanks for spotting - OP please reattach with info redacted as above.
-
Can a mod please take down both images. PCN number visible at front and reg visible on back page
-
Hi, hope you can help. Driver was in the car park to pick up kids from swimming lessons at Fullwell Cross Leisure Center, Ilford.
I, the registered keeper, received a PCN through the post a £60 parking charge notice from Euro Car Parks.
Driver registers the car reg using the computer screen at reception inside the center
but after talking to reception their view is driver might have entered the wrong number plate or it didn't go through and offered no help.
Can you help and guide what to do? Thanks.
[attachment deleted by admin]