Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) => Topic started by: roxyord@gmail.com on July 01, 2026, 01:04:51 am
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I don't follow.
Register your appeal or lose what you've paid.
Some thoughts.
Contravention did not occur;
Procedural impropriety
Contravention did not occur
By the authority's own admission, parking place markings and DYL co-exist at the location: 'I note your comments regarding the white bay markings visible at the location'. The authority suggests that a motorist should compare and contrast these and the clarity of 'the marked permit bays further along the road..' and conclude that while the parking bay markings at issue are present they are 'faint' (or possibly fainter) and these should therefore be disregarded by motorists because the DYL were clearly visible. They were therefore, according to the authority, 'prevailing'.
I refer the adjudicator to GSV snapshots of the location dated 2017, 2018, 2020, 2021 and 2024. These show that between 2018 and 2020 a parking bay was installed at the location but removed. I would draw the adjudicator's attention to the upright traffic sign(which is still in situ), which corresponds with the type recommended for use within a parking place, that is to say it omits any directional arrows indicating the start of a restriction. This sign is consistent with a bay existing where my car was parked.
Since 2020 the markings have been left, apparently to weather naturally, but this casual approach by the council places motorists in jeopardy.
I ask the adjudicator to find that the signage is not adequate and that a contravention did not occur.
I would also refer the adjudicator to the council's decision notice which states the following:
'You have the right to appeal...before the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of service[of the notice]'
Whereas the first requirement of Appeals Regulation 11 is:
11(a): inform R of R’s right to appeal to an adjudicator under regulation 13,
As the adjudicator will know, as regards appealing to the adjudicator Regulation 13 provides:
An appeal under this regulation must be made within—
2(a)the period of 28 days beginning with date of service of the decision notice under regulation 12(4)(b) informing P of P’s right to appeal under this regulation, or
(b)such longer period as the adjudicator may allow.
The decision notice omits 13(2)(b) in its entirety. However, I submit that as the regulation does not distinguish between the importance of these complementary provisions, then neither may the authority: the right of an owner to request that the adjudicator accept a late submission, and the adjudicator's corresponding power in this regard, is as fundamental as '28 days...'.
I ask the adjudicator to find that the decision notice is defective in this regard and that this is a procedural impropriety. I would add that, should the authority respond to this by reference to the tribunal form enclosed with the notice, I submit that this is not part of the notice, it is an information sheet prepared by the tribunal to assist appellants and does not relieve the authority of its duty under regulation 11(in fact in some material respects it contains information contrary to regulation 13, but as this is purely an administrative document which attempts to capture the tribunal's practice as well as give an overview of the appeals process, nothing lies against the tribunal because of this).
For the above reasons I ask that my appeal be allowed and that the authority be directed to refund all that all sums paid.
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Thank you for this. Do I’m shaking on grounds that they did not follow procedure totally?
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(11) Where an authority does not accept that there are any compelling reasons of a kind mentioned in regulation 11(3)(b), or that any of the grounds specified in regulation 11(4) apply, its decision notice must—
(a)inform R of R’s right to appeal to an adjudicator under regulation 13,
(b)indicate the nature of an adjudicator’s power to award costs, and
(c)describe in general terms the form and manner in which such an appeal is required to be made.
As for regulation 13!
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukdsi/2022/9780348231564/part/4
Appeal. Procedural impropriety.
FFS, the duty falls to the council, not ETA and their internal guidance note which in any event states the INCORRECT period for making an appeal!
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Hi all, apologies for the late response I have been away, please find the notice of rejection below, shall. i continue on the next step? and any recommendations on what I should write.
Notice of rejection photos:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1aijAHPZOmXy9vPsrD7KRZ87ClOuPFbm6
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You're at the Notice of Rejection step: https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/parking-penalty-charge-notice-enforcement-process
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Do I do that before the adjudicator or is that the adjudicator step?
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Post the rejection and your reps. If you have time there is nothing to lose by booking a tribunal appeal which you should do now as there is a long wait. Opt for a telephone or online hearing.
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Got the official reply from the council of Newham and they rejected the claim
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I wouldn't concede anything such as 'faded'.
You parked late at night in what are clearly marked bays as per picture enclosed, and the adjacent signage indicated such bays.
You put the council on notice that you will be asking the adjudicator to resolve any ambiguity in your favour.
Regarding the disproportion of the tow - it's not something the adjudicator can consider for allowing an appeal and Newham of course won't accept it but it is possible that an adjudicator could weigh up the situation and recommend a refund which is non-binding but really the tow stands or falls on the contravention so a recommendation would be for both if it is felt there is sufficient mitigation.
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Thoughts?
Dear Parking Services,
I wish to make formal representations against both the PCN and the removal of my vehicle.
I genuinely believed I was parked within a valid parking bay. The faded white bay markings remain visible, and the double yellow lines continue alongside what appears to be several bays, creating ambiguity. I also arrived late, and the parking signs did not include directional arrows or any clear indication of where the parking bays ended. As a result, I reasonably believed the bay remained valid.
Even if the Council maintains that a contravention occurred, I believe the removal of my vehicle approximately two hours after the PCN was issued was disproportionate. My vehicle was not causing an obstruction, danger, or preventing the free flow of traffic, and a PCN alone would have been sufficient enforcement.
Should these representations be rejected, I request that the Council provide the CEO’s notes, all photographs, the removal authorisation, and the records demonstrating compliance with its vehicle removal policy. I also put the Council on notice that I will rely on the ambiguity of the road markings and signage before an independent adjudicator, who may find that any uncertainty should be resolved in favour of the appellant.
In light of the unclear road layout and the disproportionate removal, I respectfully request that both the PCN and all removal charges be cancelled.
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I agree with short reps but I would enclose the picture showing the bay lines, putting them on notice what you'll be showing the adjudicator.
What you're aiming for is for the adjudicator to at least accept there is ambiguity to a sufficient degree that it can only be resolved in favour of the appellant, a decision often made at the tribunal.
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This is your only bite at the cherry before adjudication and IMO you should scope all the issues which were relevant to the driver's thinking at this stage.
I see benefits in writing your longer version because it develops arguments which the authority is obliged to consider. You saw the DYL and IMO if you do not refer to these then all you'll get is a rejection which does. I do not see any benefit in not coming clean on this point and developing the issue of contra indicators which caused confusion.
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I would write less.
Dear Sirs, I parked in the dark at around 3am and saw the outline of a bay which having checked the nearby sign was free to park in at that time. Accordingly no contravention has occurred. Please cancel and refund both the PCN and the towing fee as there was no traffic management purpose to removal from this remote spot. Yours etc
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"advisement" ? Surely "consideration" fits better ?
Don't forget that there are no additional penalties for taking them to London Tribunals, because you have already paid all there is to pay.
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My draft!
Dear Parking Services,
I wish to make formal representations against both the Penalty Charge Notice and the subsequent removal of my vehicle.
On the morning of 27 June my vehicle was issued with a PCN for Contravention Code 01 before being removed approximately two hours later from Atlantis Avenue, E16.
I wish to challenge this PCN and the removal of my car by towing for some reasons
Firstly, I genuinely believed that I was parked within a valid parking bay. The location contains faded white bay markings which remain visible on the carriageway. As I arrived late, these markings appeared to indicate a legitimate parking place. The double yellow lines continue alongside what appears to be a series of old parking bays, creating an unclear and confusing road layout.
In addition, the parking signs in the vicinity did not clearly indicate, by way of directional arrows or other markings, where any parking bay began or ended. In the absence of clear termination markings or signage, I reasonably believed the faded bay markings remained valid. Had the restriction been clearly conveyed, I would not have parked there.
Also considering my arrival to the car park at 3am, the lack of light contributed to my confusion about these signs and marking. The subsequent towing of my car was also a disproportionate punishment as I was not obstructing any entrance, pedestrian walkway or other traffic flow.
I hope these considerations are taken into proper advisement. Thank you
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(crossed with stamfordman's post)
If you don't make representations to the authority(at this stage you are not appealing to the adjudicator), then you've lost your money.
If you make reps which are subsequently rejected, then you appeal to the adjudicator or you've lost your money.
So you must engage with this process to its conclusion.
You'll put your reps in your words, but post a draft first.
My post asks you to add the presence of the traffic sign to the mix(which you must have read otherwise even if you were in a parking place it could still have been restricted!).
So, IMO:
For the council's position: clear DYL;
For your position: conflicting indicators as to what restriction was in place. Bay markings ahead and to the side, albeit faded; traffic sign situated in line with where the council says the parking place begins but without an arrow indicating this whose absence in your mind confirmed it was situated within a multi-bay parking place inside which you were parked.
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You are not appealing at this stage. First you have to make representations to Newham.
Develop a draft here. There is nothing to lose so you may as well make them work for their money.
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Sorry, I’m a tad confused, are you asking me to add the third paragraph to my appeal too or you’re asking me not to appeal, sorry don’t want to get it wrong🥲
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I don't think that the worn bay markings are a shoo-in. The DYL are clear and terminated correctly behind you.
The council's position that you were parked outside a parking place and on DYL.
Your position is that you were parked within a bay indicated by prescribed markings to your left and in front and that these and the DYL were conflicting indicators.
I would also add that you saw the traffic sign to your rear and to your right and reasoned that because it did not contain an arrow, it did not mark the start of a parking restriction despite being placed exactly in line with markings but was of the form you would expect to find within a parking place, which is where it would be situated if you were in a parking bay.
You went for the parking place version of the conflicting indicators and got towed as a result.
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Yes as you will never see your money back otherwise.
Amendment - I should have written 'make representations to the council' rather than saying yes to your thought of Appealing. You have to have your representations rejected by the council before you can Appeal but rejection is highly likely.
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Thank you for this, so you advice I appeal?
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Thank you for the car pound documents. Councils often used to get these wrong but Newham's look to be correct to me so no grounds there.
Your best bet seems to be the bay markings and that it was dark at the time you parked. (It looks to me like the bay got shortened and although old markings are meant to be burnt off they are often simply painted over and they can wear or wash away).
Your tribunal appeal is that no contravention occurred due to the bay markings inviting you to park at that time. Towing you was also not proportionate but that would be a harder one to get an adjudicator to agree.
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https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1Y4AwxQdSX8qjTg3pIxrDLJGQ5l1Qx03W
Drive like
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I would like to see all other documents the car pound gave to you, include the back if not blank
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Incandescent has posted a series of Maps views.
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GSV pl.
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Council pics. Nothing showing any (possibly re-emerged) bay lines. Nothing on tow.
(https://i.ibb.co/PsGrR39w/n4.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/nMQqYXGy/n3.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/2045JLd6/n2.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/pB02LY4z/n1.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/4RXB7VhQ/n7.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/3YmPR0gY/n6.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/PvkjwNYn/n5.jpg)
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Thank you, do you think it’s solid grounds for an appeal, if not the PCN at the very least, the towing
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https://maps.app.goo.gl/5rtUepD1z8typc1M8
OK, bay markings worn, but markings like this are always claimed by councils as OK, so they are OK here, IMHO.
Bay here in 2020
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Q991M8KP3proVMjg9
All DYLs in 2018
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Nyi5es2h5p5824H5A
No GSV view for 2019
Clearly an error occurred when installing the bay.
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These are all my photos, the bay I was parked in is the empty one at the front with the DYL and bay markings
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Whose photos have you posted and if a mix could you please separate the council's from yours.
The DYL in one of the photos clearly terminates before the bay in which you were parked, a bay which appears to have a traffic sign within.
Pl post a GSV link.
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What a council balls-up ! A bay and also double-yellow lines. The two are totally incompatible.
As you have paid all there is to pay, you should appeal this all the way to London Tribunals where I am pretty sure you'd win and get your money back, but first you must submit representations to Newham, who will reject them, of course. You then register an appeal at London Tribunals at no extra cost to yourself. I suspect the council may then back down, but there's no guarantee on this.
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on 27 Jun 2027, I got to Atlantis Avenue at 2am, saw a bay marking but also a double yellow line that extended into the next bay, saw it as a viable parking spot as it was 2 am at the time and street signs read Mon-Fri 9am-6:30pm. I have parked several times in said spot with no issue and seen others do same. I came out at 1pm 27 Jun 2026 to find my car gone and upon investigation discovered it had been towed. Upon car retrieval, I noted that I had received PCN PN26255708 at 07:46am and my car was towed at 09:02 am. you will find from the pictures that I was not obstructing any turns or pedestrian crossings or curbs.
I am essentially writing to see if I have grounds for an appeal, as I feel the punishment of £360 to retrieve my car did not fit the contravention I had, which I did not actually know was a contravention because of the confusing markings. VRM: KP21UVC
(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#VZ7n756)(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#CMFlVM5)(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#MoIDS09)(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#ZhNbfPt)(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#UUJDEpw)(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#dymNKOX)(https://imgpile.com/p/wuK34AC#w8t2edl)
Location: https://maps.app.goo.gl/KXWBfZYReP16FtJH9
Photos in Drive:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1aijAHPZOmXy9vPsrD7KRZ87ClOuPFbm6